Raise your hand if you have found the Lost Dutchman Mine.

[nobodie]

Since I am parranoid about watching my back, I can't email you. Sorry.

 

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[nobodie]

The house in the canyon in the bushes that Holmes gave as a clue is in what waltz called 2nd water. There is a rose quartz out cropping near the LDM. Anyone else have something to say. Let's hear from you.

 

[EarnieP]

Where's John Ramses? 'Quest For Peralta Gold, A Hidden History of Red Mountain'
I was convinced years ago by his great online site, that he had found the LDM on Red Mountain.
Terrific pictures, but none of any gold that I remember. That picture of the Indian mountain with the three bags cinched it for me.
Is he still down in Australia?

Not quite as good as the original site but similar;
http://www.americandownunder.com/phantom/qgf/rense/montezuma.html

 

[torie517]

Hey

 

[torie517]

Hey

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Setting sun illuminates my mine
e
You can see the old military road from my mine, but you can't see my mine from the military road

no cowboy will ever find my mine

It is closed with logs made from iron wood


This is by nens complete but it shows you just how far off the lookers are

 

[markmar]

The Waltz clues are for two different mines of the same area . Some are for the funnel shaped shaft mine ( Peraltas/Apaches/Deerings/two soldiers/John Deer's father ) with the covered tunnel below , and the other for the outcropping which he last worked and is the LDM . Someone can distinguish the clues only if knows the region where are the mines .
I believe how I am among those who really know where this place is .

 

[EarnieP]

Setting sun iluminates my mine

You can se the old military road from my mine, but you can't see my mine from the military road

no cowboy will ever find my mine

It is closed with logs made from iron wood


This is b no means complete, but it shows you just how far off the lookrs are

Is there a source for an accurate map of the old 1880's 'military road', and/or 'roads'?
Did it skirt the edges of the Superstition, take a shortcut down thru the canyons, or both?

 

[cactusjumper]

Is there a source for an accurate map of the old 1880's 'military road', and/or 'roads'?
Did it skirt the edges of the Superstition, take a shortcut down thru the canyons, or both?

Earnie,

This is a prime example of why it's important to read, read, read! Many authors have done excellent research and have done the leg work for you. Dr. Glover published this map, I believe, in his first book on the LDM:



Being familiar with the Superstition Mountains through years of meandering through them, will also be helpful.

This is that Old Military Trail. While not visible in it's entirety, it can still be found all along its path through the Superstitions. By a strange coincidence it goes directly through the heart at the end of the Stone Map trail:



At the exact end of the Stone Map trail there is this:





Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Hal Croves]

Earnie,

This is a prime example of why it's important to read, read, read! Many authors have done excellent research and have done the leg work for you. Dr. Glover published this map, I believe, in his first book on the LDM:



Being familiar with the Superstition Mountains through years of meandering through them, will also be helpful.

This is that Old Military Trail. While not visible in it's entirety, it can still be found all along its path through the Superstitions. By a strange coincidence it goes directly through the heart at the end of the Stone Map trail:



At the exact end of the Stone Map trail there is this:





Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

cactusjumper,
Do you know exactly where the trail crossed the Salt?

 

[cactusjumper]

Hal,

There were a number of crossings at the Salt River. I'm at work right now, but with my poor memory, I believe there was one at Cottonwood Canyon, one very close to Fort McDowell, one south of Fort McDowell and one at Marysville. I would need to re-read Bourk's notes to see if there was one N/E of the Supe's. Believe there was a crossing around Tortilla Flat. I have a number of books that describe the places where the Mormon's crossed.

I will check into that when I get home.

Take care,

Joe

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Ladies & Gentlemen, this means it is obviously up on the westerly slopes in a depression and -------

 

[EarnieP]

Earnie,

This is a prime example of why it's important to read, read, read! Many authors have done excellent research and have done the leg work for you. Dr. Glover published this map, I believe, in his first book on the LDM:



Being familiar with the Superstition Mountains through years of meandering through them, will also be helpful.

This is that Old Military Trail. While not visible in it's entirety, it can still be found all along its path through the Superstitions. By a strange coincidence it goes directly through the heart at the end of the Stone Map trail:



At the exact end of the Stone Map trail there is this:





Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

Good suggestions. there are certainly endless amounts of interesting reading on the subject of the LDM. Problem is, you read one source and two more catch your attention that contradict the first one. And on it goes.
It does sound like you have a good handle on all this, any pictures of that elusive rosy quartz gold vein you'd care to share?

