Why did Travis Tumlinson Fake the Stone Maps as a Hoax?

[sgtfda]

Joe I receive a 10% disability now for 2 gunshot wounds while serving on a swiftboat. I set up a appointment with a VCO for this issue. Thanks for the heads up.

 

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[Azquester]

"Monkey Mountain"

USAF Security Service? Ditty Bopper?

My Father was a Ham Radio ditty bopper so was my grandfather for the railroad. (Telegrapher) I just missed going to Nam by about a few months. I did see what it did to some of my friends that came back. Ugly. As if the mental anguish alone wasn't enough they were exposed to orange sunshine in country. We were so close to winning that war.

Like Iraq we pulled out to soon.

It very easily could have been my younger Brother and I going. Mentally I was ready but I don't think one can be totally ready for that type of situation. I was willing to
"Do my Duty for the Country" if need be. I still am. Although now by brothers and family have all passed on and it would be only me. They would still be there in spirit.

Sorry for your suffering. My Father had unstable Diabetes and never could get it under control. He died at 48 because of it. I see they have a new med out now that they claim can help you resist getting diabetes. I'm on one of them as an experiment. Repatha reduces bad cholesterol that runs in my family genomes. It works.

 

[EarnieP]

Thanks for the good info Bill. although I think you actually met to direct it to Joe.
If not, sorry, didn't mean to mislead you, I was not in Vietnam.
Did serve with some who had been on Monkey Mountain. Was wondering if Joe had done the same type work.
I'll check out that Repatha cholesterol med, thanks.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Joe I receive a 10% disability now for 2 gunshot wounds while serving on a swiftboat. I set up a appointment with a VCO for this issue. Thanks for the heads up.

Thanks for your service. I was USAF 1967-1971, a brother was Army Warrant officer flying copters in NAM for 3 tours, he was also in Desert Storm. He eventually died of cancers caused by agent Orange..
...

 

[nobodie]

I thank you for your sevice, you all deserve better than this.

 

[Loke]

I want to join the well-wishers - guys, my hat off to yall (ie all the Nam vets - actually _all_ vets). We are beholden to you - and a simple 'thank you' is not really enough, but it is all I have to give.

 

[Azquester]

Travis the man of many mysteries. He Created his own legacy by carving some maps no one would ever forget him that's for sure.
His story would be nothing with out those stone maps. Why do you think he needed them so badly? It's a tough sell for anyone to believe in him even though he was Peg Leg's grandson (Everyone back in the day was called peg leg if they had a wooden replacement.) and knew some of his old pa pa's secrets. A Gimmick for the fast lane into the inner circle of hunters.

He knew what he was doing. So what's real and what's fake? Since the Bunker went silent we have no more to discuss Travis has left the building. Or at the very least his family and Ryan have gone fishing. What can we do to further this conversation? Just like Travis to throw some fake maps at us and then leave us with no explanation.
Nothing can be proven even if the have some more material it's still the words of the family after the fact. Has anyone vetted these people being interviewed by Ryan?
Background checks are easy now and fairly cheap. If we as objective observers are expected to listen to any stories form the stand point of the family all of them are subject to scrutiny if we are to believe them at their word. Travis himself is to blame for that. He's the one that consciously decided to manufacture stone maps. I feel for the family in this situation Travis has thrown most of them under the bus before they were even born.

How can they rectify this? Prove it to us that he was sincere in his actions. Throw something out there for the public if your reading this. We want to know the truth.

 

[Weaversneedle]

If you had kept your mouth's shut and your ears open you and the rest of us would still be getting updates as to their progress . stop badgering them and maybe they will open up again.

 

[releventchair]

We have read a lot of Travis.
I've no interest in bothering his family for any reason ,least of all to question their integrity.. They are not him ,or responsible for his former actions.
Too , it would not encourage cooperation from others in non related research when such tactics are employed and word gets out to keep quiet for good reason.
Approach me and propose my being vetted you'll earn a hard ear real quick. By knowing that , I'm confident the family subjects here would have me vetted first...
Any one else here is welcomed to be vetted though! Good luck , and don't say anything. Bad as others saying things about you can be regardless of the truth ,"any thing you say can and will be used against you" if the right folks get a hold of it. The media is a good example , but it can be easier to present a record of their false account through documentation than someones tongue...
Gossip tabloids get sued for falseness , but falseness sells and is worth paying fines for.

