California, sub $2500 MD...

[GoldenNerd]

Hi everyone!

Just getting started, and being in California (Bay Area, specifically) I have a wide range of options.

The beaches about 1 hour away.
Gold country is about 2 hours away.
My parents live in Henderson, NV.
My wife has family in Phoenix, AZ.
On the side it would be nice to hit local parks and hills.

Now, given a top-end of $2500, which detector do you go with?
Saltwater + gold country = highly mineralized ... PI system? This is where most of my time will be spent.
NV/AZ prospecting = less mineralized ... VLF? Minor portion of time.
Side work ... VLF for trash screening? Unknown. PI might be just fine without losing too much sanity.

I've been looking at the Garrett ATX, and from all of the videos it looks solid enough (thanks Bearkat and everyone else who's done comparisons and writeups!) but it's at the top-end of of the $$$ range for me. Since I probably won't make the money back from a detector then something like the GPX is just way too far out. Also, I haven't seen much done with the ATX DeepSeeker mono-coil ... only one video from a NZ guy.

Obviously there are lot of other options but, as a newbie, all research seems to point towards a PI machine. The ATX's "close-to-GPX" performance and the submersion factor seemed fun since I used to dive and enjoy working in the water.

On the other side, there are a LOT of competent machines, including PI systems, which are lower in price.

WWTND? =)

Thanks in advance!

 

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[Tom_in_CA]

You haven't said what type of detecting you want to do. Well, yes and no. You mention how close you are to the beach. And then you mention also "prospecting", etc...

So what is your goal ? Prospecting? beach for coins/jewelry ? turf/land for coins? relics, ? etc.... Gotta be a bit more specific, since there's different machines that excel in different venues.

Welcome from Salinas, CA

 

[Metal Detecting Stuff]

Given that 90% of your demand is in beaches or deserts, the ATX might fit the bill quite well. It might not be the best choice for a trashy park. If you don't need the deepseeker package, you can have money left over from your budget to buy a pinpointer and some digging tools.

Wayne

Metal Detector Sales and Rentals | Fisher, Garrett, Minelab, Lesche and DetectorPro

 

[GoldenNerd]

You haven't said what type of detecting you want to do. Well, yes and no. You mention how close you are to the beach. And then you mention also "prospecting", etc...

So what is your goal ? Prospecting? beach for coins/jewelry ? turf/land for coins? relics, ? etc.... Gotta be a bit more specific, since there's different machines that excel in different venues.

Welcome from Salinas, CA

Thanks for the welcome! My grandfather lives in Prunedale and both of my parents are from Salinas. =)

Most of my use will be prospecting, or at least trying. I like panning/sluicing and just being in the Sierras. Secondary would be at the beach. Third would be (relatively) local coins/relics when I don't have time for the other two. After that ... probably infrequent trips out to Nevada/AZ for prospecting and then coins/relics.

Given that 90% of your demand is in beaches or deserts, the ATX might fit the bill quite well. It might not be the best choice for a trashy park. If you don't need the deepseeker package, you can have money left over from your budget to buy a pinpointer and some digging tools.

True, true. Another member has graciously informed me that the ATX works "almost too well" and that the limiting factor at the beach is not the detector but the digging deep holes in wet sand! =D

It would, however, be interesting to see the difference (if any) the Deepseeker coil really makes compared to the 8" mono and the stock DD. Hard to quantify.

Thanks to both of you!

 

[Terry Soloman]

You could get a couple of different detectors, like a Tesoro Lobo Super Traq for gold nugget and coin shooting, and a Tesoro Sand Shark for wet saltwater work and spend about $1,400.00 total.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... Most of my use will be prospecting, or at least trying. I like panning/sluicing and just being in the Sierras. Secondary would be at the beach. Third would be (relatively) local coins/relics when I don't have time for the other two....

Well then, you're apparently wanting a machine that can be a "cross-over". Just be aware then, that machines touted as being able to do both or all venues, will excell in neither arenas. There will be "better beach" machines and "better coin/relic" machines, and "better nugget" machines. Example, like the ATX that was suggested: Sure, it might do great at the beach, and great at nuggets, but .... you're going to have p*ss-**r iron id (ability to pass nails) beyond about 4 or 5" deep. And so, .... that may not be too much fun at a park, or a ghost town, etc....

