Abandoned Trails in Silver Country

Jim Hemmingway

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Jan 26, 2008
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ABANDONED TRAILS IN SILVER COUNTRY

Introductionā€¦

Silver country represents a small part of a vast, heavily forested wilderness perched on the sprawling Precambrian Shield here in northeastern Ontario. Away from the small towns and villages, and widely scattered farms and rural homesteads, there exists a largely uninterrupted way of life in the more remote areas. There are uncounted miles of lonely country backroads, overgrown tracks leading to abandoned mining camps, innumerable rough timber lanes, and a virtually infinite tangle of winding trails that reach deeply into the distant forests.

Nothing in my experience has been so completely companionable as the soft forest whisperings and the beckoning solitude that reigns over this ruggedly beautiful country. This is where my carefree days of autumn prospecting have been agreeably spent for many years. We returned again this year to unbounded, satisfying autumn days of kicking rocks, exploring and detector-prospecting adventures, followed by evenings spent evaluating silver ores and hot coffee over blazing campfires.

Irrespective of silver recoveries, the flaming autumn colors of the boreal forest are the real treasure of the season. They persist for only a few short weeks, reluctantly yielding to the autumnal yellows of the tamarack, birch, and aspen in sharp contrast to the deep conifer greens. Scenery as depicted below accentuates your enthusiasm to get into the field, and pretty much ensures that an autumn prospecting trip to silver country is a memorable experience.

AUTUMN ELECTRONIC PROSPECTING BBBLSF.JPG

General Discussionā€¦

Unprecedented, persistently wet conditions eliminated any potential for a banner season, but nonetheless we did manage to find considerable worthwhile silver. In addition to an assortment of rich silver and associated minerals, my friend Sheldon Ward recovered a large, very high conductive native silver ore that weā€™ll take a closer look at shortly. Most of my quality silver finds were fairly smallā€¦ although a specimen grade silver ore at five pounds was found during the final week of the trip, and frankly I felt very fortunate to get it. Larger material was recovered, for example a 24-pound highgrade silver ore from the same areaā€¦ but these invariably were mixed ores dominated by cobalt and various arsenides, most notably niccolite as illustrated below.

2.6 LB NICCOLITE SILVER SFLOGDEEE14.JPG

On a more positive note, we both found plentiful small silver generally ranging between one-half and ten ounces that added real weight to the orebag over the seasonā€™s duration. It is much easier to find small but rich, high character silver than is the case with larger material. Even so, specimen grade detectable silver in any size range is becoming increasingly difficult to find at many of the obvious, readily accessible sites nowadays.

The photo below is a pretty fair representation of the overall quality, although anything below a half-oz was excluded from this shotā€¦ such are not terribly photogenic beside larger samples. Some rich ā€˜nuggetyā€™ ores were HCl acid-bathed to free the silver from carbonate rock, and all samples were subjected to a rotary tool circular wire brush to remove surface residues, followed by a dish detergent wash and rinse.

SMALL SILVER IN GOLDPAN SSWETYY14.JPG

By way of a brief background explanation to readers unfamiliar with this prospecting application, we search for more valuable coin-size and larger pieces of silver. Natural native silver target ID is determined by physical and chemical factors such as silver purity, types of mineral inclusions, structure (for exampleā€¦ dendritic, plate, disseminated, massive), size, shape, and the profile presented to the coil. Virtually all natural silver from this area will target ID from low foil up to a maximum of silver dime range. Only infrequently over the years have we found isolated, rare examples of our naturally occurring silver exceeding that range.

The specimen depicted below is a commonplace example of silver typically recovered here. It isn't terribly large or particularly handsomeā€¦ but it is mostly comprised of native silver by weight. Its target ID is a bit elevated from the usual, but consider that even small changes to some of the more influential factors listed above can significantly alter target ID. I tend to pay minimal attention to it when evaluating samples.

It was detected adjacent to an abandoned mining track that leads directly to a former mill site at the mining camp scene depicted above. No treatment required other than a leather glove rubdown followed by a soapy wash and rinseā€¦ in fact it looked quite presentable fresh out of the dirt. The darker material you see is heavily tarnished native silver that I intend to leave undisturbed.

1.7 MASSIVE AG CALCITE SFY1G18GR.JPG

Ground conditions also play an important role in determining target ID, and refer to factors such as strength of non-conductive magnetic susceptible iron minerals, ground moisture content, proximity of adjacent targets, and disturbed ground. These factors sometimes contribute to good silver at depth producing a VLF target ID in the iron range.

Probably the best photo example available to me is a specimen found a few years back at good depth in tough magnetic diabase. It produced a predominantly iron target ID on the Fisher F75. It was detected in a fairly low trash area, the signal was suspect, and it was checked with the groundgrab feature. In this instance, there was no ground phase reduction to more conductive values as would be anticipated over rusty iron or a positive hotrock, and so the target was dug.

But otherwise, the rule of thumb over questionable weaker signals is to remove some material to acquire a stronger signal and target ID readout before making a decision to continue digging in our difficult, hard-packed rocky substrates, or move on. If there is the least doubt we dig the target and learn what actually produced the signal.

