Can anyone help with information
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  1. #1

    Feb 2013
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    All Types Of Treasure Hunting

    Can anyone help with information

    If anyone can help with information on this porcelain container it is appreciated it is signed Roth on the bottom with the number 7880
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  2. #2
    Charter Member
    us
    Jun 2006
    Upstate South Carolina
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    Nice piece!.Don't know the size, but I would say early 1900 ladies powder box?
    jtw1313, AARC and ANTIQUARIAN like this.
    We are in a hobby that is supported by losers!!

  3. #3

    Feb 2013
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    All Types Of Treasure Hunting

    Thanks

    It’s about 5 by 5 inches
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  4. #4
    Charter Member
    us
    Ron

    Feb 2007
    Fort Worth'ish
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    I think it is by Ardalt.

    Maybe post it here:
    Porcelains/Ceramics/Pottery
    or put the word porcelain in the title to get more views.

    Similar on the right track

    https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...nged-242561999
    Last edited by RW; Jan 14, 2020 at 06:22 PM.

  5. #5
    Charter Member
    us
    Cat teaches man, not everything here serves him.

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    I tried the search "Limoges porcelain flower box".
    Got a few hits, then tried "Roth porcelain flower box".
    Under images, you'll possibly get a lot of pottery pot,
    keep scrolling down, you'll start seeing Roth porcelain flower boxes.

    I saw a round one, similar to yours, but didn't see a square one, yet.
    Good Luck!
    Yesterday is history, tomorow a mystery. All we have is the here and now, it's a special gift. That's why we call it "The Present"

    Pity the poor agnostic dyslexic insomniac who lies awake at night wondering if there really is a Dog.

  6. #6
    gb
    Dec 2019
    Surrey
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    It is indeed a trinket box, sometimes known as a ladies dresser box. It’s a pretty crude mark that looks like it was made on the master for the mould and my guess (only a guess) is that it’s ‘for’ (not ‘by’) the John H Roth Company of America. Roth sold his equity in in the Wheelock Pottery of Indiana and went into business under his own name in 1909 as an importer and wholesaler of pottery commissioned from the actual producers. I believe the company still exists today.

    The thing about John Roth’s pottery is that is has no particular style. He shrewdly took whatever he could get from wherever he could get it if the price was right and he thought it would sell. Much of it was fancy decorative ware in European styles, and he sold everything from Staffordshire dinner services to German beer steins, plus everything from high quality porcelain to mass produced Nipponware from Japan. Quality pieces carry one his marks proper under the glaze and are co-marked with the actual manufacturer. I suspect the crude mark is for a factory with multiple customers to identify the customer who commissioned the mould and may have been supplemented on the finished piece with an adhesive foil label that may no longer be present. Most of it also carries a 4 digit style number. I would guess it came out of a Japanese factory as a copy of a French or German porcelain style and may not be particularly old.

    The other possibility is that it’s a mould mark for Johansen Roth (again ‘for’ not ‘by’, since they were also American importers not producers). The age and origin would likely be the same. There is a myth that many of their pieces were made by Meissen (and this one has similarities of design to some Meissen-ware) but the Meissen factory historians in Germany are on record as saying that they never produced anything for Johansen Roth (or Jacobsen Roth as sometimes claimed) and had never heard of the names.

    It is, as @RW points out, very similar in design to some pieces known to have been produced for Ardent-Lenwile, another American importer who operated in a similar fashion, but the similarities may well be because they were using some of the same source factories in Japan (or elsewhere) as either of the “Roths”.
    Last edited by Red-Coat; Jan 14, 2020 at 07:41 PM. Reason: clarification
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  7. #7

    Feb 2013
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    Thank you so much everyone for the comments and information
    @red-coat thank you for all the information. Always appreciated Tnet
    AARC likes this.

  8. #8
    Charter Member
    ca
    Detect everyday like it's the last day of the season!

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    As usual, I'm fashionably late to the party.
    Great info by Red-Coat, Pat & RW.

    Dave
    jtw1313 and AARC like this.
    “I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a-hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them.”
    “Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway.”
    “Life's hard. It's even harder when you're stupid.”
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  9. #9
    us
    ARC

    Aug 2014
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    JTW,,, no offense... but I do not know what you would do without TreasureNet to solve the items you acquire.

    Ya know... when I began antiques... I only had books at my disposal.

    Countless hours in books and bookstores.

    Seems you reply on us to do the work FOR you.

    Again no offense.

    I just noticed you have posted here for 6 years and it always involves solving something for you.

    I for one don't mind posting a quick obvious solve for you from time to time.

    But learning requires YOU to do the work my friend.

