1607 James VI/James I coin weight!!!

dirtdigger1581

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Jun 18, 2011
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I haven't been out metal detecting in just over a month. Due to the holidays and the family being sick I just haven't had the time to get out since the beginning of December. That being said, I headed out on Tuesday the 8th to a new field that I had just recently been given permission to hunt. It's a very large, roughly 200 acre, field that has seen revolutionary & civil war troop movement through it. I hoped it would hold a secret or two for me, and I wasn't disappointed.

Shortly after arriving in the field I had my first coin of the year. A 1910 wheat cent and I was very happy to add it to my collection. I didn't know I was about to find a piece of history 300 years older shortly thereafter. About 45 minutes after finding my first coin of the year I got nice 73/74 signal on my Teknetics T2 and pinpointed the signal. Four inches down is what the machine told me, so I dug my hole and plopped out the dirt. After scanning around a bit with my propointer, I was able to locate a square shaped token, or at least that's what I thought it was. The "token" had a circular wreath on it and inside the wreath was a crown with an "X" underneath it. It wasn't until last night, when I was able to clean it up a bit, that I discovered under the "X" was a letter "S". On the reverse of the coin I was able to clean the caked dirt enough to reveal what I thought was a cross, with a crown in the upper quadrant, and two shields in the side quadrants. In the right lighting at the bottom quadrant I saw a possible date of 16_7. This got my heart pumping, and I started taking photos.

I posted the photos up on here and other sites as well, hoping to get an ID on my "token". Within minutes I had people responding and helping me arrive to a conclusion. I had found a 1607 James VI/James I "Sword and Sceptre" coin weight. The sword and sceptre are crossed on the reverse side, with a crown in the upper quadrant, and two thistles on the sides. I owe a special thanks to the individuals who helped me ID my find. So, "Thank you very much" to: CRUSADER, Breezie, nhbenz, Battlecry4, Jeff in Georgia & Voriax!!! I'm always so impressed with the experts on these sites who are able to ID things that I can't even get a start on. Again, thank you!!!

I've included a picture of a 1602 "6 Scots" coin which was recognized in England and Wales as 10 shillings in 1603 when James VI became James I with the union of the Scotland and England crowns. That would be where the "X" comes from on the front side.
This is an example of the coin that this weight would have been measured against.

I have a smile on my face a mile wide right now, and knowing that these weights were used to weigh and measure gold coins, you can bet your "you know what" I'll be back out there looking for them soon!

Thanks for looking and Happy Hunting!

-Nate
 

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Upvote 9

HutSiteDigger

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Nov 26, 2012
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Amazing find... I've dug some very find 18th century coins down in you're area of Chesapeake but this right here is 17th century and is very historical importance when you find anything from the 17th century in Virginia not to say this is almost 16th century.. Again amazing find! :occasion14: :occasion14:
 

grasshopper

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Wow. Dont see to many finds like that popping up...awesome!!!!
 

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dirtdigger1581

dirtdigger1581

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Jun 18, 2011
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Amazing find... I've dug some very find 18th century coins down in you're area of Chesapeake but this right here is 17th century and is very historical importance when you find anything from the 17th century in Virginia not to say this is almost 16th century.. Again amazing find! :occasion14: :occasion14:

Thank you very much! I also have found some nice 18th century coins in this area, and even a 1693 spanish cob, but this is the oldest thing I've found yet! Not sure how much older it gets in this area. Considering Jamestown was settled in 1607, I'd say I'm right in the early days for this area. Who knows...Maybe there is older out there waiting to be found. I'm happy for now though!
 

CASPER-2

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CRUSADER

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As I stated on the What Is It, they only produced a 1602 dated version (although these were not made until at least 1603 when they were English legal tender), if you look carefully you will see the tail of the 2.

Another fact I forgot was it should be close to 78 grains = 5.05 grms. Therefore yours has lost a bit of weight but that is typical of a ground found example.

Its a great find & they are a bit of a mystery as to why they turn up in the US. Examples were found at James Town but the chances that these were used for there original purpose are slim to none. They must have been an early 'keepsake'.

If you had a way to record these I would expect that this unusual coin weight would be the first US recorded example.
 

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dirtdigger1581

dirtdigger1581

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As I stated on the What Is It, they only produced a 1602 dated version (although these were not made until at least 1603 when they were English legal tender), if you look carefully you will see the tail of the 2.