Maps....
Those of Travis's possible creation vs others.
From what's known , questioning why make any if not certifiable or lacking provenance makes sense ; but from a certain perspective few live there may have been a reason few again caught in reading and seeing pictorial record..

I'm comfortable expecting an account to be presented in time for me to observe it.
Will it match my personal conclusion of why a map would be created by Travis if not credible? , Having not seen it it may well differ.
Would be better received if it at least parallels it but if not, oh well, I have a lot less vested in researching it and will still enjoy considering what is presented.

Who why how when and where.
In Travis case it may be better to answer those questions multiple times along his history , rather than once.
Same with any map(s) he possessed.
Multiple pursuits and/ or actions involving them from varied and different causes.

 

[Azquester]

If you had kept your mouth's shut and your ears open you and the rest of us would still be getting updates as to their progress . stop badgering them and maybe they will open up again.

If memory serves me correctly he left this forum to start his own moderated threads somewhere else and hasn't been back here since. So why would what we say on here have any bearing on what goes on over there? From what I understand it was things that happened over there that had forced his decision along with Joe Ribaudo's recommendation he stop posting anything. So go yell at Joe and Ryan for badgering the witnesses not I.

You and I both have the right to say whatever we want this is free speech country after all. I think that even if we all collectively asked pretty please Ryan wouldn't post anything more and actually doesn't care what we say on this forum. Go on that other site and ask them politely to start telling more about it. But, Telling them to Shut Up and listen won't get you very far.

 

[Weaversneedle]

If memory serves me correctly he left this forum to start his own moderated threads somewhere else and hasn't been back here since. So why would what we say on here have any bearing on what goes on over there? From what I understand it was things that happened over there that had forced his decision along with Joe Ribaudo's recommendation he stop posting anything. So go yell at Joe and Ryan for badgering the witnesses not I.

You and I both have the right to say whatever we want this is free speech country after all. I think that even if we all collectively asked pretty please Ryan wouldn't post anything more and actually doesn't care what we say on this forum. Go on that other site and ask them politely to start telling more about it. But, Telling them to Shut Up and listen won't get you very far.

True, we all have the right to run our mouths. All I'm saying is don't complain when you rile someone and they won't talk anymore. I don't know what went on with Joe ribaudo, all I know is what went on here. If you seriously don't know then go back and read some of your old post's. I'm thinking all the pleading in the world isn't going to get him talking again. I know if it were me I'd have been done long ago

 

[Azquester]

We have read a lot of Travis.
I've no interest in bothering his family for any reason ,least of all to question their integrity.. They are not him ,or responsible for his former actions.
Too , it would not encourage cooperation from others in non related research when such tactics are employed and word gets out to keep quiet for good reason.
Approach me and propose my being vetted you'll earn a hard ear real quick. By knowing that , I'm confident the family subjects here would have me vetted first...
Any one else here is welcomed to be vetted though! Good luck , and don't say anything. Bad as others saying things about you can be regardless of the truth ,"any thing you say can and will be used against you" if the right folks get a hold of it. The media is a good example , but it can be easier to present a record of their false account through documentation than someones tongue...
Gossip tabloids get sued for falseness , but falseness sells and is worth paying fines for.

Maps....
Those of Travis's possible creation vs others.
From what's known , questioning why make any if not certifiable or lacking provenance makes sense ; but from a certain perspective few live there may have been a reason few again caught in reading and seeing pictorial record..

I'm comfortable expecting an account to be presented in time for me to observe it.
Will it match my personal conclusion of why a map would be created by Travis if not credible? , Having not seen it it may well differ.
Would be better received if it at least parallels it but if not, oh well, I have a lot less vested in researching it and will still enjoy considering what is presented.

Who why how when and where.
In Travis case it may be better to answer those questions multiple times along his history , rather than once.
Same with any map(s) he possessed.
Multiple pursuits and/ or actions involving them from varied and different causes.

Keeping quiet for good reasons makes sense. Keeping quiet for bad reasons makes sense. Like shadow signs it depends on the angle you're viewing from.

It's obvious Mr G had permission from the family to release what he had and more as he stated so why he choose not to is his own reason. He knew his released information would be picked apart. After all he was the one that came on this forum to pick apart the Legends show piece by piece not so long ago. A debunker gone wild. His chickens have come home to roost.

