dents run treasure

[Maggie May]

A few other things about the story have me puzzled over the years. If they were coming from St. Marys, my home town. They would have had several ways to get here. The old Dents Run Rd. comes to the gate at upper Dents. The Elk Cameron line is there. Or they could have come from St. Marys from the Bucktail trail in to Hicks Run, also Cameron/Elk county line . The could have come down from Caledonia down now 555. Whatever way they came by most of the accounts the men who walked to Dents Run took an entire day. Whichever way they came they would have come to a town before the got to Dents Run. They would have come to Grant or Benezette from Caladonia. If the came through Hicks Run they would have stopped at Hicks. From upper Dents they would have come to Wilmer, unless the came from upper Dents, up over Dark Hollow and then down Bell Draft. Back then the area was much more populated than now. It is difficult to believe they didn't find anyone while making the day long walk. Years ago there was a small piece of the gold found in a creek. I'll try to remember where it was found. This makes me want to go and look again.

 

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[starsplitter]

Been a while since I've done any research on this tale as I've relocated. Something I discovered which may be of interest regarding Connors (sp?)... there is an actual enlistment document for a Connors in the PA archives. Of course there was more than one Connors who enlisted from PA. However, a Connors family lived in a community SW of Dent's (names, etc. match from 1860 census data). Directionally, this dovetails with the supposed Pinkerton find, the discovery of mules, and (if I remember correctly), what sftfda related to me (his take on it). Sftfda, you may correct me if I'm wrong - it has been at least a couple years since we spoke on the phone. Actually, if I'd remained in Ohio, I'd have done a bit more research on that family. Supposing the legend is true (kind of hard to tell since all the relevant Pinkerton material either went up in smoke during the Chicago fire or "mysteriously disappeared" - I can attest that there is nothing in the National Archives on this), it would make sense for the prime suspect to first head home with at least some of his gains. If I were in his position, if possible, I'd do same. Familiar territory to make a deposit. Just a thought.

 

[schieftain]

A few other things about the story have me puzzled over the years. If they were coming from St. Marys, my home town. They would have had several ways to get here. The old Dents Run Rd. comes to the gate at upper Dents. The Elk Cameron line is there. Or they could have come from St. Marys from the Bucktail trail in to Hicks Run, also Cameron/Elk county line . The could have come down from Caledonia down now 555. Whatever way they came by most of the accounts the men who walked to Dents Run took an entire day. Whichever way they came they would have come to a town before the got to Dents Run. They would have come to Grant or Benezette from Caladonia. If the came through Hicks Run they would have stopped at Hicks. From upper Dents they would have come to Wilmer, unless the came from upper Dents, up over Dark Hollow and then down Bell Draft. Back then the area was much more populated than now. It is difficult to believe they didn't find anyone while making the day long walk. Years ago there was a small piece of the gold found in a creek. I'll try to remember where it was found. This makes me want to go and look again.

The written account I have says they followed the road running beside West Creek, heading toward Emporium. On the evening of the second day out of St. Marys, they came to a fork where a road came in from the south. Here there was an old sawmill and some slab-sided shacks, (possibly Truman?). The road they then took "followed a stream later known as Brunner Brook".

If you look at maps from that period, current Rt 120 was not there. The main road to Emporium followed the same route as the railroad (West Creek Road). There may have been a logging road at Truman that wouldn't appear on the maps from back then, they didn't show all the smaller roads like a current topo map. But, the account says they followed Brunner Brook On a topo map, Brunner Hollow is a couple of miles further east than Truman. Was there a road that followed Brunner Brook? (There isn't even a trail there today on the topo.) Is this where they turned south? This route would likely connect with the road to Hicks Run. Moore Hill Road definitely connects today, but it doesn't follow a stream, so it doesn't match the account, and I don't know if it was there in 1865.

OR...they could have turned south at Truman (wasn't called Truman then), and followed present Rt. 120 along Big Run, turning south if they found a trail that took them up/over the mountain that brought them down closer to Dent's Run and Bell Draft.

Eventually, they got lost and tried to go off-road. Most people agree that at this point, having wagons, they would have kept to the ridge-tops since the creek bottoms were swampy, rhododendron jungles, impossible for wagons to pass. There are no records of them making it as far as Hicks Run, or Dent's Run. Not sure Wilmer was there in 1865. Most of those town did not really exits until the 1880s I believe during the logging/coal boom. None of them are shown on the 1872 PA Atlas, or any maps before then. Many artifacts that have been found (gun parts, wagon remnants, crates, gold) were on the ridge above Bell Draft, and near upper end of Bell Draft. Dennis' site (where bottles, bullets were found) is just outside of Dent's Run.