Another fact I forgot was it should be close to 78 grains = 5.05 grms. Therefore yours has lost a bit of weight but that is typical of a ground found example.

Its a great find & they are a bit of a mystery as to why they turn up in the US. Examples were found at James Town but the chances that these were used for there original purpose are slim to none. They must have been an early 'keepsake'.

If you had a way to record these I would expect that this unusual coin weight would be the first US recorded example.

Crusader, thanks for your replies and help on both posts. I see the 2 now, and will edit the posts tonight. As for now it's off to work. 1602!!! Even better.
 

Bill D. (VA)

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That is an awesome find Nate! It's not too unusual to find coin weights here in SE Virginia, but one that early is quite rare. A number of years ago my friend and I found 2 at one site that are about the same age as yours. I'm attaching pics FYI. In each pic both sides of the weight are compared to one from a website so you can see the similarities. I'm sure with a find like that there's gotta be some more early relics to be dug there. You should hit that site hard. Have you been able to confirm there was a house site there? Again, congrats on a super find ..... Bill

coinweight.jpg

coinweight3.jpg
 

hogge

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Very Kool! My brother found one last year. It has a Fleur de Le, (spell check :icon_scratch:) design on it. His has a date of 1757 I think, on it. Congrats..........Hogge
 

LinkHylian

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Damn that's so cool!!! You should be so proud of your find. Just think-Men sat around a campfire making deals and using that there token to finalize the transactions. Hands FILLED with gold have touched that token, lightly placing it on scales. Things ranging from furs, weapons to fire water have been sold with the aid of it.
I'm sure arguements have been waged as to its authenticity and proper weight back in the day.
Imagine the amount of relief varias people have had when they've seen that brought out to assist in a transaction. I sure as hell wouldn't have wanted to "eye ball" my gold/items back in the day!!!
 

Gunrunner61

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Jan 12, 2011
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A very cool find indeed...............AWESOME!!!.................HH
 

CRUSADER

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That is an awesome find Nate! It's not too unusual to find coin weights here in SE Virginia, but one that early is quite rare. A number of years ago my friend and I found 2 at one site that are about the same age as yours. I'm attaching pics FYI. In each pic both sides of the weight are compared to one from a website so you can see the similarities. I'm sure with a find like that there's gotta be some more early relics to be dug there. You should hit that site hard. Have you been able to confirm there was a house site there? Again, congrats on a super find ..... Bill

View attachment 724377

View attachment 724378

Those types are relatively common (pretty sure I have those) compared to this one. I'm willing to bet that no-one has had this type in the US. I'm basing it on the fact that none have been recorded on either of the British; UKDFD or PAS databases.
 

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CRUSADER

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Crusader, thanks for your replies and help on both posts. I see the 2 now, and will edit the posts tonight. As for now it's off to work. 1602!!! Even better.

Its not better as such, as I say the date only refers to the coin it was weighing & not when the weight was made & they didn't start making them until 1603 & when they finished is anyones guess. (probably about 10 years worth)
 

Silver Searcher

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Great find :thumbsup: One of the richest series of gold coins known to us came into being under James VI. Counting fractional pieces, it consisted of eleven coins with seven different designs. The series began in 1575 with the "twenty pound piece" of about 30 grams Your coin weight for the Gold Coin were Issued from 1601-1604, "Sword and scepter" after the reverse design, this coin marked the end of the series. Being that this coin was only issued for three years, is proberbly why the coin weights are few and far between.

SS
 

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dirtdigger1581

dirtdigger1581

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Jun 18, 2011
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That is an awesome find Nate! It's not too unusual to find coin weights here in SE Virginia, but one that early is quite rare. A number of years ago my friend and I found 2 at one site that are about the same age as yours. I'm attaching pics FYI. In each pic both sides of the weight are compared to one from a website so you can see the similarities. I'm sure with a find like that there's gotta be some more early relics to be dug there. You should hit that site hard. Have you been able to confirm there was a house site there? Again, congrats on a super find ..... Bill

Thanks Bill! I have every intention of heading back to that area and hitting it very hard. As for house sites, there is a map from the mid 1800's that confirms one house in the nearby area, but probably 300-400 yards across the field from where I found this. I'd love to know how it got out there. I appreciate your pics as well. Thanks for looking and commenting.
 

hamiddetecting

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Fix

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Now that is cool. What a great find! Congrats!
 

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