Few living there at that time would be a good reason for no provenance . I'm sure there is some sort of documents that prove something about this. If those docs cannot be verified that makes it a bit complicated. That's when you only have someone's historical word to go by. It could be anyone. Years ago we had no decent way of checking a person's past history. Today it's an instant background check for criminal activity. Not that crime alone would make one a liar. Although Travis was convicted of crimes he went on to find a set of ancient stone maps he had nothing to do with making, at least he said so when he was alive. The family says different. At the same time they say he never lied. Figure that one out!

In the most mundane of jobs today one has to pass a background check. It only makes sense we make sure we're not dealing with a Crazy Jake family.

I think we're still dealing with a reporter / debunker. He set out to prove the Legends show was bogus. He set out to prove the Maps were fake which he did. He set out to burst everyone's stone maps ego bubble about the truthfulness of the maps which he did. Now he set his sights on the Family so who's to say he won't go after their integrity?

It's what he does after all.

I would dare say the Family should've vetted him.

So in this case Mr G. IS the media. He conducts the interviews and sets the story lines just like MSNBC would. So what we get is his edited version which may not be even close to resembling the truth as told by whomever. With that being said he might as well just feed the flame. We have no way on verifying it anyway so he could tell us it came from Mars. At least it would be a good story.

"MAN FINDS PERALTA STONE MAPS FROM MARS STORY AT TWO".

 

[Weaversneedle]

Keeping quiet for good reasons makes sense. Keeping quiet for bad reasons makes sense. Like shadow signs it depends on the angle you're viewing from.

It's obvious Mr G had permission from the family to release what he had and more as he stated so why he choose not to is his own reason. He knew his released information would be picked apart. After all he was the one that came on this forum to pick apart the Legends show piece by piece not so long ago. A debunker gone wild. His chickens have come home to roost.

Few living there at that time would be a good reason for no provenance . I'm sure there is some sort of documents that prove something about this. If those docs cannot be verified that makes it a bit complicated. That's when you only have someone's historical word to go by. It could be anyone. Years ago we had no decent way of checking a person's past history. Today it's an instant background check for criminal activity. Not that crime alone would make one a liar. Although Travis was convicted of crimes he went on to find a set of ancient stone maps he had nothing to do with making, at least he said so when he was alive. The family says different. At the same time they say he never lied. Figure that one out!

In the most mundane of jobs today one has to pass a background check. It only makes sense we make sure we're not dealing with a Crazy Jake family.

I think we're still dealing with a reporter / debunker. He set out to prove the Legends show was bogus. He set out to prove the Maps were fake which he did. He set out to burst everyone's stone maps ego bubble about the truthfulness of the maps which he did. Now he set his sights on the Family so who's to say he won't go after their integrity?

It's what he does after all.

I would dare say the Family should've vetted him.

So in this case Mr G. IS the media. He conducts the interviews and sets the story lines just like MSNBC would. So what we get is his edited version which may not be even close to resembling the truth as told by whomever. With that being said he might as well just feed the flame. We have no way on verifying it anyway so he could tell us it came from Mars. At least it would be a good story.

"MAN FINDS PERALTA STONE MAPS FROM MARS STORY AT TWO".

I guess you will have to wait until the TV show comes out to antagonize him now. Then you can be the debunker

 

[releventchair]

J.M.O..and a little of some one else's.
Besides , enough has been told.
What some are not willing to accept is more has been brought to light than in a long time thanks to those who divulged it.
Putting the thumbscrews to your source to try to get a better answer , when that source all ready told more than any one deserved; is a crazy in a not good crazy way idea.

A Tumilson answered something with a proposed question.( Find it , answer it ; and you have answered your original question Bill.)
I answered it and answered it wrong without fitting it to a fit in time. Then moved on to later recall that question again when another angle turned up that presented the same question again... but a different , although close.. answer some one else arrived at that would also explain it.
The answer to that question answers the original post on this thread if the O.P. is asking why would a stone be fabricated.
That answer fits forward and backwards in a time period but not by any means all of Travis's time periods. Basically an entire subject change.
If a snapshot collage was made of a particular day with the right realtime objects and characters the question is more easily answered. (Same for many questions maybe.)
Even without such obvious sight , the reason can be arrived at.
Only answers the question though , and ones that arise later that do not involve it's subject but that of treasure going forward ,to me anyway remain unresolved.

 

[Ponchosportal]

The "teller of truth" has gone silent.

Why?

1. He doesn't know the truth, or
2. His values/morals have changed.

hmm?

In the end will the truth be his truth or someone else's.