 

[sgtfda]

If you look at a topo you can see the ridgel line trail from St Mary's to the ridge where the wagons were abandoned above Schaffer Draft. I walked the ridge line. That's how I found the wagon site. Searching SW from that point on the county border found the gun parts. I just followed the story and it worked for me. If they were following a SW heading the would run right into Bell Draft then head south. There is a old trail on the east side of Bell draft heading south from the ambush site and county border . Rough going and many hiding places. I have the cords from the map owned by the fellow ego found 2 bars. They were found about 300 yards east of the ambush site. Every place I dug up there I hit rock couple inches down Jeff. I think even the backhoe would have trouble up there. Lots of caves and ledges though.
Ah the cool days I spent back there. Not like the Superstitions. A month ago went on a little trip with my prospecting club 118 degrees. Not doing that again until it cools off.

 

[kudo623]

I personally don't think that these guys got very far with the gold, especially if they were loaded to the gills on mules and hit the gorge. The story in my mind tends to discount the purported hijack and that it was an inside job. Based on the Pinkerton accounts these guys didn't know where they were going and got lost. If they were locals this would not be the case. Back then any one man could live on 2 bars comfortably for the rest of his life, so why not bury the load and ride out faster on horseback? If so then SGTFDA is correct in focusing on crevices/caves/etc because its all rock up there.

 

[starsplitter]

"Pinkerton accounts..." Respectfully... what Pinkerton accounts? There is nothing referenced in the Pinkerton records at the National Archives about any investigation of Dent's Run (directly or indirectly). Unless such records were destroyed in the Chicago fire, or stolen (convenient not to mention difficult), the documentation does not appear to have ever existed. My above comment relates to evidence I've held in hand, but it is not conclusive by any stretch.

 

[kudo623]

"Pinkerton accounts..." Respectfully... what Pinkerton accounts? There is nothing referenced in the Pinkerton records at the National Archives about any investigation of Dent's Run (directly or indirectly). Unless such records were destroyed in the Chicago fire, or stolen (convenient not to mention difficult), the documentation does not appear to have ever existed. My above comment relates to evidence I've held in hand, but it is not conclusive by any stretch.

With everything here the common header on the facts is: 'the story goes like this': There are different accounts but the common thread is that the Pinkerton found 2 1/2 gold bars found under a tree stump, and the two mules (Army branded) in the possession of a man who found them wandering around in the woods.

 

[starsplitter]

kudo623... I am not arguing that circumstantial or indirect evidence does not count. It does. I located an unknown 18th century French trading post along the Ohio by combining primary evidence and legend. The "common thread" mentioned is not documented - it is legend, not fact grounded in primary evidence. The idea that Pinkerton found gold bars, two branded mules, let alone was hired to investigate a theft of this magnitude with zero documentation to the effect is shaky at best. Perhaps others have found primary evidence, but so far none (except possibly Connors enlistment) has come to light. For example, it is strange to me that searching state and national archives as far away as California turns up nothing, while a supposed (yet never republished) treasure magazine article from decades ago holds all the answers. I love a treasure story as much as the next guy and have on many occasions followed up on local legends (one of which eventually led to the French station for example), but if investing serious time and money in an adventure it should at least be grounded in hard evidence. Yes, I enjoyed the research and my multiple trips to the Dent's Run area and the legend - it's great stuff. On the other hand, I want to be honest with myself about it - there is no solid primary evidence. Even if anything does exist and this is the treasure cover-up of the century, additional bars will either be discovered by pure accident or by some guy methodically covering ground for months or years. Most likely, years. With all the above said, I do think that the Connors link to the family homestead SW of Dent's is worth a follow up. At least it would be grounded in primary evidence (enlistment, land, tax, census records). This in turn might lead to something else of substance or narrow the search area.

 

[starsplitter]

Kudo623... incidentally, thank you for the civil discourse on the subject.

 

[starsplitter]

Yes, there is an old logging RR grade there that goes up to the county line/gas line and past it to the site of an old logging camp. It was a spur of the Dent's Run RR and is now part of a DCNR trail. We found railroad artifacts there. The whole area was probably clear-cut around turn-of-the-century.

The guy who was writing the book is the same guy who found wagon remnants and some other items. I have had several conversations with him also. Some people say he's the one who found the gold bar, but he denies it. He also believes he found the Lieutenant's grave, and claims to have something belonging to the LT.

