One clue about waltz's vein that got me about his ore.

[Doc4261]

It has been said Waltz vein was 18 inches a 1/3 gold and next to it a soft red vein 3 ft wide 1/2 gold. Think about that. Why would Waltz waste his time on the quartz vein. Maybe take some personal momentos of the vein. But I know if I was him I would of took the easy stuff. 2 times wider and richer and easierr to take out. Probably why he was said to have gold nuggets. I'm sure most of what he took out was not of the vein but of the red hemitite next to it. Just my thoughts.

What is your take on it?.

 

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[azdave35]

It has been said Waltz vein was 18 inches a 1/3 gold and next to it a soft red vein 3 ft wide 1/2 gold. Think about that. Why would Waltz waste his time on the quartz vein. Maybe take some personal momentos of the vein. But I know if I was him I would of took the easy stuff. 2 times wider and richer and easierr to take out. Probably why he was said to have gold nuggets. I'm sure most of what he took out was not of the vein but of the red hemitite next to it. Just my thoughts.

What is your take on it?.

the first thing i would question is where did that clue come from?...who started it?

 

[Doc4261]

Good question. Just pointing some obvious info if was true.

 

[azdave35]

Good question. Just pointing some obvious info if was true.

doc...most of the clues floating around today are highly suspect...i wouldn't put much stock in any of them..they haven't helped anyone find the mine so far

 

[Oroblanco]

doc...most of the clues floating around today are highly suspect...i wouldn't put much stock in any of them..they haven't helped anyone find the mine so far

Amen and ditto - check out the source of that clue before putting any faith in it.

That said if you found a rich gold vein that has cinnabar too, who cares if it was the Dutchman or the Easter Bunny mine?

 

[wrmickel1]

Doc

I’d stay away from any clues and follow actions of Julia and her Queer Quest. A well documented news story from the time. She goes to the face of the Superstition Mountain, Ruth dies not to far from there, Miss Jones and Piper set up camps near the Needle and Native Americans have stories of Spanish people filling the needle with gold. All in the same basic area. Not to mention the Peralta Stones are based on Weavers Needle to.

Babymick1

 

[JohnWhite]

Doc

I’d stay away from any clues and follow actions of Julia and her Queer Quest. A well documented news story from the time. She goes to the face of the Superstition Mountain, Ruth dies not to far from there, Miss Jones and Piper set up camps near the Needle and Native Americans have stories of Spanish people filling the needle with gold. All in the same basic area. Not to mention the Peralta Stones are based on Weavers Needle to.

Babymick1

I personally do not believe that the PSM's are based on Weavers Needle Mick...But we are all entitled to our own opinions...

Ed T

 

[deducer]

doc...most of the clues floating around today are highly suspect...i wouldn't put much stock in any of them..they haven't helped anyone find the mine so far

Just because the mine hasn't been found doesn't mean the clues are suspect.

There are two or more separate accounts of the original miners returning to the LDM many (or a number of) years later, a Senor Ballesteros who said he could "hardly recognize the area" and Drigo's uncle who said the place had been "shaken up and flooded some." There are one or two other accounts that I'm too lazy to dig up.

There have been massive geological events, especially the major earthquake of 1887.

From the Arizona Daily Gazette, May 5. 1887, p.3, col. 2.

Immediately after the shock all eyes were turned to the southeast from where came a deep rumblings and they saw a dense dust hanging over one of the mountains on the south side of the Salt River about nine miles above the confluence of the Verde River (Superstition Mountain).
It is reported Sgt. Lucking and Company Clerk Reni saddled up and rode toward Superstition Mountain returning at 10 p.m. They reported one side of the mountain broken down and debris scattered for several hundred yards around. It looked as though there had been hundreds of tons of dynamite under the base and that when it exploded it had raised the mountain bodily, scattering the fragments in every direction. The seismic action created a dust cloud similar to a volcanic eruption.

It would logically follow that the LDM is buried under many tons of rock and debris.

 

[azdave35]

Just because the mine hasn't been found doesn't mean the clues are suspect.

There are two or more separate accounts of the original miners returning to the LDM many (or a number of) years later, a Senor Ballesteros who said he could "hardly recognize the area" and Drigo's uncle who said the place had been "shaken up and flooded some." There are one or two other accounts that I'm too lazy to dig up.

There have been massive geological events, especially the major earthquake of 1887.

From the Arizona Daily Gazette, May 5. 1887, p.3, col. 2.



It would logically follow that the LDM is buried under many tons of rock and debris.

arthur...i'm not sure who ballesteros or drigos uncle is..(maybe you could elaborate)...also if waltz knew of an earthquake in the area of his mine he would have said something to julia or holmes?...obie stoker found a rich mine in 1930..he took 10k worth of gold out of it...not long after this he said an earthquake hit and collapsed his tunnel and he was never able to get back into it......there is evidence he was telling the truth about the earthquake...on the trail between garden valley and second water spring there is a stretch of the trail covered in big rocks and if you look at the hills around you can tell where the rocks came from..to look at the area you can see they were once on the hills...my point is when an earthquake hits it leaves evidence ..and if the ldm was covered by an earthquake it will never be found so you may as well give up on it....

 

[Riverbum]

I wonder sometimes just how many mines been lost due to earthquakes or any other events that move the earth. I live near a mine that was doing really well in the 1890's when it got buried by an avalanche, lost some miners and is next to impossible to recover due to the Talus the avalanche brought down with it. Everybody around these parts know where the mine is but one look at all that rubble, rock, scree and you loose all desire to dig for it.