5.2 OZT AG NUGGET SF18YGLOGS.JPG

The specimen depicted below was found by eyesight while hiking along an old abandoned rail track. In the field our rock samples seem more attractive or valuable than they do once we return to camp, where we tend to view them far more critically. If they donā€™t look to have good specimen grade potential, my samples either get chucked or given away. But thatā€™s just meā€¦ others are more resourceful with unwanted samples, theyā€™re refined by some, subjected to treatments, or slabbedā€¦ and ultimately sold. In any case, this rock didn't terribly impress me and was placed with the other discards on the picnic table. But nobody other than my wife seemed much interested in it, and that is how it came to be included here.

In its original condition, it could only be described as nondescript, with very little showing on the surface prior to treatment. It did produce a broad solid PI signal, despite that the few surface indicators were non-conductive dark ruby silver pyrargyrite and to a much lesser extent what I think is the black silver sulfosalt stephanite. To see more, it was acid-washed to expose silver and associated minerals, cleaned-up with a rotary tool followed by a dish detergent bath and rinse.

Both these minerals produce a good luster that makes them a bit more difficult to distinguish from native silver in a photo. But in reality it is easy to see the differences and do some simple tests to confirm if necessary. As it turned outā€¦ the sample does have a good showing of dendritic native silverā€¦ a timely reminder that metal detectors see what we initially canā€™t see inside rocks.

2.2 LB NATIVE RUBY CALCITE SF19Y1G.JPG

Abandoned Trails, Minesite Tracks and Roadbedsā€¦

Abandoned, frequently overgrown trails, mining tracks, and roadbeds provide convenient routes to prime detecting sites that otherwise would be much more difficult to access. But the important thing is that most such routes were built with discarded mine tailings to considerable depth, and contain good silver more frequently than you might think possible. Some snake through the bush to more remote areas, but the vast majority of these now abandoned routes were built to service existing minesites at the time. They were used to transport discarded rock to the tailing disposal areas, and silver ores to storage buildings and to mill sites, and generally to service other mining camp requirements.

ABANDONED TRAILS SFRR14.JPG

We know from research and experience that silver was misgraded, inadvertently misplaced, or lost directly from spills to eventually reside on, within, or alongside these now abandoned trails and roadbeds. These mine tailingsā€¦ frequently containing rich silverā€¦ were also used to build storage beds, minesite entrances, loading ramps, and as notedā€¦ routes to facilitate waste rock transport. All these offer excellent, obvious prospects to search with a suitable metal detector.

The nugget below, with several other pieces, was found in the tailings adjacent to the abandoned track in the photo above. Some good weather following a horrendous week of persistent heavy rainfalls prompted me to head out late one afternoon for some casual detecting. I had sampled those tailings earlier in the season but nothing by way of thorough searching. And while the silver was generally small, it had been surprisingly good quality. So I was looking forward to a few relaxing hours of detectingā€¦ nothing ambitious that late in the dayā€¦ just happy to get out of camp.

That particular spot formerly housed storage beds, and was now replete with large rusty nails. I should have used a VLF unit, as things would have gone much more quickly. VLF motion all-metal detection depth in that moderate ground would pretty well match Infinium equipped with the 8ā€ mono, with the further advantage of target ID. If conductive pyrrhotite hotrocks had also been present, I would have switched over to my F75 or MXT.

But I stayed with the Infinium primarily because I enjoy using it. By comparison it is slow going, but that isn't such a bad thing over potentially good ground. It silences what can be described as VLF ground noise, in addition to sizable non-conductive mafic hotrocks in this area. It also has some limited high conductive iron handling capability, for example elongated iron such as drillrods or rail spikes at sufficient depth that VLF unitsā€¦ even using small iron discriminationā€¦ misidentify with perfectly good signals and non-ferrous target ID readouts. More information on this subject can be found atā€¦ Garret Infinium Silver Rock Hunting - Revised Edition February 2011 White's TDI Pro in Silver Country [including Infinium Comparison]

Nearly all the signals proved to be nails, plus one drillbit with a perpendicular profile to the coil. The silver below produced a low-high signal in zero discrimination and a good high-low signal in reverse discrimination at maybe eight to ten inches depthā€¦ almost identical to the drillbit. The exposed silver was unusually tarnished and the remainder partially embedded in carbonate rock. It was acid-bathed to free the silver, cleaned with a rotary tool diamond bit and circular wire brush, followed by a detergent wash and rinse.

9.6 OZT SILVER NUGGET SFPANGY17GRN.JPG

While searching one such abandoned route with his Fisher F75, Sheldon Ward found a large highgrade silver ore comprised of a thick calcite vein containing massive dendritic native silver. It should weigh about 20 lbs give or take a bit, and is attached to dark country rock. It generated a moderate but broad signal from several feet depth, requiring about 30 minutes of hard pick and shovel work to recover it. It possesses an unusually elevated target ID well above silver dime range, making it quite rare indeed. Over nearly 30 years in this area and perhaps thousands of silver samples later, I've seen only a handful of silver produce a similar target ID.

On site we obviously have the benefit of closely examining the vein material, but itā€™s impossible for readers to evaluate the silver based on the photos below because of the camera to rock distance and the smudged dirt layer on the vein. And outdoor photos do tend to make native silver look much like grey rock. A better view of the cleaned sample can be had at Sheldonā€™s photobucket link to a half-minute video.
http://vid307.photobucket.com/albums/nn289/InsaneTundra/P1020237.mp4

Sheldon if you happen to be reading along here, congratulations on your many superb silver and associated mineral recoveries over the past year. Nothing that your dedication and persistence achieves in the years to come will ever surprise me. :)

SHELDON WARD & ROCK.JPG

SHELDON'S HIGHGRADE SILVER.JPG

Persistence Pays Dividendsā€¦

Letā€™s wrap things up with a tale about the rock sample below. It was recovered at the edge of a tangled overgrown trail near a former millsite just a few years ago. Its recovery exemplifies that the more you work towards your objective of finding silver or gold, the more likely your luck will correspondingly improve.