The officer in charge was supposedly living in Missouri before the war. The guide, Connors, was inducted into the Army and not allowed to be discharged. He was sent out west after the war, and died in Fort Yuma, AZ, in the 1880s. Photo below is from the Presidion National Cem in S.F. They moved the graves from Yuma to the Presidio when the fort was abandoned. Doesn't mean it's the same James Conners/Connors. That was a pretty common name.

Yes, the story has holes, but also lots of small, seemingly insignificant details that are true. It's the big names and details that are wrong. Why would this be? Why would the big details that can easily be checked-out be wrong, and small historic details true? If someone was just making this up wouldn't you get your main facts straight and mess up on the little ones? It could be fiction, but somebody sure put a lot of detail into it. I think I can date it to at least the early 1930s. Anybody found an older version?

Why would some gold be hidden under a stump? Maybe they tried to lighten the load. Take some now, hide the rest and come back later?

The Conners who lived and enlisted in PA is the best bet. Dennis is aware of this individual. I've seen the documentation. He is real. Whether or not he is "the" Conners or if his existence lends any real weight to the legend is opinion.

 

[kudo623]

The Conners who lived and enlisted in PA is the best bet. Dennis is aware of this individual. I've seen the documentation. He is real. Whether or not he is "the" Conners or if his existence lends any real weight to the legend is opinion.

I'm not interested in myths either but we got some credible people here on this site who have done a lot of research and leg work and homework on this treasure story and have found artifacts and verified it to fit with this story. I don't have to speak for them, and you mentioned one of them already who spent what maybe 10 years on this one? He's got to know something right? Additionally, there is a person here who has credible information on a person who holds one of the bars. Of course not to mention the 3-5 skeletal remains which were found up there. So there is some direct evidence that something did happen up on that mountain practically in the middle of nowhere to lend a lot of credence to this story for one to believe it to be true.

 

[starsplitter]

kudo... thank you for your response. I tried to send you a private message.

 

[FinderKeeper]

Hi Kudo, Ya we are still trying to get this site dug up. I was on site yesterday and all looks good. We been working in Nova Scotia drilling and digging and plan to return again in Oct. We been working at our other sites in Pa. getting ready for something BIG we have in the works. I am sure someone will be digging at the Dents Run site before it snows. Its been 9 years and its time for DCNR to allow a dig or I will show and tell everything on National TV News soon. Please don't ask me what up I can not talk about it now.

 

[kudo623]

Hi Kudo, Ya we are still trying to get this site dug up. I was on site yesterday and all looks good. We been working in Nova Scotia drilling and digging and plan to return again in Oct. We been working at our other sites in Pa. getting ready for something BIG we have in the works. I am sure someone will be digging at the Dents Run site before it snows. Its been 9 years and its time for DCNR to allow a dig or I will show and tell everything on National TV News soon. Please don't ask me what up I can not talk about it now.

OK, I stand corrected 9 years, hopefully this will be the last year. Thanks for the update Dennis, hope you can dig it all up, including the silver. There's a lot of history here to be uncovered and I admire your tenacity to find it and uncover it at Dents Run!

 

[schieftain]

I'm not interested in myths either but we got some credible people here on this site who have done a lot of research and leg work and homework on this treasure story and have found artifacts and verified it to fit with this story. I don't have to speak for them, and you mentioned one of them already who spent what maybe 10 years on this one? He's got to know something right? Additionally, there is a person here who has credible information on a person who holds one of the bars. Of course not to mention the 3-5 skeletal remains which were found up there. So there is some direct evidence that something did happen up on that mountain practically in the middle of nowhere to lend a lot of credence to this story for one to believe it to be true.

I tend to agree with Starsplitter on all this. I find things about the story that have the "ring of truth" to them, but have not seen any hard evidence. The skeletal remains are part of the story, but is there any physical evidence of this? Are there any newspaper archives from the region that mention this discovery? If you search the old county histories, most of which were published in the 1880s, there is nothing about this legend– either as a "real event" or just as folklore, nothing about skeletons being found. Most of the artifacts I've heard of are not conclusive as evidence, but could be from hunters, loggers, or homesteaders in the area. There were people living/hunting in the area, and logging was happening in the area. Even if you find bottles, or cartridges, or gun parts, or wagon parts from the right vintage. How do you know they are from the patrol? There were also gangs of deserters roaming and hiding out in the woods making trouble for the draft officers.

 

[orion024]

FYI

I have a question, I have heard that the gold bars were interlocking, so they didnt slide around. A fellow named Gordon had a store in Dents run and said about this. Is this true?

