Persher Code

I wrote this in response to someone's breaking of a code:

[I don't know if you have had any formal training in this field, but I suspect you haven't. If you had, you would know that almost every book ever written can be "proven" to contain a secret code. An excellent example of this would be the prediction of Lady Di's death along with Dodi's and Henri's in the text of "Moby Dick". The method used is known as "Equidistant Letter Sequences". Bible codes, which can be "proven" to exist, are really a result of "the laws of random choice".]

This may or may not have some relevance in this conversation.

Joe Ribaudo
 

that is very true . in all write mass there is a random facts of relation between letters in random sequences showing up threw out a the text..

it shocks me you knew that i knew that when i was 7 years old ...

it happends in ham radio keying all the time ...

and yes i do agree with that statement , but the fact remains ..the ratio and rates on this kind of random matches are set by avg and very seldom sway from those ratio.

i am glad you stated that because one of the books tested was in fact Moby Dick... so you do watch TV now and then ...
or someone has repeted the facks somewhere else...


well said
 

cactusjumper said:
I wrote this in response to someone's breaking of a code:

[I don't know if you have had any formal training in this field, but I suspect you haven't. If you had, you would know that almost every book ever written can be "proven" to contain a secret code. An excellent example of this would be the prediction of Lady Di's death along with Dodi's and Henri's in the text of "Moby Dick". The method used is known as "Equidistant Letter Sequences". Bible codes, which can be "proven" to exist, are really a result of "the laws of random choice".]

This may or may not have some relevance in this conversation.

Joe Ribaudo
Click to expand...

I've only read a little bit on that kind of thing, but I firmly believe it's easy to read way more into something when you feel you have a vested interest in the outcome.

I work as an analytical chemist and I've always found it amusing to sit in meetings with R&D guys and listen to them theorize and use my data to convince themselves that the experiment or project they are working on is giving them the result they want. In many of those cases I can use my same data to postulate different theories that result in the exact opposite conclusions.

There's nothing wrong with doing extensive research and digging into all the facets of a problem, but it's only successful if you keep an open mind that your theory might be wrong rather than skewing everything towards the belief that you are right and "forcing" the data to fit your theory. I'm positive it's no different in treasure hunting. I've heard way too many stories (and I'm sure all of you have too) about people who've devoted significant portions of their lives searching for a lost treasure and they get themselves so personally involved and obsessed by it, that they eventually get to the point where they can't see beyond what they've convinced themselves of - despite being presented with theories just as valid (or even more so) as the ones they believe.

It's not at all an easy thing to do, but I would imagine that when trying to decipher the meaning of a coded map etc..., it pays significantly to take long breaks from it so when you go back you can see it with a fresh eye rather then getting yourself stuck in a rut of looking at it the same way over and over.
 

I still hope to see a clear example of the Pesher/Pershur code, that can be proven.

As for the Bible code, I am in disagreement with you CJ on this one, have read several books on the subject in recent years and yes you can find a small number of "hits" in any long text using a skip-letter code, while the Bible code has a huge number of hits, far too many for sheer chance. There are numerous web sites that espouse both views (that it is a false code and that it is a true code) and I have no intention of trying to change your mind (or to hijack this thread with Bible codes) just wished to say that I disagree, and think that particular code is genuine.

For there to be a Pesher/Pershur code, there had to be creators of it. Are there any known references to such originators, in which they admitted to having created it, or hinted at it? Thank you in advance,

Oroblanco
 

QUOTE " I've heard way too many stories (and I'm sure all of you have too) about people who've devoted significant portions of their lives searching for a lost treasure and they get themselves so personally involved and obsessed by it, that they eventually get to the point where they can't see beyond what they've convinced themselves of - despite being presented with theories just as valid (or even more so) as the ones they believe."


Hmm who might fit that discription ??? ??? ???
 

Bowman,

"i am glad you stated that because one of the books tested was in fact Moby Dick... so you do watch TV now and then ...
or someone has repeted the facks somewhere else..."

That is the medium of research, for some folks, but I prefer to read books by the experts.

The study you are speaking of was done by Brendan McKay at the Australian National University. There were thirteen statements found in Moby Dick dealing with the assassinations of famous people using EDLs. I could list those names, if you like.

A good deal of my own knowledge of codes and cyphers, comes from the books of people like Simon Singh, Michael D. Coe, Simon Martin with Nikolai Grube and Linda Schele with David Freidel. I have exchanged correspondence with Michael Coe, which only shows I was interested enough to ask him some questions. He was kind enough to send me answers each time.

Beyond that, I have read most of the works of the various Treasure Hunters who wrote on the subject of codes. None of that makes me claim to be the kind of expert that you do, but I have a passing familiarity with the subject.

The books of all of the authors I have mentioned are within a few feet of my computer. When that fails to provide the answers I seek, like you, I will search the internet. Unlike you, I try to focus my searches on the topic. Using your "shotgun" approach, the laws of random choice come into play again and again.

Good luck with your own breaking of the code.

