CRH gains are taxable. INterestig article

jrf30

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May 7, 2006
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It talks about acquiring gold and silver at a lower cost. CRH would qualify as this too, since we are scquiring silver at a lower cost basis. This talks about some of the ways the IRS might treat our CRH gains and how they might find out about us. FYI. And I love the part where he says some customers have told him they will not report gains, but he forgets the names of those customers, so he can't help the IRS. :-) Bold emphasis is mine in the article.

<<If you purchased an ounce of gold for $300 in 2000 and sold it in 2012 for
$1,700, the IRS wants to collect capital gains income taxes on the $1,400 paper
profit. Even though the gold may have been held for more than 12 months in this
example, that doesn’t mean that the gain qualifies for the 10 percent or 15
percent capital gains tax rate. Instead, the tax rate will be the taxpayers to
bracket rate or 28 percent, whichever is lower. Congress established a higher
capital gains tax rate of 28 percent for collectibles, and defined precious
metals and numismatics as being included in this category.


taxes.jpg


Your Coin Collection and Your Tax Return
Learn the ways the tax law
works so you can take advantage of al the legal options available to you to when
you decide to sell! Get
your CD today!

Over the years, I have encountered substantial customer (and some dealer)
confusion on the issue of taxability of paper profits on precious metals and
rare coins. For most of the U.S. population, the purchase of such items is not
subject to sales or use taxes when purchased.

However, this tax
exemption does not have anything to do with whether federal income taxes are
owed on the sales or exchange of precious metals or rare coins.

Some people also have told me that since they did not receive
a Form 1099-B when they sold their gold or silver they weren’t required to put
such gains on their tax returns. Sorry, the IRS expects to see it on your tax
return even if the dealer to whom you sold them was not required to notify the
IRS of your sale.
The important point to emphasize is that it is the seller of
the merchandise who has the responsibility for putting the information on their
own tax return, not the dealer.

In addition, some customers over the
years have told me that they had no intention of reporting such paper profits
on
their tax returns. The IRS considers that tax evasion, which is illegal. I don’t
remember the identity of any such customers who told of such plans, so I can’t
help the IRS check on anyone.

I would not be surprised if some people
acquire precious metals or rare coins rather than stocks, bonds, or interest
bearing bank accounts because of the possibility of not paying taxes on paper
profits. However, it is possible that some of these people could be discovered
by coin dealer compliance with Section 352 of the USA Patriot Act of 2001.


Any coin dealer who purchases $50,000 or more of bullion-priced precious
metals within a 12-month period is required to establish an anti-money
laundering compliance program and keep a record of all transactions, whether
buying or selling and whether wholesale or retail, above a threshold dollar
amount. For most coin dealers, the record-keeping threshold kicks in at
transactions of $3,000 or more, but some dealers may have higher or lower
thresholds. Although dealers are not required to submit this information to the
U.S. government, it must be kept available should federal agents visit the
dealer and ask to see them. Although the stated focus of this compliance program
is to be on the lookout for “terrorists,” it is also possible that some tax
dodgers could be uncovered in the course of an investigation
.

>>

Just sharing information. :-)
 

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pong12211

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Good luck with that.. What a joke the govenment puts it in circulation and then stops and now that it's worth what it is they want to tax it what a crock...
 

CoinFetcher

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Is this outdated? I though gold and silver gains were not taxed.

Also, holding the silver halfs doesn't make you a tax criminal, but cashing out could.
 

bigmike0377

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Feb 8, 2013
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Solution: Find a gold and silver dealer and make buddies with him. I buy and sell all my gold and silver cash under the table. No sales tax when buying (or documentation of what I have) and not record of the sale. :) They get enough of my money on income and property taxes. They don't need to know about my gold and silver. That is for when they finally screw up enough to collapse. I will have enough G&S to flee the country lol.
 

CoinFetcher

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take great pride in paying your crh taxes... President obama will do great things with the money

After all, it's not YOUR money ( or silver ) - It belongs to everybody, EQUALLY.
 

LooseChange

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It is pretty clear cut what you are supposed to do when you sell your CRH-gotten PM for fiat.

So, what happens when you trade it for goods/services?