Iā€™d been searching that particular area for two days without meaningful results while evaluating a newly purchased Garrett Infinium for this application. The second day had again been filled with digging hard-packed rocky substrates for iron junk, worthless or otherwise unwanted arsenides, and plenty of conductive pyrrhotite hotrocks. As the sun was reaching for the western horizon, I decided to make one final effort before heading elsewhere the following day.

Methodically working along the old track towards the mill, lots of old diggings were plainly evident. But previous hunters had avoided an area with a scattering of large, flat rusty iron pieces and other miscellaneous modern trash. I moved quickly to clear it away, because daylight was fading fast beneath the dense forest canopy. My Infinium soon produced a surprisingly strong high-low signal that practically vanished in reverse discriminationā€¦ a promising indication of naturally occurring ores. I dug down a foot before my Propointer could locate the signal.

Probability says that it could have been any number of possible targets altogether more likely than good silver. But fickle Lady Luck was more kindly disposed towards me that evening. The rich, finely dendritic piece depicted below was in my gloved hands just as twilight was stealing across that lonely abandoned trail in remote silver country.

5.2 LB SILVER IN CALCITE DDSFGR14.JPG

A Final Wordā€¦

A special mention to my friend Dr. Jim Eckert. I hadnā€™t seen much of Jim recently, but happened across his trail late one overcast afternoon in the outback. I was about to hike into a site when this fellow came flying down the trail on a motorbike, and despite the riding helmet I recognized him. We had a good long chat about this and thatā€¦

Later in the season, one bright sunny afternoon at the site of my short-lived testhole diggings, Jim stopped around to show me a recent specimen find comprised of native silver and possibly crystalline stephanite. We talked mineralogy and other interests many hours until finally the sun was going down. These were highlights of the trip, and I want to say how much I enjoyed and appreciated having that companionable time together.

Thanks to everyone for dropping by. We hope that you enjoy presentations about our silver, particularly since it is different from what many rockhunters normally encounter in their areas. All the very best with your prospecting adventuresā€¦ perhaps one day it will be our good luck to meet you in the field.

Jim Hemmingway
December 2014
 

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meMiner

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Dave - In BC sluices are not allowed in the creek, but you can high bank with a 1.5 pump, as long as the silt gets trapped and does not flow back into the creek. A dredge requires special permits and permission will only be granted in specific circumstances. It is probably not worthwhile to jump through the necessary hoops (including reclamation bond) until you were sure the pay streaks are there. This might be the sort of area that a dredge would be allowed because there are no fish and the bedrock is exposed in the canyon.

Jim - I am always interested in info and would appreciate anything that you have. I am still learning about the area. It was a struggle just to learn the best access routes and to try to narrow down the potential areas for the type of mining that I am able to do at this time. I did find some spots that would have been very interesting to machine mine, but until I retire, that is not something that I am going to take on. I also found some spots that were quite interesting but are difficult access with a 4x4 truck. Unless I want to leave my ATV out there, I will not acquire a claim or if I have the claim, let those spots forfeit. I have always rented a 4x4, but some of the roads take half a day to get to the claim as they are so rough and no bridges, plus I would hate to destroy a rental or get stuck with no help around.
 

GoldpannerDave

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Dave - In BC sluices are not allowed in the creek, but you can high bank with a 1.5 pump, as long as the silt gets trapped and does not flow back into the creek. A dredge requires special permits and permission will only be granted in specific circumstances. It is probably not worthwhile to jump through the necessary hoops (including reclamation bond) until you were sure the pay streaks are there. This might be the sort of area that a dredge would be allowed because there are no fish and the bedrock is exposed in the canyon.

Jim - I am always interested in info and would appreciate anything that you have. I am still learning about the area. It was a struggle just to learn the best access routes and to try to narrow down the potential areas for the type of mining that I am able to do at this time. I did find some spots that would have been very interesting to machine mine, but until I retire, that is not something that I am going to take on. I also found some spots that were quite interesting but are difficult access with a 4x4 truck. Unless I want to leave my ATV out there, I will not acquire a claim or if I have the claim, let those spots forfeit. I have always rented a 4x4, but some of the roads take half a day to get to the claim as they are so rough and no bridges, plus I would hate to destroy a rental or get stuck with no help around.

Oh well, thanks for the info. Anytime I get to thinking how stinking the rules are here in Colorado, I find out others have it worse. Sorry to hear about the restrictions; I do sympathize.
 

meMiner

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Oh well, thanks for the info. Anytime I get to thinking how stinking the rules are here in Colorado, I find out others have it worse. Sorry to hear about the restrictions; I do sympathize.

The restrictions are what they are. I know a bunch of spots around BC that would be unbelievable with a dredge, if they ever change the rules. However, I am realistic enough to know that they would also be some of the first places to be hit hard by others and that would be the end of that. ie. it probably would not be me anyway...

However, if you want to read a great story, Google "Dave McCracken Atlin". The gold he got dredging was unbelievable.
 