Joe
 

Peerless67 said:
QUOTE " I've heard way too many stories (and I'm sure all of you have too) about people who've devoted significant portions of their lives searching for a lost treasure and they get themselves so personally involved and obsessed by it, that they eventually get to the point where they can't see beyond what they've convinced themselves of - despite being presented with theories just as valid (or even more so) as the ones they believe."


Hmm who might fit that discription ??? ??? ???
Click to expand...

I figured someone would think I was pointing out a particular person here but I wasn't - honestly.

For the pure enjoyment of reading a treasure hunting story (or if you need a break from thinking about the LDM), pick up a copy of "Sweat of the Sun, Tears of the Moon." I became fascinated with Inca culture and the possibilities of lost treasure in the mountains of Peru and Ecuador when I was still in late grade school and read a story in a Lost Treasure magazine. It's an excellent book and tells what ends up being a rather sad story about a man named Eugene Brunner who spent the greater part of his life searching for the treasures supposedly hidden by the Inca's when they found out their leader had been captured and killed by the Spanish.

It always struck me reading and re-reading that book over and over how Brunner was always convinced day after day, month after month, year after year that he was THIS close to finding the treasure if he could just take ONE more trip, or get ONE more person to help, etc... To me, Brunner is the epitome of the "treasure hunter" phenomena - I truly believe at some point, his search became 100% about proving his theories and had nothing to do with actually having any of the treasure.

I'm guessing there are many similar stories of LDM hunters.

Sorry to stray off topic here a bit - like I said though, if you need a break from the LDM research, but still want to fuel your treasure hunting blood, pick up that book and read it - you won't regret it.
 

Let's rein in a little. The pesher code deals primarily with hidden messages - saying one thing, and meaning another to those 'who have eyes to see'. Not too difficult, really, if you've been allowed into the club and understand the language. It's just a low-tech way to communicate 'secret messages' via the common language. All it takes to get the message is some sort of Rosetta Stone of word/idea associations. It's all set up to begin with. You might have done it as a kid.

The real complexity begins when you use mathematics, geometry, astronomy and other aspects of what used to be known as a 'classical education' to communicate arcane messages to those in the know. The underlying languages are the natural laws and patterns of the physical universe. The recent theories presented to explain 'KGC treasure layouts' rely heavily on this concept. Probably the most compelling evidence of the phenomena are the 'sacred geometry' patterns of clues and landmarks allegedly marking Knights Templar treasures in France.

The well-known (why?) Peralta Stones seem to qualify as secret coded information relating presumably to something of value presumably located within in the area known today as the Superstition Mountains. While I personally believe these carvings are a hoax perpetrated to foster the LDM legend, I also feel there may well be a valuable cache secreted somewhere in the vicinity. If I were young and ambitious, I would be doing a whole lotta map work plotting key landmarks, carvings, etc. and looking for associations. Don't ignore the G&SRM system.
 

I have been searching for the Swift's Mines for some time now and have found three of them, and other related Swift sites/markers, in their exact locations from the journals. After excavating the Rich Mine recently, I found some evidence to suggest that there may be more to these Templar/Masonic codes than meets the eye! :thumbsup:
 

Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 120 days.
Unless you're sure you want to reply, please consider starting a new topic.

ya i think perhaps i do wish to bring this topic back , one because it covers a broad range of possibilities , and two maybe to try and shed some light . like so many others here i can only offer opinion based on observation , but what the heck .

about the Templar's , is it possible they were in the southwest united states long before the Spanish ?i guess anything is possible , I am not trying to offend gollum here , but it sure seems to me that there was a lot of more masonic / knights templarish customs and symbolism used by the indigenous tribes , long before they were ever initiated into a white mans lodge of more modern times . big secrets back in the day , kept by many of the groups that have been mentioned in this topic . oaths taken, something about being slit ear to ear if broken . and then every once in a while something is found that could be construed as proof . i realise its not concrete proof but this could be one or those things that may lead credence to the idea that the Templar's were here and had contact in a more pre Colombian time.



now before someone comes looking for me , i must say that this token is not mine . i did not find it , but was allowed to film it for the purpose of trying to identify it . as best as any one could come up with , it is a french merchant token , or was any way . minted between 1400 and 1497 . the front side is pretty close to a jeton of that time period , but it is my opinion that sometime in antiquity , it may have been altered . it look like it had been pounded flat and at least some of it redone by God only knows who . it was found in a Fremont Indian cave , just a small hole really , surrounded by more native petroglyphs a couple of feet back in . like i said i did not find it , but really have no reason to doubt those who did . it is possible the iconography used could have dated back to the 1200's because we were not able to come up with an exact match for the folks involved . the symbols on the front border are in relief on the token where all the other examples i have seen any way are stamped . and it is possible that it 's original owners were the knights Templar . now it was not found in Arizona , but if a guy hiked up the hill , you can see Az from where i was told it was found .

i am not trying to offend the bowman here either , but i would be of the opinion that the stone maps he claims to have solved are of a more modern origin , that does not nessisarily mean they are a hoax , per say . i can't really get into this part in great detail , because it would violate confidence . and i find myself walking a fine line sometimes . i hope the cloud watchers as some of us get called look deep into this object , it really is something to behold . more like a picture persher .LOL enjoy.///bob
 

Springfield wrote:


So that is persher. Adams had no front name was said by J. Frank Dobie in his version of the story.