As an example, I paid $0.50 for a 1964 Kennedy half dollar. What if I trade it for fresh cut flowers to display on V-day while dining with my sweetie? Did I have a gain? How much of a gain? Did the flower peddler have income? How much income? What if that flower shop is known to occasionally give deep discounts as a promotional tool?

Then, what if the flower shop guy stacks that piece of Ag for many years and then later sells it for fiat? Did he have a gain? How much?

What if I'm acquiring those flowers in Utah (Google "Utah Sound Money Act").
 

ArkieBassMan

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It is pretty clear cut what you are supposed to do when you sell your CRH-gotten PM for fiat.

So, what happens when you trade it for goods/services?

As an example, I paid $0.50 for a 1964 Kennedy half dollar. What if I trade it for fresh cut flowers to display on V-day while dining with my sweetie? Did I have a gain? How much of a gain? Did the flower peddler have income? How much income? What if that flower shop is known to occasionally give deep discounts as a promotional tool?

Then, what if the flower shop guy stacks that piece of Ag for many years and then later sells it for fiat? Did he have a gain? How much?

What if I'm acquiring those flowers in Utah (Google "Utah Sound Money Act").

Technically, yes you had a gain and its taxable. If you traded a 1964 half bought for 50 cents for flowers, then your gain is the cost of the flowers minus the 50 cents you paid for the coin. You are supposed to report this gain as income and pay any associated tax on that amount. If the flower guy saves it for years then sells it, he would owe tax on the amount he sold it for minus whatever cost he had in the flowers.

Of course, there is virtually no way you could ever get caught "cheating" on your taxes in this manner, but if I understand tax law correctly (and I am by no means an expert) this is correct.
 

dejapooh

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Solution: Find a gold and silver dealer and make buddies with him. I buy and sell all my gold and silver cash under the table. No sales tax when buying (or documentation of what I have) and not record of the sale. :) They get enough of my money on income and property taxes. They don't need to know about my gold and silver. That is for when they finally screw up enough to collapse. I will have enough G&S to flee the country lol.

You are welcome to do this. You are a tax cheat and COULD suffer the consequences of being one, but go ahead with that scheme.
 

dejapooh

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Nov 14, 2012
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It is pretty clear cut what you are supposed to do when you sell your CRH-gotten PM for fiat.

So, what happens when you trade it for goods/services?

As an example, I paid $0.50 for a 1964 Kennedy half dollar. What if I trade it for fresh cut flowers to display on V-day while dining with my sweetie? Did I have a gain? How much of a gain? Did the flower peddler have income? How much income? What if that flower shop is known to occasionally give deep discounts as a promotional tool?

Then, what if the flower shop guy stacks that piece of Ag for many years and then later sells it for fiat? Did he have a gain? How much?

What if I'm acquiring those flowers in Utah (Google "Utah Sound Money Act").

If you trade that $.50 silver that cost you $.50 for a dozen roses that sells at the store for $9.50, you show a $9 profit on your taxes.
 

LooseChange

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Technically, yes you had a gain and its taxable. If you traded a 1964 half bought for 50 cents for flowers, then your gain is the cost of the flowers minus the 50 cents you paid for the coin. You are supposed to report this gain as income and pay any associated tax on that amount. If the flower guy saves it for years then sells it, he would owe tax on the amount he sold it for minus whatever cost he had in the flowers.

Of course, there is virtually no way you could ever get caught "cheating" on your taxes in this manner, but if I understand tax law correctly (and I am by no means an expert) this is correct.

If you trade that $.50 silver that cost you $.50 for a dozen roses that sells at the store for $9.50, you show a $9 profit on your taxes.

I realize that this is how it is supposed to work. Bottom line is that I have $0.50 in the coin (even though melt value is $10) and the flower sower has say $0.15 in his bouquet (even though retail is $8.75). According to the IRS though, I've had a capital gain of $8.25 and he has income of $9.85. Then, if he stacks the silver and sells years later at $12.50, he has a capital gain of $4.25. It is all dumb.

Sure the IRS would never come after either party over a daffodil or two, but given what Utah (and potentially other states) are doing, the question could amount to big dollars. Utah says that you can settle your debts with silver or gold US coins at intrinsic value rather than face value.
 

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