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Jim Hemmingway

Jim Hemmingway

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Jan 26, 2008
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Jim, I also always loved this song and the group. I always thought it was Poco Seco Singers from the radio (they always pronounced it that way). When I bought an album, I noticed the Pozo spelling. I no longer have the LP because my wife, bless her heart, years after you could only buy CD's and DVD's, tossed all my LP's (including my Marty Robbins albums!). Later when I found them gone, I asked why. She said our stereo was broke, so what good were the records. She doesn't believe in keeping stuff she considers useless. This is the biggest thing we disagree on. Oh well, I explained to her that between the albums and an old Gary Gygax wargame, she tossed over $1000. Most of that was for the game; Gygax, whom I knew, was the inventor of D & D, so his name would bring 4 figures.

Anyway, one of the members because very famous later as a country singer/writer, Don Williams (who I think wrote the lyrics to Time. I think this song was the best of the group. That is why I recognized the sigline!

Glad I read this thread because I learned so much and I got to find the song online and post it so you could listen to it. :occasion14:

Hi GoldPannerDaveā€¦ Iā€™m glad that my wife is reluctant to throw out anything if she can think of any possible future use for itā€¦ either here or in some alternative dimension. But there does come a reckoning where we have to do some housecleaning or weā€™d run out of storage space. Iā€™ve been married to a wonderful woman for 42 years but she is a bit of a packrat.

Iā€™ve found that the CD platform produces improved recording quality over the old LPs, and so I parted with mine for next to nothing by way of sale value. Technology has changed a good deal in recent times, and I view those LPs as unfortunate casualties. I mention this because I hope my experience makes you feel a bit better about the departure of your albums.

Meanwhile below is something upbeat and cheerful from the same time periodā€¦ definitely a song that you might remember or otherwise have heard. BTW I changed my signature slightly to reflect the actual lyrics of the song ā€˜Timeā€™ā€¦ many thanks.



Jim.
 

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Jim Hemmingway

Jim Hemmingway

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Jan 26, 2008
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Dave - In BC sluices are not allowed in the creek, but you can high bank with a 1.5 pump, as long as the silt gets trapped and does not flow back into the creek. A dredge requires special permits and permission will only be granted in specific circumstances. It is probably not worthwhile to jump through the necessary hoops (including reclamation bond) until you were sure the pay streaks are there. This might be the sort of area that a dredge would be allowed because there are no fish and the bedrock is exposed in the canyon.

Jim - I am always interested in info and would appreciate anything that you have. I am still learning about the area. It was a struggle just to learn the best access routes and to try to narrow down the potential areas for the type of mining that I am able to do at this time. I did find some spots that would have been very interesting to machine mine, but until I retire, that is not something that I am going to take on. I also found some spots that were quite interesting but are difficult access with a 4x4 truck. Unless I want to leave my ATV out there, I will not acquire a claim or if I have the claim, let those spots forfeit. I have always rented a 4x4, but some of the roads take half a day to get to the claim as they are so rough and no bridges, plus I would hate to destroy a rental or get stuck with no help around.

Thanks for the additional photos Placergold, that looks to be an area with a lot of detecting potential. I recently read in my filed Atlin papers about a 73 oz nugget found in the Birch in 1913, but no specific details available. Iā€™ve seen some of the gold streams in lower Quebec that are little more than a trickle, but an extended good rainfall turns them into treacherous, powerful rivers with sufficient force to move very large boulders for several days following such rainfall events. Youā€™d think that Birch Creek would drastically change from typical low water levels in autumn to something quite different if there were a decent spring flood season.

Going through my files I rediscovered that I visited the area in August of 1989ā€¦ Iā€™ve got a copy of the Atlin Claimā€¦ a special visitorā€™s edition dated from the summer of that year. Mainly I wanted to review what I had stored away just to get my bearings when discussing the area with you. My information is more directed at tourists and wouldnā€™t be useful to you. I have photocopies of claims at that time, overviews of the productive streams providing some near useless geology tidbits and some minor references as to where work was done, a few incidentals about historically outstanding gold foundā€¦ but no specific production numbers or pertinent geo-information. So I seriously doubt I can tell you anything about the area that you donā€™t already know.

I think a trip to the area would be worthwhile if access to formerly productive areas can be arranged with present-day claimholders. No doubt there are many possibilities, but as youā€™ve more or less pointed out, thereā€™s a big difference between research and physically being there on the ground. Itā€™s not so easy to make a relatively brief trip to a remote area and get situated on productive ground. I realize these are generalizations, but I do think making some arrangements with other owners is key to a successful trip. Reading DMā€™s account, it seems at the time that 10% to owners and a 5% finders fee to a friend were about it.

You mentioned that the main mining on Birch Creek took place about a kilometer below your claim, but have indicated there may have been large equipment on your claim at some point, not to mention more intensive manual mining as evidenced by the hand-stacked cobbles. I guess the questions that surface are (a) have you detected any gold on your claim such that it would encourage you to do further work or exploration. (b) are there any GPAA or other private club claims in the general area? (c) have you tried to make arrangements to search other promising claims with metal detectors?

As I understand your posts, it seems that nowadays it would be a PITA to put a legal dredge into the upper reaches of Pine Creek. Reading the account of DM and company, there seemed to be a legal issue with their dredging activities back in 1982??

Jim.