With your kind of budget, you may want to consider more than one machine then. One for prospecting, and the other for coins (both land and sea, which can be one & the same, assuming you weren't planning on going scuba/underwater).

 

[GoldenNerd]

but .... you're going to have p*ss-**r iron id (ability to pass nails) beyond about 4 or 5" deep. And so, .... that may not be too much fun at a park, or a ghost town, etc....

Totally agreed, as is true with all PI machines. From watching videos of VLF machines, though, the discrimination mode seems to really hurt the depth. Not sure if that's true of all models or just the ones I happened across. I saw a number of instances where they were going into "all metal" mode to get hits ... but then that gives up the single biggest advantage of VLF!

So ... what would you (generic, anyone reading) do - advice and personal preferences including makes and models?

I've got a +1 on Tesoro Lobo Super Trac and a +1 Sand Shark.
Anyone else? =)

Thanks everyone!

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Totally agreed, as is true with all PI machines. From watching videos of VLF machines, though, the discrimination mode seems to really hurt the depth. Not sure if that's true of all models or just the ones I happened across. I saw a number of instances where they were going into "all metal" mode to get hits ... but then that gives up the single biggest advantage of VLF! .....

golden-nerd, well yes of course, a nugget pulse machine, or any pulse perhaps, will go deeper than a discriminating VLF. I mean, for example, some of the pulse nugget machines today can get a coin to 16 or 18 " deep! But no, you are not going to get a machine that can reach those all-metal depths AND tell you iron versus non-iron, or low versus mid versus high conductors, etc.... The power house deep-seeker disc. machines like the Explorers, are good for relatively good TID's down to about 8 or 9" (if you have a clear line of sight to the target). And to tell iron versus non iron to about 11" or so (perhaps a tad deeper on quarters or halves).

So you appear to be looking for one machine that can do it all. You'll have to make a choice. Which do you want? Depth or disc. ? Which is why I suggest getting two machines, if you really want to pursue each one fully. Thus yes, you have to "give up advantages" as you put it.

But if you just want to dink around, and weren't really going to get serious about maxing out in any one venue, then sure, cross-over machines include the Lobo super trac, MXT, etc.... Heck, even older machines like the XLT had "prospecting" mode on them . But .... as I say ... you'd be left in the dust by other machines when nugget hunting. Conversely, some cross-over machines might be respectable in nuggets, yet ... you'd be left in the dust on the beach. Sure, it would "work", but .... if you were side-by-side someone on the beach with a beach-specific machine, he'd spank you.

 

[GoldenNerd]

First up, let me say "thank you" for the continued discussion and help!

So you appear to be looking for one machine that can do it all. You'll have to make a choice. Which do you want? Depth or disc. ? Which is why I suggest getting two machines, if you really want to pursue each one fully. Thus yes, you have to "give up advantages" as you put it.

The issue which worries me, correctly or not, is the mineralization ... not the depth vs disc. If I understand it correctly (which I may not) by spending most of my time prospecting (and in California that means mineralization) along with the surf (again, mineralization) do I really have much choice in the PI-vs-VLF? And thus by extension, the choice is then made up for me about discrimination - I'm digging everything in sight because I need PI for the ground and VLF just isn't an option anyways? And why detectors like the super-sensitive VLFs like the GoldBug2/Pro or SuperTrac are simply not viable?

But .... as I say ... you'd be left in the dust by other machines when nugget hunting. Conversely, some cross-over machines might be respectable in nuggets, yet ... you'd be left in the dust on the beach. Sure, it would "work", but .... if you were side-by-side someone on the beach with a beach-specific machine, he'd spank you.

Here's where I get confused. Aren't those the same thing, really? Hunting targets in heavily mineralized environments?

Doesn't a good PI machine cover you EVERYWHERE except for discrimination? (Well, it discriminates against the wallet, but that's another story!)

Thank you again for your patience! =)

 

[Tom_in_CA]

........ The issue which worries me, correctly or not, is the mineralization ... not the depth vs disc. If I understand it correctly (which I may not) by spending most of my time prospecting (and in California that means mineralization) along with the surf (again, mineralization) do I really have much choice in the PI-vs-VLF? .... And thus by extension, the choice is then made up for me about discrimination - I'm digging everything in sight because I need PI for the ground and VLF just isn't an option anyways? ....