Thanks for the map, excellent.
I did find Tom Kollenborn's short essay on the Military Trails, also excellent.
http://www.angelfire.com/super2/johnskowronek/docs/Military_History.html
and
http://superstitionmountaintomkollenborn.blogspot.com/2009/11/military-trails.html

 

[nobodie]

Most books are good reading, but a lot of them complicate things. They throw their own opinion into the clues, they tell you about their adventures in the mountains but didn't find the LDM. Don't follow their mistakes, when they can't find the stated clues or they find only one clue they throw every thing else out. Their minds start making things up to their area to make it fit, but still no LDM.
Then they sell you a book. If you want to find the LDM just follow the Thomas clues if you can find them, the Holmes clues. The Holmes clues in the Browny Holmes manuscript has the same direction that Clay Worst gives in his lectures at the Superstition Mountain Museum , there are also dvds of the lecture. Keep it SIMPLE.

 

[nobodie]

Clay Worst had said that he was keeping the final clues to the LDM a secret, that he has a group in the mountains looking for him. You follow the Holmes clues as far as it takes you then you use the Thomas clues to the area of the mine. The three trees, the horses head. Now here's the what makes things complicated and people make it harder the area from Holmes clues to the end of Thomas's clues is less than half a mile. Enough said, I hope I didn't give away my area. No more from me, more stories please.

 

[cactusjumper]

Most books are good reading, but a lot of them complicate things. They throw their own opinion into the clues, they tell you about their adventures in the mountains but didn't find the LDM. Don't follow their mistakes, when they can't find the stated clues or they find only one clue they throw every thing else out. Their minds start making things up to their area to make it fit, but still no LDM.
Then they sell you a book. If you want to find the LDM just follow the Thomas clues if you can find them, the Holmes clues. The Holmes clues in the Browny Holmes manuscript has the same direction that Clay Worst gives in his lectures at the Superstition Mountain Museum , there are also dvds of the lecture. Keep it SIMPLE.

nobodie,

There is little doubt that some people don't have the ability to think for themselves or come to there own conclusions......based on the evidence and what they read, assuming they read at all. You glean what you can from every book you read. The discerning mind will separate the wheat from the chafe based on the experiences of others, and there own research in the field.

You have come to your own conclusions, that no one has found anything based on the fact that there is no evidence that you have seen. I have presented evidence that something was found back in the late 90s. Because you don't seem to put any faith in what has been written, I doubt you have made the effort to research the evidence. Those who don't read, ask where the evidence of Waltz's clues can be found. They don't realize that that information has been out there for years.

Can't make it any easier than that..

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[EarnieP]

nobodie,

There is little doubt that some people don't have the ability to think for themselves or come to there own conclusions......based on the evidence and what they read, assuming they read at all. You glean what you can from every book you read. The discerning mind will separate the wheat from the chafe based on the experiences of others, and there own research in the field.

You have come to your own conclusions, that no one has found anything based on the fact that there is no evidence that you have seen. I have presented evidence that something was found back in the late 90s. Because you don't seem to put any faith in what has been written, I doubt you have made the effort to research the evidence. Those who don't read, ask where the evidence of Waltz's clues can be found. They don't realize that that information has been out there for years.

Can't make it any easier than that..

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

A "discerning mind" is pretty much a subjective label, depending on the discernment of the mind doing the labeling.

 

[EarnieP]

cactusjumper,
Do you know exactly where the trail crossed the Salt?

On that other un-named site there is a good post on this subject listed under;
'Superstition Mountains History Discussion Old B/W Photo'
Dated Fri Sept 24, 2010, page 7
Answering a question from the late great Jim Hatt by Tom K (Kollenborn?).
In his reply, Tom K mentions;
(1.) The Old Crabtree Crossing,
(2.) The Davis Wash Crossing,
(3.) A "Crossing below McKay's Camp near Burnt Corral".

 

[Hal Croves]

On that other un-named site there is a good post on this subject listed under;
'Superstition Mountains History Discussion Old B/W Photo'
Dated Fri Sept 24, 2010, page 7
Answering a question from the late great Jim Hatt by Tom K (Kollenborn?).
In his reply, Tom K mentions;
(1.) The Old Crabtree Crossing,
(2.) The Davis Wash Crossing,
(3.) A "Crossing below McKay's Camp near Burnt Corral".

Thank you EarnieP,

T.E. Glover has done some great work tracking down these military maps and shares them in his newest book. What puzzles me is the fact that these trails converge at Mormon Flat (south side of river) but, they don't actually cross the Salt there. And there are no trails leading to MF from the north side of the river (that I am aware of). So, the idea of Mormon immigrants using that location as a river crossing has always confused me.

 

[EarnieP]

Hal, I just re-read Tom K's answer and to be more specific he said "there were only three main crossings that were safe" after the building of the Mormon Flat dam in 1925. Tom said there were "several" crossings before all the dams were built,.