Detecting National Forest Lands

[cutty]

Hi
I'm new around here but have been MD'ing since the 80's. Actually just dusting off the old Spectrum and chomping at the bit to get back out there. Anybody know the laws concerning TH'ing in National Forests? Thanks in advance.
Cutty

[mole]

This is the answer I got here in PA.


-My question to them

Just wondering if recreational metal detecting is allowed in the Allegheny
National Forest. It is a hobby of mine and I will be in the area this
summerand would like to know what the rules are. Any information would be
appreciated.


-Their answer.....

No permit is required for casual one-person use of a metal detector on the
Forest. However, anything found that is over 50 years old is subject to
the Antiquities Act, which prohibits the disturbance of artifacts. Even
digging something up to see what it is, is a potential violation of the law
with a possible penalty of up to six months in prison and a $5,000 fine.
Any further questions please feel free to email me back or give us a call
at (814) 723-5150. Thank you for your interest.

[Born2Dtect]

Mole,
I will probably hunt the area you mentioned sometime this year. Who did you ask this question of? It sounds a bit odd.

Ed

[godisnum1]

I'd like a response to this question, but rather in reference to Forest areas in Missouri and Florida


Bran <><

[Jeffro]

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...c,39163.0.html

Something all of us might be interested in.

[kronos416]

This is the answer I got here in PA.


-My question to them

Just wondering if recreational metal detecting is allowed in the Allegheny
National Forest. It is a hobby of mine and I will be in the area this
summerand would like to know what the rules are. Any information would be
appreciated.


-Their answer.....

No permit is required for casual one-person use of a metal detector on the
Forest. However, anything found that is over 50 years old is subject to
the Antiquities Act, which prohibits the disturbance of artifacts. Even
digging something up to see what it is, is a potential violation of the law
with a possible penalty of up to six months in prison and a $5,000 fine.
Any further questions please feel free to email me back or give us a call
at (814) 723-5150. Thank you for your interest.


I asked about detecting the Allegheny National Forest and they gave me the exact response as you ..

[Tom_in_CA]

Hey Mole, I like that. So, let's say you find a 51 yr. old wheat penny. Since the mere act of metal detecting, as they say, is not forbidden, then what? I guess it's an honor system, and your own math skills at stake?

BTW, in the way you phrased your question: "is recreational metal detecting allowed?" Try it this way next time: "Is there anything that prohibits recreational metal detecting?". The way you worded it, it's almost like you're asking their permission. I mean, they can answer your question "no, just because we said so", or "no because we think you'll leave holes" or whatever. But asked the other way, puts it in context of them having to know that it is specifically addressed in writing, already.

We always want to ask if there is anything prohibiting md'ing, not "can I metal detect" or "can I have permission" etc... The latter puts them in a position to just say "no", without having a specific code, merely because their image is geeks with shovels.

[teverly]

They do not prohibit recreational detecting,but if you read what it says digging is prohibited.
So you would not even know if what you found is 50 yrs old or not.And the last time people asked i believe the park services defines digging as any disturbance of the topsoil.So even if you were just using your foot to scrape the surface you would be in violation.
Also from the cases that have i have read about they will confiscate your equipment,your car ect... and the cost of getting them back is just not worth it.
Again,this is the federal government.So 1 person may tell you one thing and someone else may tell you different....and then you have to woryy about how the rangers will interpret the law...

[Tom_in_CA]

teverly, what adds misery to all this, is when you get to a specific locale, where someone has been detecting since before the dawn of any of this came about. I mean, someone who, even as early as the 1970s, started detecting massive state parks. Hundreds of campsites, endless acres of usage over the past 100 yrs. In the 1970s, it never even dawned on them/us that one needed to even be aware of such things. I mean, afterall we reasoned, it's a public park right?

And as the years progressed, those doing so never heard/hear so much as a "boo". Now all of the sudden, in the 2000s, even though they've never been bothered, despite detecting in front of anyone and everyone, someone on a forum tells them they're doing something wrong? So they're faced with asking a ranger, and getting a "no" (from a ranger who probably never previously cared, but now has to look it up), or just ignoring forums like this, and leaving good enough alone? Wierd. I guess in their mind, they might think "why stop? I mean, had they not read a forum, they'd have never have known to even think something was amiss?

A friend of mine was one of the early people to run into a "wise" ranger. It was at Pinnacles National Monument. This was about 1980 or '81, not long after the 1979 ARPA revisions had come out. Some ranger saw him detecting, and came out to boot him. (no no, not confiscations, jail, etc.. a simple "scram", imagine that). My friend said "says who?" "why?" etc... The ranger stammered, heed and hawed, and said he'd be right back with the code. Awhile later he returned with some books, and showed my friend the 1979 ARPA wording. I don't think they got too deep into the meaning of the wording, but, as you know, it mostly concerns itself with indian stuff. So my friend objected: "The indians here had no refined metals, I'm not finding, nor can I find, any indian stuff, even if I wanted to!" My friend told him that he was, it turns out, leaving right then, but that he'd be back the next day to continue metal detecting. He told the ranger that if the ranger thought there was really anything wrong, that he was welcome to come issue a ticket at noon the next day. The next day my friend was back out detecting, and never saw a soul. No ranger, no one talked to him, etc.. Was that a wise idea for my friend to do? I dunno. Things were in their infancy then, and it seemed odd for anyone to tell us we couldn't look for modern silver coinage. I'm just reporting a true incident

[George (MN)]

They tell you you can pick up coins on the surface if they are under 50 years old, but they might still say that person was wrong, or even use the ESP laws where they imprison people based on what they claim the person was intending to do. "Intent & conspiracy" to dig & steal 1 of a kind priceless antiquities of huge value. Then they may force detectorists caught to pay for several thousand $$$ worth of ads in newpapers saying turn in looters of priceless rare artifacts.

Metal detecting in National Parks, they said if they even see a fully assembled detector inside a vehicle, they would charge intent & conspiracy to steal.

Two guys were detecting in TX I think on Corps of Engineers land with permission, but some other Fed comes along & claims they're detecting too close to a demolished fort, so they're charged with intent to steal priceless relics and were told they'll be lucky to see daylight again.

Another time 2 people wanted to detect a ghost town in a National Forest & were told go ahead, but please draw a map of where it is (so they could later kick them out & get the rest). They also invaded at least 1 of their houses & took everything that might possibly have been found detecting.

Always remember that in The Land of the Formerly Free the imprisonment rate is 5 times the average country & 60% were non-violent offenses. Even if they don't put you in prison they can steal way more than your finds. George (MN)

[RON (PA)]

I was always told to stay away and don't even ask about the laws. If they suspect that you even have a detector in the car, they can bend their rules and confiscate your equipment. With all that land that is supposedly public recreation areas, it does not seem fair, but then again, it is the government. I would not chance it. They can bend their rules so quick, it will make you head spin. Just my two cents.

[kakcsdad]

i dont know if it is the same but i have stayed in a few corp of engineer parks and asked the park ranger if it was ok to hunt and they said no problem just cover the holes back up...

[fortbball9]

I know that in my area in Va. there are two places that you can MD in the National Forest and that is at two of the lake that have beach area where you can swim.Only the sand is where you can dig.No MD'ing in the woods at all.

fortbball9