    :P
    DETECT WITH RESPECT - Have permission... Fill holes... Dispose of trash. - The Random Chat Thread - http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/ev...en-24-7-a.html

  10. #10

    Feb 2013
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    @aarc if I posted everything I have I would crash the site lol........I only post if I’m in a hurry and most of the time I have looked before I post........ and I think people enjoy it or this site wouldn’t be here.....this is in what is it not show and tell.....i also have more knowledge than you might think.....and I always thank the ones who responded
    This is what the site is for......it is really quite simple if it bothers you that much or you don’t like it don’t open the thread why waste your time.
    Last edited by jtw1313; Jan 15, 2020 at 10:22 AM.
    Gene Mean, ANTIQUARIAN and AARC like this.

  11. #11
    Charter Member
    ca
    Detect everyday like it's the last day of the season!

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    Quote Originally Posted by jtw1313 View Post

    @aarc if I posted everything I have I would crash the site lol........I only post if I’m in a hurry and most of the time I have looked before I post........ and I think people enjoy it or this site wouldn’t be here.....this is in what is it not show and tell.....i also have more knowledge than you might think.....and I always thank the ones who responded
    This is what the site is for......it is really quite simple if it bothers you that much or you don’t like it don’t open the thread why waste your time.
    Personally, I find most of the things you post to be a challenge and this is how we all learn about new things as well. I understand where ARC is coming from though, when I started digging bottles at age 15 all we had were books and old school antique dealers for reference. I usually only respond when I have an interest or a theory as to what the item may be... please keep your posts coming!

    Dave
    Last edited by ANTIQUARIAN; Jan 16, 2020 at 05:11 AM. Reason: Grammer
    AARC, Gene Mean, jtw1313 and 1 others like this.
    “I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a-hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them.”
    “Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway.”
    “Life's hard. It's even harder when you're stupid.”
    ― John Wayne

  12. #12

    Feb 2013
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    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Books were written by someone......basically this is the same thing just the times have changed.
    Usually 9 times out of 10 everyone agrees they enjoy my posts. I’m not sure why anyone would get upset over a post. we all post here to learn or to show our finds.......and if anyone ever has a question about a item they have I will gladly take the time to answer if I have the knowledge to share
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  13. #13
    us
    John

    Mar 2014
    Atwater, CA
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    I don't often get involved in these debates, but isn't the whole point of this section to identify things you don't know about? I mean you learn regardless from others knowledge as they pass it to you. This is faster and more convenient. Also seeing others items is interesting as a bonus. Sorry just had to give my two cents, not trying to offend anyone.
    ANTIQUARIAN, jtw1313 and Red-Coat like this.

  14. #14
    Charter Member
    ca
    Detect everyday like it's the last day of the season!

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    Quote Originally Posted by JVA5th View Post

    I don't often get involved in these debates, but isn't the whole point of this section to identify things you don't know about? I mean you learn regardless from others knowledge as they pass it to you. This is faster and more convenient. Also seeing others items is interesting as a bonus. Sorry just had to give my two cents, not trying to offend anyone.
    I completely agree with you on this point John. I also enjoy hearing others theories on how objects might have been used or what their intended purpose might have been and jtw1313 has posted some interesting pieces over the past few years. It really doesn't matter if your objects are found with a metal detector or in a thrift store with your eyeball, or in my case sometimes on Kijiji.

    It's the thrill of the hunt and potentially finding a treasure that gets me up every morning.
    Dave
    jtw1313 likes this.
    “I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a-hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them.”
    “Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway.”
    “Life's hard. It's even harder when you're stupid.”
    ― John Wayne

  15. #15
    us
    ARC

    Aug 2014
    Bahia Del Espiritu Santo - "The Bay of the Holy Spirit” - La Florida
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    Quote Originally Posted by JVA5th View Post
    I don't often get involved in these debates, but isn't the whole point of this section to identify things you don't know about? I mean you learn regardless from others knowledge as they pass it to you. This is faster and more convenient. Also seeing others items is interesting as a bonus. Sorry just had to give my two cents, not trying to offend anyone.
    Yes it is... but at what point does the help become something of a bit more... I think 6 years of ONLY posting items for others to tell you what it is so you can sell it is ummmm ? ? ?

    What do you think ?

    To "use" the what is it forum to constantly solve stuff for another's obvious selling enterprises is ummmmmm again.... what do you think ?

    You want us to do the work for you so you can make money ? ? ?

    Cut us in. :P
    jtw1313 likes this.
    DETECT WITH RESPECT - Have permission... Fill holes... Dispose of trash. - The Random Chat Thread - http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/ev...en-24-7-a.html

 

 
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