3.8 LB NATIVE SILVER CALCITE SF15YGRN.JPG
 

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meMiner

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Page 5 and growing! Look out Lanny. LOL

Historically, the major mining in on Birch was 1KM above pine for 4.5KM. That area is pretty torn up as it was drifted, then hydraulic, followed by machine mining. That was where the 78oz nugget came from. Since then, there has been machine mining higher up the creek and the area somewhat restored.

The Atlin Claim newspaper is still around. Too bad they seem to rehash old info found in books and online, vs interviewing some of the locals who I am sure would have some interesting stories to tell.

I have not asked anybody for permission to metal detect on their claims. I had my own to check out and never had enough time to even do that properly. This summer I was to hit it hard with the detector and not get side tracked with panning flour. There are no private clubs that I am aware.

I read the DM story a number of times. I recognize some of the facts were intentionally changed or details left out and understand why. I have walked parts of Pine Creek but never found an area exactly as I imagined the location would look the he described. I still find it fascinating. Even back in 1982, suction dredging would have been frowned upon in BC.
 

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Jim Hemmingway

Jim Hemmingway

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Hi Placergoldā€¦ thankyou for the separate background information and the above post. It is possible that Iā€™ll head that way later this summer, but no definite plans at present. If soā€¦ the wife and me would likely camp at the Atlin townsite campground. At least there, we shouldnā€™t be afraid to leave camp unoccupied during daylight hoursā€¦ that site should reduce the chances of a curious blackbear getting into the camper vs camping at a more remote location.

With such a vast area, youā€™d think it possible to locate abandoned areas that current claimholders have no plans to work and maybe strike a deal. Otherwise, there would be little point to making the trip. Over the winter weā€™ll take a closer look at the area and see what else, if anything, surfaces by way of opportunity.

I think this thread has pretty much run its course, and it is time to leave it. Thanks to everyone who dropped by to comment, and all the very best with your prospecting endeavors in the forthcoming season.

We might as well post a final specimen example. The handsome native silver and calcite specimen below was found some seven or eight years ago at the very edge of an abandoned roadbed leading into a former minesite. The silver has a micron-thin coating of black silver sulfide that will remain in place.

Jim.

4.6 LB AG CALCITE SF17YGROR.JPG
 

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Jim Hemmingway

Jim Hemmingway

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Sheldon happened to send me an email today of his vein material separated from the country mafic rock. Not a bad photo, but I had to downsize itā€¦ which never helps with details. I do think this rock requires more acid treatment because there is heavy duty silver just below the surface. At the size and weightā€¦ it has to be so.

Jim.
SHELDON 25 LB SILVER SPECIMEN YB.JPG
 

DDancer

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A bit late but I do appreciate you words to me Mr. Hemmingway. I also find you posts to be outstanding and insightful. Mayhap we'll cross paths more often.

Sorry to interrupt this thread at this time.
DD
 

GoldpannerDave

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The restrictions are what they are. I know a bunch of spots around BC that would be unbelievable with a dredge, if they ever change the rules. However, I am realistic enough to know that they would also be some of the first places to be hit hard by others and that would be the end of that. ie. it probably would not be me anyway...

However, if you want to read a great story, Google "Dave McCracken Atlin". The gold he got dredging was unbelievable.

Back in the early 80's, I corresponded briefly with Dave McCracken (us both having a military background). I had read some of his books and was fascinated by the stories of his gold dredging. I have about 4 of his books from that era, autographed by him. Unfortunately, Colorado did not have the areas like California. I then did a 7 year tour in Germany, back to Colorado, then retired to teach chemistry in Florida. Then we cam back again to Colorado to teach at the Air Force Academy for the third time. I always wanted to dredge like Dave Mack, but never lived where I could.

There are a few areas in Colorado that still hold potential, but as long as I am teaching, I doubt I will ever work them with a sluice, let alone a dredge. Like you said, "The restrictions are what they are."
 

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GoldpannerDave

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Jim, Jimmie Rodgers was another of my favorites back then. I agree CD's are better quality, but I am more like your wife--I am a packrat. However, my wife of nearly 48 years is a gem (other than her "toss it" ways). A good woman is better than all my stuff I wanted to keep; glad I kept her instead. :)
 

GoldpannerDave

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Apr 17, 2014
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Primary Interest:
Prospecting
Sheldon happened to send me an email today of his vein material separated from the country mafic rock. Not a bad photo, but I had to downsize itā€¦ which never helps with details. I do think this rock requires more acid treatment because there is heavy duty silver just below the surface. At the size and weightā€¦ it has to be so.

Jim.

Jim,

Beautiful silver there. Colorado is the Silver State, maybe I should start looking. :)

Dave

PS--Glad I could help historically fix your sigline. :)
 

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Jim Hemmingway

Jim Hemmingway

Hero Member
Jan 26, 2008
791
1,624
Canada
Detector(s) used
F-75, Infinium LS, MXT, GoldBug2, TDI Pro, 1280X Aquanaut, Garrett ProPointer
Primary Interest:
Prospecting
A bit late but I do appreciate you words to me Mr. Hemmingway. I also find you posts to be outstanding and insightful. Mayhap we'll cross paths more often.

Sorry to interrupt this thread at this time.
DD

Thanks DDancerā€¦ looking back to your earlier post, it seemed to me that you were curious about the area, and frankly I donā€™t have much by way of decent scenery photos. Next season when the autumn colors peak, weā€™ll take lots of good representative wide angle shots. Next time around, Iā€™ll remember to post some of those scenery photos. In addition to some great scenery, and a wide variety of minerals such as silver, gold, base metals, and many others too numerous to list, Ontarioā€™s Precambrian Shield is rich with countless small kettle lakes and rivers, vast timber resources, and highly diversified wildlife populations. It is a great place to experience each autumn and to enjoy some detector-prospecting adventures.