 

[starsplitter]

chieftain... I truly wish there was more evidence. However, I've been to the archives, gone through local historical and court records in PA and across the country and found nothing. I thought if nothing else, maybe I could turn enough to write a short e-book. No dice. While I may have missed it, to my knowledge no objective primary evidence exists to support the legend. Nothing adds up. Would love to eat crow on this, but doubt I will. I applaud those who have stuck with this story - it is a real historical romance of sorts.

As I've mentioned to kudo623... it would dramatically narrow the search for evidence and possibly develop into a credible treasure lead to follow through with the name Connors/Conners in census records from 1850, 1860, and 1870 with a focus on geography. There was a Connors family in the census in, if I remember correctly, Clearfield County. This would have been my final avenue had I not tried to cut my losses and pursue things elsewhere. I did, however, follow it up enough to see it was a verifiable indirect lead. Most of all, it made sense (based upon the legend and plain old human behavior). I am sure that anyone can find the above within an hour of logging on to ancestry.com. And, I would say in a day or two of boots on the ground in Clearfield and with a little help from google earth, one could be surveying the 1860 Connors farm.

Good luck. Great story.

 

[starsplitter]

orion... as best as I could determine, the bars wold have originated in California. I searched records there. Nothing specific to link with the legend. In any case, to answer your question, I would think that unless they were recast in Wheeling they would have arrived in PA same condition as they left CA. The only additional treatment may have been the pitch treatment (per legend). Just my humble opinion.

 

[kudo623]

I tend to agree with Starsplitter on all this. I find things about the story that have the "ring of truth" to them, but have not seen any hard evidence. The skeletal remains are part of the story, but is there any physical evidence of this? Are there any newspaper archives from the region that mention this discovery? If you search the old county histories, most of which were published in the 1880s, there is nothing about this legend– either as a "real event" or just as folklore, nothing about skeletons being found. Most of the artifacts I've heard of are not conclusive as evidence, but could be from hunters, loggers, or homesteaders in the area. There were people living/hunting in the area, and logging was happening in the area. Even if you find bottles, or cartridges, or gun parts, or wagon parts from the right vintage. How do you know they are from the patrol? There were also gangs of deserters roaming and hiding out in the woods making trouble for the draft officers.

Testimony is direct evidence, that is to say if sgtfda said he found gun parts we don't have to see them, The skeletons the mules the spent cartridges Dennis found as well as other stuff, the GPL hits of Gold/silver at Dents Run. Again, these are all testimony substantiated with dates, times, locations, and some artifact proof as well. Of course where's the gold? Well maybe if the DCNR would have let our friend dig the question would be academic? I've never been up there and so I'm going to believe those who have and found and saw. Oh by the by i found a James Connors in 1870 Benezette census

 

[schieftain]

Testimony is direct evidence, that is to say if sgtfda said he found gun parts we don't have to see them, The skeletons the mules the spent cartridges Dennis found as well as other stuff, the GPL hits of Gold/silver at Dents Run. Again, these are all testimony substantiated with dates, times, locations, and some artifact proof as well. Of course where's the gold? Well maybe if the DCNR would have let our friend dig the question would be academic? I've never been up there and so I'm going to believe those who have and found and saw. Oh by the by i found a James Connors in 1870 Benezette census

View attachment 858690

Agree, testimony is evidence if it's direct.
But the skeletons and mules are not direct testimony.
The finding of both are only in the story, with no verification other that the story itself.
The story can't verify itself.
No-one has re-discovered the skeletons recently.

Physical Evidence:
With all respect, I don't doubt the word of Frank or Dennis, just the credibility of the artifacts.

How can you verify that a cartridge casing is from the patrol? Even if it's from the right period?
Dennis's site is right outside the village of Dent's Run, along an old wagon road that has been used by people since the 1800s.
Anyone could have dropped that cartridge back then. Or...
People hang onto guns for a long time. It could have been from an old gun someone was hunting with 30-50 years later.
I currently hunt with a shotgun I've had for 35 years.
I hunt deer with a .30-.30 that was made 50 years ago.
A cartridge from 1863 vintage, does not prove the patrol was there.

Gun parts (found by Frank miles away from Dennis's site).
How do you know that these also aren't from hunters? That area was hunted in the 1860s.
The area where Frank found gun parts is not far from a logging camp site where scores of men worked, how do you know they aren't gun parts from someone who was at that camp?

I'm not saying any of these things aren't from the patrol, but they don't prove anything conclusively.
In court, these wouldn't hold up as evidence.

I hope I don't sound argumentive. Just debating.

Question:
If you go by the story. Connors was inducted into the army and sent west to Fort Yuma where he died.
How can he be on a census from Benezette in 1870?