Does it matter any more?

 

[Roadhse2]

As an admitted outsider that will never search for the LDM....but do like to follow the story of the maps, Travis etc...

I also noticed the change from getting to the truth for all to see, to "sell" a book..."sell" a movie. Things quite quickly moved from quest to profit driven...will that change the outcome? No idea, but hope the facts remain with little fluff...

 

[Old]

Let’s break this down. The persona non grata works for a living in the entertainment business. It’s what pays his bills. It’s not a hobby, it’s a livelihood.

Most folks, if they are lucky, end up with a profession they enjoy. Hobbies alone can and do absorb loads of time and energy but they don’t pay very well. That’s why they are called hobbies. Jobs are what pays the bills. Sometimes you get to combine both and that works out nicely UNTIL they don’t work in harmony. When there is a conflict, the JOB has to take first priority. That doesn't mean for one second that anyone's integrity is compromised. It means the scope of the project has to change and be made into something reasonably saleable.

Now let’s consider this project and the target audience. The target audience is young adults to senior citizens. Outside of diehard Dutch Hunters, the average viewing audience does not have a frame of reference for this legend. And; believe it or not, they don’t have the patience or inclination to set through the time it would take to gain one.

So………there is only so much data and supporting evidence that can be “sold” (in great detail) as a made for TV production. An hour show provides about 27 minutes of story line. If you don’t capture the attention and get buy in from your target in about 7 minutes (or less) you are done. Click….gone to another easier, lighter material, entertainment piece. You must present your premise from the 5000 foot level, put it in context, and move on to the more drama/adventure type narrative. It’s an entertain product not a thesis for a doctorate.

Using our 27 minute per episode, it would take about three one hours shows, or three weeks, to provide all the background, factual data, introduce characters into the story line, and lay out the history leading up to ……….ta’ da……..”Travis Found the Stones”………. It’s a loser on holding the target’s attention and patience just to get to the basis of the show. No production company in their right mind is going to sign on for that kind of production.

Data, new info, evidence, do we have it? You betcha. By the cart loads. Interesting stuff. Is there supporting information or historic evidence for every new twist? Yes, there is. But it won’t be dissected at the level you would like on a made for TV reality/mini-series/documentary. That’s why you are seeing different formats discussed. The “show”, when aired, will have a different twist, new information and focus than those that have come before. But; the detail you seek will not be presented there. It can’t be. That level of detail and give and take will be discussed here, and I can’t wait to be a part of that discussion.

Pre-filming discussions on our part didn’t go over well. Unfortunate but; that’s understandable. We weren’t able to give you all the pieces of the story and that was not fair OR productive. But; that will change. If the production sells we can discuss it from now to forever. If it doesn’t sell there is still a ton of information collected to be dissected. That includes all the parts that would drive the average viewing public to tears with tedium and redundancy.

Once the “show” is in the can, we can spend all the time your heart desires discussing the minute details of every new piece of data or twist to the story and how they fit (or don’t fit). There will be a water shed of information and evidence, and something for everyone and every position on the story. But; you have to keep in mind our discussions here are not main stream. The fact that we actually enjoy spending weeks discussing the minutest of details puts us in a relative small group. Who knows, but I suspect it (the project) will add new enthusiasts here and perhaps in Apache Junction.

That's not a sell out, that's seeing reality and working with it. You either produce what the public wants, in the dosage they find acceptable, or you hide your message under a basket. Its a start on a new twist but by no means will the "production" be the full and complete story. Can't be. But; I'm sure the "hang em high" contingent will spin that reality in a negative way. So be it. There is plenty of space in this for the light attention group and those among us that want a little more meat with the potatoes.

Lynda

 

[cactusjumper]

Lynda,

Nice post. As I have stated, I personally have no problem with anyone making money off of the LDM/Superstition Mountain legends. Many of my friends have done that very thing. More power to those who can turn a profit from the stories.

Once again, I wish Ryan, Frank, the family and anyone else involved, the best of luck and financial success.

Take care,

Joe

 

[Azquester]

We weren’t able to give you all the pieces of the story and that was not fair OR productive.

We?

Anyway, You're all right. The Maps are Fake and that's all we need to know. Not much else has any meaning on the carved stones. It doesn't matter what his reason was. Travis and his faked stones are officially a dead subject.

Moving on...

 

[sgtfda]

Only you Bill would like your own post with your Ponchosportal 2nd name. It's like talking to yourself.