Below is a favorite area where Iā€™ve had good success finding a variety of interesting silver minerals such as dark ruby silver pyrargyrite and the silver sulfide acanthite in addition to specimen grade native silver in calcite / dolomite host rock. Earlier in the thread we posted a fine example of pyrargyrite, and below is a pretty fair example of plate silver that the area across the lake is known to have produced in quantity for collectors.

Jim.
PROSPECTING ABANDONED SF13DGBRA.JPG

1.0 LB PLATE SILVER SPECIMEN SFB13.JPG

 

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Jim Hemmingway

Jim Hemmingway

Hero Member
Jan 26, 2008
791
1,624
Canada
Detector(s) used
F-75, Infinium LS, MXT, GoldBug2, TDI Pro, 1280X Aquanaut, Garrett ProPointer
Primary Interest:
Prospecting
Jim,

Beautiful silver there. Colorado is the Silver State, maybe I should start looking. :)

Dave

PS--Glad I could help historically fix your sigline. :)

Hi Daveā€¦ weā€™ve enjoyed your posts to this thread, have managed some interesting discussions other than strictly related to detector-prospecting, and we had some fun with our music. And there is no question we share similar values in regard to home and familyā€¦ so it has been a genuine pleasure speaking with you

Letā€™s hope you will be able to explore some of the Silver Stateā€™s old abandoned hardrock minesites with a suitable metal detector, as this may very well be your most promising and least strenuous option for finding native silver. Meanwhile all the best with everything, including your academy teachingā€¦ Iā€™ll bet you find it both rewarding and fun. Iā€™ve always regretted not acquiring a teacherā€™s certificate here in Ontario.

The handsome specimen depicted below was recovered the previous season at a site that has produced a lot of quality silver over the years. It came as an unexpected surprise at the end of a long afternoon filled with detecting a variety of ores, especially plentiful niccolite samples, but precious little silver.

Looking at the scene photo, the silver was detected halfway down the slope, just below the treeline. It was a fairly shallow signal but somehow I missed it while digging. Checking the hole produced no signal on the Propointer, so I knew right away it was out. It was very heavy for its size and looked promising even when covered in dirt. A good rub with my leather glove revealed extremely rich native silver in flawless creamy white calcite. The silver looks quite dark in the photo, but in reality that is not the case at all, rather it possesses a bright, high silvery luster. Itā€™s not my largest find by any stretch, but is definitely one of my all-time favorites.

Jim.
AUTUMN ELECTRONIC PROSPECTING BEAVER LGRSF.JPG

5.4 LB AG CALCITE SF18YGNAT.JPG
 

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GoldpannerDave

Bronze Member
Apr 17, 2014
1,076
1,279
Colorado Springs, CO
Detector(s) used
Bazooka 48" Miner and 30" Sniper, Le Trap, Wolf Trap, A52, 2" dredge, Miller tables, Blue Bowl, wheel, Falcon MD20, old White's detector
Primary Interest:
Prospecting
Hi Daveā€¦ weā€™ve enjoyed your posts to this thread, have managed some interesting discussions other than strictly related to detector-prospecting, and we had some fun with our music. And there is no question we share similar values in regard to home and familyā€¦ so it has been a genuine pleasure speaking with you.

And likewise reading all the fascinating material that is posted here by you and others. And your mineral shots are simply wonderful. I would have been a chemical geologist if that had been offered where I went to school, but it wasn't. :(

Letā€™s hope you will be able to explore some of the Silver Stateā€™s old abandoned hardrock minesites with a suitable metal detector, as this may very well be your most promising and least strenuous option for finding native silver. Meanwhile all the best with everything, including your academy teachingā€¦ Iā€™ll bet you find it both rewarding and fun. Iā€™ve always regretted not acquiring a teacherā€™s certificate here in Ontario.

Teaching at the US Air Force Academy is indeed run and rewarding. I love teaching, so this is the best of both worlds--teaching and working with our cadets.

I might ask, since my only detectors are an old White's DI 6000 (from memory, so I hope I got that right, since I cannot go check right now) and a Falcon MD20 (not really for general detecting). What would be a good used detector for silver? Since my wife thinks I spend too much money on gold prospecting, etc., I had better shoot for a good used detector rather than a new one. :)

The handsome specimen depicted below was recovered the previous season at a site that has produced a lot of quality silver over the years. It came as an unexpected surprise at the end of a long afternoon filled with detecting a variety of ores, especially plentiful niccolite samples, but precious little silver.

Looking at the scene photo, the silver was detected halfway down the slope, just below the treeline. It was a fairly shallow signal but somehow I missed it while digging. Checking the hole produced no signal on the Propointer, so I knew right away it was out. It was very heavy for its size and looked promising even when covered in dirt. A good rub with my leather glove revealed extremely rich native silver in flawless creamy white calcite. The silver looks quite dark in the photo, but in reality that is not the case at all, rather it possesses a bright, high silvery luster. Itā€™s not my largest find by any stretch, but is definitely one of my all-time favorites.

Jim.

