CANNONS

[Peg Leg]

Question concerning cannons.
I have seen a number of cnnons on this forum but no names as to what style is the cannons were.
What I am looking for is a discription of a swivel cannon that was made in the late 1500's to the early 1600's. Something along the LOMBARD type cannon.
There was a posting of a few bronze cannons a while back but can't locate that posting at this time. Diving Doc had fantistic display of cannons from the UK but I am looking for Spanish swivel cannons.
Need a drawing or a photo of these cannons.
Thanks
Peg Leg

 

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[Smithbrown]

Are you talking about bronze swivel guns or wrought-iron swivel guns?

Are you talking about muzzleloading guns or breechloaders?

Smithbrown

 

[Peg Leg]

Bronze muzzle loading cannons

 

[Smithbrown]

So we are talking about bronze muzzleloading swivel guns?

 

[Peg Leg]

that is correct.

 

[Smithbrown]

Without seeing the gun in question, you can never be sure, but bronze muzzle-loading swivel guns are usually 18th century in date. I would be very surprised to see anything like that in a 16th century date.

 

[Peg Leg]

O.K. can you show me a photo of the cannons you are talking about or give me a website where I can see what one looks like.
Thanks
Peg Leg

 

[Smithbrown]

I did not say there were no bronze swivel guns- most (if not all) bronze 16th and 17th century swivel guns are breechloaders. Muzzleloading swivel guns tend to be later.

Smithbrown

 

[Smithbrown]

This is bronzebreechloader from the reign of Louis XIII of France- about 1625

http://www.culture.gouv.fr/culture/archeosm/archeosom/en/brescou-s.htm

 

[Smithbrown]

This wrought-iron breechloader comes from a wreck off North wales, about 1710

http://www.gtj.org.uk/en/item1/25473

 

[Smithbrown]

This one comes from a mid-16th century Spanish wreck- wrought iron and a breechloader
http://www.tcmuseum.org/gallery/image/a_swivel_gun/

 

[Smithbrown]

This one comes from a 16th century Venetian wreck- it has a bronze barrel with a wrought-iron holder to take the chambers. it is a very poor picture and you have to go to the last item on the page

http://www.devonmuseums.net/collection.show.asp?No=144

 

[Smithbrown]

and this is one is from a Dutch east Indiaman lost of Australia in 1720s- bronze and a breechloader.
http://australasia.freewebsitehosting.com/new_page_1.htm

 

[Smithbrown]

This example is Portuguese- 16th century- bronze and breechloading
http://www.arq.de/english/auction/cannon1.htm

 

[Peg Leg]

Smithbrown,
Thanks for all the information.
This helps to estiblish the date of what I have been looking at to be around the 18th century.
Peg Leg

 

[Peg Leg]

I just read that in 1722 Black Bart was killed by grapeshot fired from a muzzle loading swivel cannon fired from a British Warship.
Breach loading cannons were dangerous to fire and a number of SHOOTERS were killed on maimed.
Peg Leg

 

[Smithbrown]

In that case one would wonder why breechloading lasted so long; I forgot to include in my selection the bronze breechloader from EL Cazador, lost 1784

http://www.elcazador.com/bcannon2.htm

This danger of breechloading guns is something put forward by modern writers. In fact the sailors of the Republic of Venice in the late 16th century preferred breechloading guns because they did not have to put themselves in danger to load and use them. I would guess that muzzleloaders were as likely to blow up as Breechloaders; in theis period the technology is the limiting factor.

Smithbrown

 

[Smithbrown]

well, for one thing breechloading was quicker- you had the ready-loaded chambers to switch round, rather than have to pull the gun round and load through the muzzle.

But what the Venetian sailors were complaining about is that they thought they were safer because the gun crews were less exposed to the enemy fire. There is still a lot of debate about how muzzleloading guns were used in battle- only once, or outboard loading (which definitely was dangerous for the guncrew). No one really knows for sure when using recoil on carriages was first introduced to bring in inboard loading. It has been suhhested this was a majpr factot in the English victory in the Spanish armada.

But people in the past were not stupid- they continued to produce and use breechloading guns into the 18th century- they must have thought they gave them some sort of advantage over a potential enemy.

Smithbrown

 

[Peg Leg]

smithbrown,
At your website there is mention of coins found in the barrell of cannons. I recall that I talked with McKee while we were looikning at a stack of cannons in his back 40 at his Castle. He said that he had found several cannons with coins in their barrell. He thought that some of the weathly travelers stuck the coins into the barrell to keep from paying taxes.
I can see it now,a cannon filled with coins being fired at another ship. It would be like a fireworks display on the 4th of July with gold and silver going everywhere and being round they WOULD go in all directions AND WOULD MAKE ONE HELL OF A WHISTLING NOISE.
Similar to shooting a sawoffed shotgun with number 8,s . There would go everywhere.
Thanks for the website.
Peg Leg