Follow-up to "Why gold doesnt Ring up Gold" Digging erratic Signals.

Skippy SH13

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Follow-up to "Why gold doesn't Ring up Gold" Digging erratic Signals.

This is a follow-up thread to the first one I started a few days ago.
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/m...p-gold-aka-why-you-should-dig-more-trash.html

I decided not to just continue the other thread, because the topic is a bit different.

Specifically, last night, I decided to put my money where my mouth is, and specifically go to an area that I KNOW has been hit by MDers in the past (I've seen them there), and go behind them to dig the erratic signals. The purpose of this was to demonstrate whether or not there were gold items missed.

I STRONGLY expected there to be items, here. As noted by Tom in CA, this was about LOCATION... not about TRASH.

The location was a local skate park, smack dab in the middle of a bunch of subdivisions. The most common location for the kids to plop down in is under a large tree in front of the entrance to the skate ramp. I've personally hit this park several times, but never under this tree, because it was always chock full of kids during the day. In full disclaimer, In the past, I've pulled a gold ring from near the basketball court (about 20 feet away from the edge), and I like the tot lot here, because of the loose change. I know this park gets hit regularly from MDers, not only because I've SEEN them, but also because I've come behind and enjoyed the evidence (holes dug, etc.). Quarters and Dimes near the skate park should be plentiful (kids are always laying down in the shade), but are not... also indicating the area has been worked.

In one hour last night, I worked the 12 foot radius around the front part of the tree, and about a 4 foot radius around the back. That's it. I'd suggest this was about 200 square feet is all. I dug everything. Approximately 65-75 targets (a bit more than one a minute of finding, pinpointing, and digging) Here's the haul of non-gold:
Trash found with rings.JPG

There were only 2 dimes pulled and 2 pennies. This was unsurprising, though, given the fact I know the area gets worked over by MDers. Both dimes were surface finds, not yet fallen through the grass fully. I found exactly 11 nickels. These fall into the "pull tab" category on the detector. This is also evidence, in my opinion, that the area was worked over for large value coins. To find 11 nickels all separated, but no quarters or dimes in the dirt seems pretty obvious that someone has been through the area.

There was also 25 and one half pop tabs, 1 skateboard roller bearing, 2 bottle caps, and a small army of foil caps and gum wrappers.

With the exception of the 2 dimes, 2 bottle caps, and 1 roller bearing (which all showed up as solid coin signals), the rest of this was trashy signals, or strong pop top readings.

Two additional finds were detected and dug... One erratic, and the other a solid pop top signal. I almost gave up on the erratic first one because of the density of the roots, but decided to continue cutting the signal free. These are Rings # 57 and #58 for the year, and gold rings # 7 and #8.
Two Gold Rings.JPG
About 15 minutes in, then again about 40 minutes into the hunt, I found both of these gold rings. Each of them are 10K. The "Someone Special" ring with the diamond in it, was about 3-4 inches down, under a thick root that had to be cut, and literally had three roots growing through it (one through the main hole, and the other two through small holes in the lettering. That's a pretty strong indication it'd been there a while! The second 10K ring has a hear shaped orangeish colored gem (don't know what it is), and was found about 1/2 under the root mat in the dirt. It was right near the grass ring edge of the manicured tree ring.

My points are these:

1) LOCATION is key... Obviously, i knew there were lots of kids laying down in this area. I figured it was prime for lost jewelry.
2) Areas obviously worked by MDers, but that contain lots of trash still, are VERY viable.
3) Erratic signals are not always trash!

with the summary:

Digging the RIGHT trashy areas can be very lucrative.

Now... I also readily recognize there's a fair amount of LUCK in this hobby. Those two rings were fortunate finds, I get that... I could have just as easily found nothing! (and then I probably wouldn't have posted this, but that's another story, LOL!) But the fact remains, they were there when other MDers went over them... What WASN'T luck was the strategy to dig that location to uncover any missed treasures. :)

Cheers!

Skippy
 

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bigfoot1

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nice,your right..that had nothing to do with luck.
my wife and I decided to rehunt an area we have hunted several times last weekend.we call it ring valley(a clue!!).people pull over and play in the snow and picnic in the summer.We had hit this place hard and I mean hard several times but went to do what you did.

about 30ft.from the truck I hand a deepish iffy and dug.erratic trash signal.out popped an 18k signet mens ring,a honker..14 grams.my biggest gold ever.We were pumped and really got after it.I found the hunt really interesting.my wife got two junk rings then hit a 925 little band that was a small foil signal.

I cant decide if I'm happy about learning this or not.I have to rehunt everywhere I have ever been and many of my target id skills are now out the window.Its going to make me dig three times or more of the signals I encounter.

great post and super relevant for me...:occasion14:
 

WhiteTornado

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Nice work, well documented. I have begun to dig more signals this year, which is year #2 of detecting for me. You make the good point that it's not necessarily digging more signals everywhere, but digging them in the right areas.
 

Tom_in_CA

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Skippy, thanx for the good post. Let's cut the chase here: In your experiment (of going to a cherry picked site) you dug "65 to 75 targets", of which 2 turned out to be gold rings. Now let's be dreadfully honest:

a) Most md'rs would GLADLY settle for those type ratios. (approx 1 to 35-ish, junk-to-gold ratio), if that were a possibility.

b) I have a feeling you were either 1) very lucky and bucked the odds, or 2) had some type of turf that's more condusive for better jewelry ratios, that most-all-other-turf.

Let me "balance comment" with MY real-life "experiment" in the next post to follow:
 

Tom_in_CA

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In 2006, they city of San Francisco over-hauled an old urban park, to prepare to install an artificial grass soccer field. This would require them to scrape off the top 6" to 18" of grass, to make-way for the installation of the new field. The park dated to the 1870s or '80s. Thus YOU CAN IMAGINE how much fun we had going in there each night, after the tractors had left.