And that is a lovely specimen. The photo of the site is also great. One the special things about this thread is all the wonderful photographs it contains. Thank you. Many of us enjoy vicariously your discoveries and the locations. :)

Dave
 

GoldpannerDave

Bronze Member
Apr 17, 2014
1,076
1,279
Colorado Springs, CO
Detector(s) used
Bazooka 48" Miner and 30" Sniper, Le Trap, Wolf Trap, A52, 2" dredge, Miller tables, Blue Bowl, wheel, Falcon MD20, old White's detector
Primary Interest:
Prospecting
The restrictions are what they are. I know a bunch of spots around BC that would be unbelievable with a dredge, if they ever change the rules. However, I am realistic enough to know that they would also be some of the first places to be hit hard by others and that would be the end of that. ie. it probably would not be me anyway...

However, if you want to read a great story, Google "Dave McCracken Atlin". The gold he got dredging was unbelievable.

I sat down and read that over the holiday weekend. Thanks for recommending it. Very enjoyable. Just makes me sad I never really did strike out like that back in the early 80's. Oh, I had a great 2 week trip in summer of '86 when I caught a "hop" from Peterson AFB, here in the Springs to McChord AFB in Seattle with a buddy. We met up with a retired Marine who had about 3 or 4 Purple Hearts from WWII. He was very knowledgeable in all areas of gold prospecting. He had a claim on Indian Creek, off of the Trinity River. The previous summer in 6 weeks, he took out $16,000 worth of gold (over 50 oz!). We all drove down together from Seattle to a place near Hayfork, CA. We spent about 8 actual days dredging in a V-notch canyon on Indian Creek. I had brought my 2" Keene and used it most of the time. I think my buddy that caught the hop with me also had a 2" dredge and the claim owner loaned me his 2 1/2" for 3-4 days.

I had the time of my life. We were in very shallow water, on hands and knees with masks and snorkels. The water was about 39-40 degrees F and so our backs were burning hot whenever we were the sun and it hit the black wet suit, but the rest of us cold. Still, I got just a hair under 2 oz. of gold! That was the most I had ever gotten. Doesn't compare to Dave Mack, but for me, it was great. One morning, in less than an hour, I hit a pocket with a 1/2 ounce of gold! What a way to start the day! Several nuggets and mostly large pieces; not much flour gold in that half ounce.

Wanted to go back, but the next summer the Air Force sent me to Germany. There was no dredging in Germany, though I did take my dredge. A friend from Canada (though originally from Yugoslavia) wanted me to bring the dredge to Yugoslavia. He had places to go in the mountains that no one had worked since the Romans. The problem was like Dave Mack sort of. You could only take $10,000 dinars out of the country--about $10. So if I got caught at the border, as an Air Force officer, my career was over. Then the war broke out there and it was a moot point. That might have a something like Atlin on a very small scale. One thing for sure, no one had dredged it back in '87. :)
 

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trainermick

Full Member
Jul 15, 2009
112
74
Chatham, Ontario
Great post as usual Jim. I tried to get up there with Sheldon this season but couldn't make it this year. I am going back in May to search around H...Pond for float. Now if only we could find a good market ( other than the smelters) for this stuff. Hope to go down to Tucson in March to find some buyers.
 

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Jim Hemmingway

Jim Hemmingway

Hero Member
Jan 26, 2008
791
1,624
Canada
Detector(s) used
F-75, Infinium LS, MXT, GoldBug2, TDI Pro, 1280X Aquanaut, Garrett ProPointer
Primary Interest:
Prospecting
And likewise reading all the fascinating material that is posted here by you and others. And your mineral shots are simply wonderful. I would have been a chemical geologist if that had been offered where I went to school, but it wasn't. :(

Teaching at the US Air Force Academy is indeed run and rewarding. I love teaching, so this is the best of both worlds--teaching and working with our cadets.

I might ask, since my only detectors are an old White's DI 6000 (from memory, so I hope I got that right, since I cannot go check right now) and a Falcon MD20 (not really for general detecting). What would be a good used detector for silver? Since my wife thinks I spend too much money on gold prospecting, etc., I had better shoot for a good used detector rather than a new one. :)

And that is a lovely specimen. The photo of the site is also great. One the special things about this thread is all the wonderful photographs it contains. Thank you. Many of us enjoy vicariously your discoveries and the locations. :)

Dave

Thanks Dave for the comment about the photos, photographing rocks is an aspect of the hobby that I enjoy and hope such adds interest value to my posts. Weā€™re fortunate to have reasonable access to the silverfields, but most of the guys here on the forum will never see a native silver sample firsthand in the field. I think specimen grade silver is uniquely attractiveā€¦ and hope everyone enjoys seeing material not normally encountered in their prospecting areas. The photos leave no doubt as to what our mining camps and silver samples look like.

A used mid-frequency prospecting-capable metal detector is your best bet for silver here. This application needs good detection depth on larger, deeper silver that target IDs over a wide conductive span, although most of our silver falls into the low conductive range. VLF units operating in the mid-frequency range such as my MXT at 14 kHz or F75 at 13 kHz, are a very good overall compromise because theyā€™re sensitive to both high and low conductors, and respond well to weak low conductive signals produced by disseminated and sponge silver as depicted below...

1.8 LB SPONGE SILVER SFBB16N.JPG

There are a number of suitable mid-frequency units currently available on the used market with variable feature sets that will get the job done. Try to buy a unit that at least has the features listed below. They will make you a more effective hunter, and add to the interest and fun value of your experience.