I can't speak for nuggets/prospecting, as I'm not into that venue. Except to say that there are both VLF and pulse nugget machines. Naturally, pulse is the deeper of the two types of nugget machines, but that's not to say that nuggets can't be found with VLF machines either. AGAIN: you're going to have to make choices, and not think you're going to find something that allows you to have both. And also: while it's true that wet salt beaches most often contain some mineralization, where did you get the idea that strictly a pulse is needed on the beach then? Unless the beach were gun-powder grey/black, then no, you don't need a pulse. Lots of guys are doing just fine on the beaches with machines like the CZ6, Explorer, Sovereign, Explorer, Excal, 6000 di pro, etc.... Granted, they won't work when it becomes dark grey/black, but that's very small areas, in only select zones (like at the mouth of gully washes after storms erode channels, etc...). You merely move away 5 ft, and you're usually out of it.

Also be aware that while it's true that pulse beach machines move effortlessly in and out of these beach zones, yet: a) they're not getting coin-sized targets any deeper than several of today's VLF beaches machines, and b) they're going to lack the ability to tell iron versus no iron. So again, YOU HAVE TO CHOOSE.

So back to the questions: How hard-core do you want to be? If you want to just dink around on the beach only once in a blue moon, yet put nuggets as your primary, then sure: you can occasionally use the nugget machine on the beach (but be aware of the down-sides! no disc for iron, etc...). Or if you want to primarily coin/relic/beach hunt, with only an occasional dinking on nuggets, then sure: get a coin machine which has a cross-over ability to prospecting (but be aware of the down-sides that you're NOT going to have super ability in nuggets).

You have to make a choice. Or .... take that $2.5 k and get one of each ! That seems like enough $ to do that, given ebay used-prices. Or start off with the compromise cross-overs, to learn the trade. Then you can always sell it later, and up to more advanced if you wish. If you started running in circles with other hunters hard-core in any of those venues, and saw you were getting spanked, you could always decide if you want to up-grade later.

 

[cudamark]

Looking at your listed priorities, I'd get a Gold Bug and an E-trac, if it was my choice, with my money, and I wanted new machines. If you get used machines, you could add an Excalibur and still stay under your budget.

 

[GoldenNerd]

Looking at your listed priorities, I'd get a Gold Bug and an E-trac, if it was my choice, with my money, and I wanted new machines. If you get used machines, you could add an Excalibur and still stay under your budget.

Gold Bug? 2? or Pro?

Also, isn't there a pretty solid overlap between the Excalibur and E-trac? But you would have both?

Thanks!

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... Also, isn't there a pretty solid overlap between the Excalibur and E-trac? But you would have both?

Yes, they're both about the same, depth wise, and soil-ability-wise. There's tonal differences (the excal has an annoying long beeeeooongggg target tail), but essentially the same as far as depth, etc...

The reason why the excal is considered a beach machine, is because it's water-proof. You can wade past the rod & coil length with it, scuba with it, etc... You don't have to wrap it in plastic (like you would for the e-trac), like if you were going to get wet. Or hunt during pouring rain (as is often the case for beach-storm erosion hunters). Or fear getting slapped by rogue waves while in the inter-tidal zone.

So if you're beach hunting objective is just normal above-water hunting, then sure, you don't need an excalibur. An etrac has the same depth and ability in the wet-salt-sand. And if per-chance you DID want to go out in the rain during a beach storm, you can always wrap at Etrac up in plastic and black tape for just that day. This is what I do. However, I have had several machines sent back to the factory for repairs d/t dunking. Like one time a wave knocked me down, and my machine went down with me. The plastic wrap job wasn't good enough to 100% stop water from finding its way in. And thus salt water got inside the controls and fried the machine. Doh! But as long as you're careful (I was testing fate and getting out in 20 ft. breakers!) you can avoid such encounters. However, if you were to do a LOT of beach hunting, then you would find that continual "wrapping in plastic" gets very old fast. Ie.: then you can't change batteries, or see your ID screen, or feel-your touch-pad controls, etc... with all that plastic inhibiting your view and access.