The first couple of nights were amazing. Clean virgin scrapes of 6 to 10" in enormous areas! There were zones where EVERY SINGLE "coin" sound beep was going to be silver, wheaties, IH's, etc.... Ie.: all the new stuff was gone. And since it was a construction/demolition zone (ie.: just dirt, no turf), we could treat it with "relic mindset", (ie.: dig all, go for the nickels too, etc.... , since digging was easy)

However, by about the 3rd night, they started folding back in some of the top soil, as they sought to get their exact gradient or whatever. In other words, targets started to get mixed, where it was not necessarilly "all old". Still though, since digging was easy in jumbled dirt everywhere, we could continue to treat it with relic-dig-all mindset.

So I did an experiment: For that entire 10-ish day period, I kept EVERY SINGLE item I dug. I did not pitch out the trash at the end of each hunt. Kept it all in boxes, for further study and count later. In the end therefore, I was able to count out all the coins, the trash, the gold rings, etc.... Yes I got some gold. Perhaps about 9 or 10 pieces. A few rings, a watch back, some charms or whatzits, etc... HOWEVER, the trash count (foil wads, tabs, slag, etc ....) was mind-boggling. On the order of thousands. Thus in the end, the gold to trash/clad ratio, was on the order of 500 to 1 or some crazy statistic like that. In other words, it simply would not have paid for anyone to have gone to that park (which was a particularly blighted run-down neighborhood) to have looked for gold.

Quite a bit different than your 1 to 35-ish ratio. Yet every-bit-as-much a real-life experiment in turf hunting for gold.
 

bigfoot1

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tom,
while I agreed that his finding those rings wasnt due to luck(anytime you target a specific find and are successful,I consider it skill)it was fortunate that they existed where it was expected they might.my ring described above is the same thing.I was fortunate that I was correct hence it was intentional and given forethought.Having adapted my normal approach with this very possibility in mind,going to a place I knew would be possible even if more difficult,I consider it a skill find.

its like playing skilled poker.the more skills you have earned the"luckier"you are to others.

:occasion14:
 

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Skippy SH13

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Hey Tom,

NO I completely get what you're saying. Man, if I could dig 80 targets and get 2 gold rings every time I'd quit my job. This DEFINITELY was a location based choice, and there was a fair amount of luck involved. BUT... the point of the post is that that particular area appears to have been coin shot to death, and the foil range ignored. That upped the odds tremendously of having good finds, but it by NO MEANS was a guarantee!

Also that 200 square feet of turf probably held 50% of the jewelry available in the 6000 square feet surrounding the skate park. It's not just about location in terms of LOCALE... sometimes it's location in terms of SPECIFIC SPOTS...

That, I believe was where you were pointing in the last thread.

Again, though, I'm not advocating digging everything everywhere... but by golly, I'll bet every other MDer who passed over this spot (if they knew) would KICK themselves for not digging the 60 pop tabs. but that's hindsight. Under another tree in another park, I'm certain I'll dig 60 pop-tabs and only have 60 pop-tabs to show for the effort. LOL!

BUT... it definitely ups the odds to think about and employe a bit of strategy to our detecting!

Skippy, thanx for the good post. Let's cut the chase here: In your experiment (of going to a cherry picked site) you dug "65 to 75 targets", of which 2 turned out to be gold rings. Now let's be dreadfully honest:

a) Most md'rs would GLADLY settle for those type ratios. (approx 1 to 35-ish, junk-to-gold ratio), if that were a possibility.

b) I have a feeling you were either 1) very lucky and bucked the odds, or 2) had some type of turf that's more condusive for better jewelry ratios, that most-all-other-turf.

Let me "balance comment" with MY real-life "experiment" in the next post to follow:
 

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Skippy SH13

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OK, over lunch today, I got to thinking about why it's not luck, but it's also not simply a guarantee.

I think the right word for it is "fortunate." Lucky, to me, is when I'm walking back to the car, idly swinging the coil and DING! A big old sound pops out and you find a fat ring. That's luck.

Sometimes we say, "We make our own luck," but I think this really means that with a little (sometimes a lot) of planning or prep, we can strategically change the odds of being fortunate.

Just like Tom got excited about San Francisco's top-removed field, and strategically upped his odds of having a "fortunate" day by going when the soil was removed... It wasn't ONLY about location. In fact, all that stuff was there with the topsoil on it... It was when he did something a little different that he improved the likelihood of being fortunate.

In my case, it was the strategic choice to check all the drops in a very tight location (where the vast majority of people congregate). We do that with Tot lots, sides of fences at ball fields, under trees, on beaches, etc... there's not much difference to it. It's why we strategically go out and check places after large events...

All that comes to a head that you can actually IMPROVE your odds of being fortunate... and still have a slump. :)

At the same time, the newbie who goes out and catches a big fish, gets the trophy buck, bags a big tom turkey, or swings the coil for the first time and finds a $15K sapphire and gold ring... Those people are lucky. :)

Somedays it's better to be lucky than good... but DANG if I haven't upped the odds of being fortunate with a little strategy. :)

Cheers!

Skippy
 

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Skippy SH13

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Very interesting thread Skippy -- enjoyed reading it.

Glad you found it enjoyable. I've found this forum is the 2nd part to my hobby, allowing me to continue to enjoy it, even when not swinging!

Skippy
 

Kevin in IN

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It's this kind of thread that gets us thinking, and when we think we tend to make better choices. What I can gather from your finds, is the the other hunters are running enough disc to miss the nickles and foil and alot of the gold will fall right in that slot. The ratio of targets to trash was something we would all like to see, but it's your choice of location that really upped those odds. It's well worth our time to observe people and their habits. Kevin
 

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