ļ± target ID in a threshold-based motion all-metal mode
ļ± a discrimination mode preferably with an iron tone option for excessively trashy sites
ļ± a manually adjustable full range ground balance with a visual readout
ļ± a ā€œfastgrabā€ ground balance for its convenience and to assist with target signal evaluation
ļ± a reasonably lightweight, well-balanced package with some practical coil selections

I see little point to discussing specific models here Dave because Steve Herschbach maintains an updated list at the following link that includes a brief description of each unit. Steve's Guide to Gold Nugget Detectors

The photo below depicts a large specimen grade silver ore found at good depth a few years back. It is very heavy for its size, target IDs in the low zinc penny range, and the native silver is quite soft and pure. It produced an Infinium hi-lo zero discrimination signalā€¦ an absolute guarantee it would be dug. But the circumstances could have been differentā€¦

There are many other examples of silver ores that target ID in the same conductive range but react differently to produce low-high signals; and we examined a similar conductive sample last autumn that generated a double high-low signal. Such signal variations result from slightly different silver ore GB points in relation to Infiniumā€™s GB point for the actual ground mineralization. But in reverse discrimination, virtually all such zero discrimination silver signal variations in this area produce a high-low signal normally accompanied to some extent by a reduced signal volume, and therefore must be dug.

A lot of iron trash will also respond with a zero discrimination high-low signal and will have to be dug. But we can avoid digging some high conductive iron because a good portion of it will respond with a low-high signal in both zero and reverse discrimination. Naturally occurring silver that might similarly respond is so rare here that for all practical purposes it can be viewed as an inconsequential factor.

But that is not to suggest there are not other considerations to take into account when making a ā€œdigā€ decision. On occasion we have to override what a detector is telling us and exercise some judgement when deciding whether or not to dig a target signal. Broad, deep signals for example, should never be ignored regardless of signal type produced. There are no guarantees when it comes to deep signal integrity in substrates that contain excessive ferrous trash, and elevated mineralizations of nickel, cobalt and other arsenides in addition to highly magnetic susceptible iron minerals. Digging such signals is infinitely preferable to suffering with nagging doubts that you may have ignored some potentially superb silver... that you may not be able to find again.

Jim.
8.3 LB DENDRITIC AG CALCITE SF19YGLOGS.JPG
 

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Jim Hemmingway

Jim Hemmingway

Hero Member
Jan 26, 2008
791
1,624
Canada
Detector(s) used
F-75, Infinium LS, MXT, GoldBug2, TDI Pro, 1280X Aquanaut, Garrett ProPointer
Primary Interest:
Prospecting
Great post as usual Jim. I tried to get up there with Sheldon this season but couldn't make it this year. I am going back in May to search around H...Pond for float. Now if only we could find a good market ( other than the smelters) for this stuff. Hope to go down to Tucson in March to find some buyers.

Hi Fredā€¦ glad to hear from you, and thankyou for your comments. It seems to me that Sheldon mentioned that he had met you out by Brady Lake the year previously. Itā€™s likely youā€™ll see him in the spring and that would be a good time to ask him about selling your silver. Aside from consistently finding some very good material, he does very well with selling his silver. He may be willing to discuss his contacts or otherwise advise you.

Some impressive floats have come from Hermannā€™s Pond dating back to the areaā€™s earliest days. It has seen a lot of detecting in recent decades, but then itā€™s a big country. Iā€™ve seen a few handsome fist-size silver floats and a genuine world class silver float that were detected on a general line stretching from Kerr Lake over to Hermannā€™s Pond. I mention this in case you feel like some serious hiking before the trees have fully leafed this spring. :)

A new acquaintance from Minnesota named Rusty is planning to visit the area in May. He visited the area a few years ago and recovered some good silver in the South Lorrain. He might enjoy having some companionship while so far from home, so I hope you guys will keep an eye open for him. Iā€™m seriously tempted to go for a quick visit that could include the long Victoria holiday weekend. I figured maybe to get my campfire wood hauled and stacked for the autumn, do some detecting, and see about having you guys over for a campfire. It would also be a good excuse to buy a rather unique, modified pick / shovel combo from a friend in the area.

The photo below was taken at the Temiskaming site just a few years ago, where we found the unusual or odd-looking specimen depicted in the second shot. Of course niccolite abounds there, but to find a specimen grade ore where the niccolite and silver occur independently in the host rock was a welcome addition to my collection. In fact youā€™re looking at the exact spot where we recovered a 28Ā¾ lb solid niccolite vein sandwiched in calcite in the autumn of 2010.

Jim.

AUTUMN ELECTRONIC PROSPECTING TEMISK RRSF.JPG

4.1 LB NICKEL SILVER CALCITE SFB2 .JPG
 

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MrLee

Sr. Member
Mar 25, 2012
492
273
Tokyo & OC
Detector(s) used
Google Earth, BS Detector, $$
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Wonderful read. Have you had it published anywhere?

One of the problems I had when I joined my old gold prospecting club is everyone knew something about gold, but no one knew anything about silver and it's ores. Even with our club's claim having an old silver mine on it. I often found various copper ores, but I couldn't identify silver ores. This is one of the reasons I joined my local rock club, to get a better understanding of geology, minerals and their associations. It's a long learning process and I recommend it to everyone because you are almost always missing some fantastic minerals while looking for gold.
 

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