 

[deducer]

arthur...i'm not sure who ballesteros or drigos uncle is..(maybe you could elaborate)...also if waltz knew of an earthquake in the area of his mine he would have said something to julia or holmes?...obie stoker found a rich mine in 1930..he took 10k worth of gold out of it...not long after this he said an earthquake hit and collapsed his tunnel and he was never able to get back into it......there is evidence he was telling the truth about the earthquake...on the trail between garden valley and second water spring there is a stretch of the trail covered in big rocks and if you look at the hills around you can tell where the rocks came from..to look at the area you can see they were once on the hills...my point is when an earthquake hits it leaves evidence ..and if the ldm was covered by an earthquake it will never be found so you may as well give up on it....

Both Ballesteros and Drigo's uncle were with the Peralta expedition when they went to the Superstitions. Ballesteros's men met up with Don Miguel Peralta at his camp on the Rio Salado, at the bend in the river known as Mormon Flat where he was then put in charge of the arrastras. All this is under water, today, under Canyon Lake.

Adolph Ruth had been corresponding with Drigo Peralta and another Peralta in the St. Louis area- there is a letter from Drigo to Adolph where Drigo describes his uncle as having said what I quoted to you.

Ballesteros returned in 1895 and this is when he said the area was just "unrecognizable."

Waltz died in 1891 but the last time he was at the mine was way before that- certainly before 1887. According to Mitchell, Waltz made his last trip in 1884. This would, I think, explain why he insisted on taking Julia and Rhiney, because he had been away so long that he would have to reorient himself as well.

and if the ldm was covered by an earthquake it will never be found so you may as well give up on it....

As I have said many times, I am not searching for anything. The idea of prospecting holds no appeal for me.

 

[Doc4261]

U say u have no appeal for prospecting. What is your game?

 

[wrmickel1]

I personally do not believe that the PSM's are based on Weavers Needle Mick...But we are all entitled to our own opinions...

Ed T

100% they are, and can prove it in 10 seconds, But are they based on the lost dutchman’s Mine. Can’t prove that yet or if I ever can. I think I could or say no there not, if I had all the info Clay Worst has.

Babymick1

Ps Travis never made the Stones

 

[JohnWhite]

100% they are, and can prove it in 10 seconds, But are they based on the lost dutchman’s Mine. Can’t prove that yet or if I ever can. I think I could or say no there not, if I had all the info Clay Worst has.

Babymick1

Ps Travis never made the Stones

I too could prove that the stones depict an area that is not in AZ Mick...But I will not waste my time sharing what I know with the treasure hunting world at this time...I am still trying to figure out IF they may or may not be Ophir, due to a passage in Psalms 72...Mainly verse 5 where it mentions the sun and the moon...Or could it possibly have anything to do with the Cursum Perficio...

Ed T

 

[Doc4261]

100% they are, and can prove it in 10 seconds, But are they based on the lost dutchman’s Mine. Can’t prove that yet or if I ever can. I think I could or say no there not, if I had all the info Clay Worst has.

Babymick1

Ps Travis never made the Stones

I have to agree with Ed T. Weavers needle has a meaning but not depicted in the stone maps. I do agree with u that I don't believe Travis made the maps either.

 

[Doc4261]

I too could prove that the stones depict an area that is not in AZ Mick...But I will not waste my time sharing what I know with the treasure hunting world at this time...I am still trying to figure out IF they may or may not be Ophir, due to a passage in Psalms 72...Mainly verse 5 where it mentions the sun and the moon...Or could it possibly have anything to do with the Cursum Perficio...

Ed T

There I can say the psm's are about the Sups 100%, but to give the proof would give up all my work. Not ready to do that here.

 

[wrmickel1]

I have to agree with Ed T. Weavers needle has a meaning but not depicted in the stone maps. I do agree with u that I don't believe Travis made the maps either.

Agreed, Weavers Needle is not depicted on the maps, but it’s representative meaning is. The 18 places are the numbers
and symbols, except the ten in the heart inset. It’s more like the metric system.

And Julia and company sure got interested in Weavers Needle as Ed Piper Miss Jones and all the old timers.

Babymick1

 

[JohnWhite]

Agreed, Weavers Needle is not depicted on the maps, but it’s representative meaning is. The 18 places are the numbers
and symbols, except the ten in the heart inset. It’s more like the metric system.

And Julia and company sure got interested in Weavers Needle as Ed Piper Miss Jones and all the old timers.

Babymick1

And what do all of the people you have mentioned have to show for all of their beliefs Mick

Just curious...

Heck...IF I had the means...I would have a carbon dating of some wood from said site performed just for fun...I believe I saw some wood in the area that I believe is from the old operations...But who can say for certain

Ed T

 

[wrmickel1]

They all wound up on the losing end.
Its a play on words Ed. They were looking for the Heart, But they were all at Start.
You don’t Finnish the race if you stay on start.

babymick1

 

[JohnWhite]

They all wound up on the losing end.
Its a play on words Ed. They were looking for the Heart, But they were all at Start.
You don’t Finnish the race if you stay on start.

babymick1

Well Mick...I have been at the start of the trail...Where I have seen the flame of the sacred heart without the heart...And I have been to the heart at the end of the trail...I could go on...What else can I say

Ed T