Digging the Roots

[Rebel - KGC]

TJB was a COOPER...?

 

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[franklin]

TJB was a COOPER...?

His grandfather was a Cooper.

 

[ECS]

His grandfather was a Cooper.

Are you referring to Thomas Beale of the duel who went to New Orleans or the Thomas J Beale character of the 1885 Beale Papers?

 

[franklin]

Are you referring to Thomas Beale of the duel who went to New Orleans or the Thomas J Beale character of the 1885 Beale Papers?

The Thomas J. Beale of the 1884 Beale Papers. I can not verify one way or the other whether the story is fact or fiction. I have tons of information that goes along with the story while on the other hand I can not find any verification of the journey to Sante Fe? Since the story would be based on 90 to 99 percent fact if it was made up makes it difficult. There is information to verify the information on the people, places and time line but no documents to verify the gold expeditions out West. They would have been kept secret anyway so it makes the story hard to confirm or deny.

 

[ECS]

By the same token, it would be hard for 30 men to keep this secret from friends and family, and the movement of the amount of gold and silver and the construction of a vault six feet underground during the moth stay at Buford's would go unnoticed.
Strangers and their activities in any close knit community such as Lynchburg and Bedford county during that time period would arouse suspicion.
Yet there is no contemporary confirmation of this, not even the basic gossip or rumors. Nothing.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

If you were a member of a Secret Society, it MAY be POSSIBLE to keep "Secrets" from family & friends... MAYBE in St. Loo...?

 

[Rebel - KGC]

10 men from Bedford, Va. go to St. Loo... pick up 20 more "Associates". 30 men in all; sounds like a RAM or CM Council, in a "Military formation". A guide in St. Loo recommended such & a "CAPTAIN" chosen from among themselves... heh. For the times... Knights Templar on "the Prowl".

 

[ECS]

"During this period rumors of Indian outrages and massacres were current, but no mention of Beale's name ever occurred. What became of him and his friends his companions is left entirely to conjecture"- Ward's 1885 Beale Papers
No family ever wondered what became of their son, brother, father?

 

[ECS]

10 men from Bedford, Va. go to St. Loo... pick up 20 more "Associates". 30 men in all; sounds like a RAM or CM Council, in a "Military formation". A guide in St. Loo recommended such & a "CAPTAIN" chosen from among themselves... heh. For the times... Knights Templar on "the Prowl".

Or a Shriner's parade with funny wagons and oxcarts.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Joke if you must; I am being SERIOUS here...

 

[Old Silver]

Joke if you must; I am being SERIOUS here...

He's making fun of me, over my thread about the ox carts. Mods have warned him.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Review the HISTORY of "SHRINEDOM"; started in NYC, AFTER the CONFEDERATE WAR, and the FEZ was ORIGINALLY KGC-style Crescent Moon with the STAR (pointing up). Seen a "pic" of an old Fez. MY Fez is pointing DOWN. SHRINERS were WEALTHY old men; REAL Movers & Shakers"...

 

[ECS]

I was making a joke , comic relief if you please, not aimed or directed at anyone. It was humor, no reason for anyone to take it personally.
* Shriner parades would have a series of strange and unusual motorized vehicles. *

 

[Rebel - KGC]

I was making a joke , comic relief if you please, not aimed or directed at anyone. It was humor, no reason for anyone to take it personally.
* Shriner parades would have a series of strange and unusual motorized vehicles. *

TY, in context of the "old days", cars were not available; to MY knowledge, not even Shriner's Parades... VERY secretive.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

STILL think that there MAY be a "connection".

 

[Rebel - KGC]

NO Clowns, Oriental Bands... they DID raise $$$$$$$$$$$$ for "kids", which continues on, today... MANY ads on TV, now-a-days; NEVER seen THAT before. "Burning hot sands of the desert", musta got to 'em... Shrine INTERNATIONAL is based in Tampa, Fla.; LOTS of WEALTHY old RETIRED ppl down there... heh.

 

[ECS]

"During this period rumors of Indian outrages and massacres were current, but no mention of Beale's name ever occurred. What became of him and his friends his companions is left entirely to conjecture"- Ward's 1885 Beale Papers
No family ever wondered what became of their son, brother, father?

"We determined to raise a party of not less than 30 individuals, of good character and standing... and financially able to encounter the expense. With this object in view, each one of us suggested the matter to his several friends and acquaintances..."
THE BEALE PAPERS, Beale letter, January 4,1822

According to Beale's letter, many people were aware of the perilous adventure due to having the "matter" presented to several good standing financially rich men. It is highly unusual for rich men of good standing to go missing from a community without one noticing , or being mentioned in a newspaper of the time.
There are many "vanished without a trace" events that are still discussed today, but this tale of 30 well healed citizens of good standing has never been.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

HA! The "well-heeled" rich men sound like Free-Masons; ONLY two Lodges in Lynchburg, Va. by 1859. "Good character & standing", "financially able", WHITE men are pre-"required" for WHITE Lodges. Black Lodges are Prince Hall Lodges & SEPARATE... BOTH got their charters from the BRITS. The Lodge in DC is "mixed", which I agree with.

 

[ECS]

"It was finally decided that it should be sent to Virginia, under my charge, and securely buried in a cave near Buford's tavern, in the county of Bedford, which all of us had visited, and was considered a perfectly safe depository" THE BEALE PAPERS, Beale letter, January 4, 1822.

Take note of "which all of us had visited".
When the Beale Party sent forth on their "perilous adventure" is was to hunt buffalo and grizzly bears, NOT to discover gold or silver, which according to the story in the letter was a fortuitous accident and they had to go to Santa Fe to obtain "everything for our purposes and for the prosecution of the work".

In other words, a mining operation was not a part of the original purpose of the rich men's hunt, but they ALL had visited and had knowledge of a cave near Buford's in Bedford county, which leads to the conclusion that these "financially able" men were from that area.
"What became of him and his friends his companions is left entirely to conjecture"-THE BEALE PAPERS
Well heeled rich men, being Freemasons or not, never returning to their homes, families, and community would arouse more than mere "conjecture", and would have been the subject of newspaper articles, yet there were none.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

LOL! They ALL continued to "Cali", looking for BEACH BABES!