 

[cudamark]

Maybe I haven't found the right combination with the E-trac yet, but, I find the Excalibur goes deeper by a couple of inches if I hunt in pin point. In discrimination, it seems about the same as the E-trac. On the Gold Bug, don't get the Pro unless it's going to be your only detector. The Gold Bug 2 is the one I would get along with a bigger extra coil. The Pro is trying to be a coin/relic machine too with only fair results. It sacrifices a bit of it's gold ability in the attempt.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Mark, yes, that's a point I failed to mention: While the disc. depth is the same, yet you're right: the all-metal mode on the excalibur and sovereign are much more superior. Nice pleasant sound (vco growl), and very deep. I know that the Explorer series eventually tried to answer that gripe, by adding a similar VCO growl on the all-metal-pinpoint. But for some reason, it was never as good as the Excaliber/sovereigns.

Still though, about the only place you can hunt in all-metal, is on the beach. And even then so, if target beds start getting thick and you want to pass iron, you'll find yourself using disc. mode all the time anyhow. So .... there wasn't that many places I ever used my all-metal mode. On the beach occasionally it was fun, when targets were/are deep and spread out. I got a franklin half at over a foot deep doing it that way!

 

[Fletch88]

If you are going to spend a lot of your time prospecting and want a machine to hunt the beach occasionally that can handle high mineralization in the prospecting fields, you may look at the Whites TDI. It is a PI machine with ground balance that will work for nuggets and beach detecting, but it is not waterproof but great for wet/ dry sand detecting.

 

[cudamark]

Mark, yes, that's a point I failed to mention: While the disc. depth is the same, yet you're right: the all-metal mode on the excalibur and sovereign are much more superior. Nice pleasant sound (vco growl), and very deep. I know that the Explorer series eventually tried to answer that gripe, by adding a similar VCO growl on the all-metal-pinpoint. But for some reason, it was never as good as the Excaliber/sovereigns.

Still though, about the only place you can hunt in all-metal, is on the beach. And even then so, if target beds start getting thick and you want to pass iron, you'll find yourself using disc. mode all the time anyhow. So .... there wasn't that many places I ever used my all-metal mode. On the beach occasionally it was fun, when targets were/are deep and spread out. I got a franklin half at over a foot deep doing it that way!

I can adjust the E-trac for different pitches but the Excalibur, in pin point mode, has the "mosquito" buzz, which wouldn't be my choice. I can live with it since it gives me more depth but I'd rather have a low growl myself. I find it works good in all metal everywhere I've tried it except for around the fire rings/pits. I use the E-trac with a small coil and in Two Tone Ferrous for that chore.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

If you are going to spend a lot of your time prospecting and want a machine to hunt the beach occasionally that can handle high mineralization in the prospecting fields, you may look at the Whites TDI. It is a PI machine with ground balance that will work for nuggets and beach detecting, but it is not waterproof but great for wet/ dry sand detecting.

true. But that's not a good choice for land hunting. Ie.: parks, schools, ghost towns, etc... To the extent it can be made to ID highs versus lows versus iron, the minute you start off-setting the balance to achieve those types audio ID's, you've lost all the fabled depth

 

[Fletch88]

true. But that's not a good choice for land hunting. Ie.: parks, schools, ghost towns, etc... To the extent it can be made to ID highs versus lows versus iron, the minute you start off-setting the balance to achieve those types audio ID's, you've lost all the fabled depth

No way would I carry a TDI to a trashy park, sorry I missed that in OP. I was thinking wet sand beach and mineralized nugget grounds. I just thought of the perfect machine for parks and gold prospecting, and it has a beach mode, the Xterra 705 gold pack for less than $1000.

 

[cudamark]

With his budget, there are many better choices in all aspects of hunting, than the TDI. At the beach, you would be overwhelmed with iron sounds in some areas. I've only used a TDI a couple of times but some of the folks I detect with have used it extensively and they prefer the Gold Bug. (That's how I was able to use the TDI) They say the Gold Bug and it's high operating frequency will find the tiny nuggets that are the most common gold finds in their area. The small elliptical coil of the Gold Bug is easier to use in rocky or tight areas too. Big nuggets? I don't know....I've never found one!