George Mason Adams; A relative of mine, who passed the true legend down in my family back in 1883, Show Low, Arizona. On his fifth trip into the Tontos, he was wounded in the gut via an Apache arrow. All other hands of the party lost. It took him three days to make it back to the Old Show Low Calvary Saloon where he stumbled in onto the floor and nearly died in the arms of one of my uncle's grandfathers. Adams moved to Spanish Fork, Utah with his daughter Martha in 1893 and never returned.
 

Twisted Fork said:
Springfield wrote:


So that is persher. Adams had no front name was said by J. Frank Dobie in his version of the story.

George Mason Adams; A relative of mine, who passed the true legend down in my family back in 1883, Show Low, Arizona. On his fifth trip into the Tontos, he was wounded in the gut via an Apache arrow. All other hands of the party lost. It took him three days to make it back to the Old Show Low Calvary Saloon where he stumbled in onto the floor and nearly died in the arms of one of my uncle's grandfathers. Adams moved to Spanish Fork, Utah with his daughter Martha in 1893 and never returned.
Click to expand...

Hmmm. That's interesting. Question: was GM Adams a mormon?
 

Eventually I as far as I am aware. Most likely a convert in and around the period he became involved with the Peralta digs along the Salt. His daughter married a Mormon family ranch foreman that she met in the Show Low area, when the family owned a cattle operation, free ranging the territory. To be more exact, she married into our family but here first husband died, leaving her to re-marry another man by the name of Dusty Rhoads, of the now lost Rhoads mines legends of the Utah territory. I think that Dusty was little involved with the mines in any way, but his family handled the gold given them through the Ute tribe, who in turn released it to Brigam Young and so fourth.
 

Springfield said:
Twisted Fork said:
Springfield wrote:


So that is persher. Adams had no front name was said by J. Frank Dobie in his version of the story.

George Mason Adams; A relative of mine, who passed the true legend down in my family back in 1883, Show Low, Arizona. On his fifth trip into the Tontos, he was wounded in the gut via an Apache arrow. All other hands of the party lost. It took him three days to make it back to the Old Show Low Calvary Saloon where he stumbled in onto the floor and nearly died in the arms of one of my uncle's grandfathers. Adams moved to Spanish Fork, Utah with his daughter Martha in 1893 and never returned.
Click to expand...

Hmmm. That's interesting. Question: was GM Adams a mormon?
Click to expand...

Springfield,

Unfortunately, Mr. Fork can't really answer any of your questions about George Mason Adams. The last time he started down this road, it ended with me putting him on Ignore. That was because he had no clue about the history of the family. :help:

George Mason Adams came to America, with his mother, in 1856. He was six weeks old whey they sailed from England. They arrived on the ship,"Columbia". His parents were both Mormons and George was born into the faith. "George was baptized at Alpine City, Utah in 1856 by John Wesley Vance and confirmed a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day-Saints, the same day." :read2:

After being baptized a second time, Oct. 1, 1875 by John Devey and confirmed the same day by Albert Marsh. "He was ordained a Deacon Dec. 12, 1874 by John Devey." :read2:

George Mason was a Mormon long before he came to Arizona Their first son, George William Adams, was born may 23, 1879 in Alpine, Utah. Their second son, Edward Franklin was born March 20, 1881 in ShowLow, Arizona. :read2:

The family has no record of George Mason Adams being the man involved in the Lost Adams legend. :dontknow:

If you would like any information about George Mason Adams, or his descendents, I will be happy to provide you with the true facts.

While Mr. Fork may be a descendent of George Mason Adams, he has his families history a bit twisted. ::)

Take care,

Joe
 

Lost Adams Diggings. Northeasterly direction New Mexico, Lost dutchman mine Northeasterly direction New mexico. Arizona became a U.S. state on February 14, 1912 before this it was New Mexico. Twisted Fork i am truly impressed. I am new here and already i can tell you definately know what your talking about. Its pretty obvious this guy cactus has ignored some strait forward questions. I havent read where you have ignored anyone and every thing ive read from you, makes perfect sense. every thing ive read from cactus looks like he ignores or avoids important questions and issues quite a bit. Its pretty obvious he works to create a smoke screen and trys to send people in the opposite direction away from the truth, muchless something of real and great importance. I Wonder Why?
 

He knows his books and such as the research is available, and none of it would surprise me; Mormons and I do not get along as a general rule of thumb. ?

Of what I do know, Adams found the very same site as Waltz and Wiser. Adams started in Show Low.....The other two Dutchies started out from Phoenix. Somewhere in between, all of them found a whole lot of nuggets of rose quartz, riddled with gold. Our family retains the exact descriptions handed down a couple of generations apart. I knew my uncle very well from the time I was a runt.

He was a dude by nature, not so much the hard welded frame of his father who ran cattle in the territory in question. He was a straight, hard core dude who smoked a cigarette like a man. He bounced me on his lap a time or two to boot.

Adams left this man his testimony face to face and they shared in the experience of seeing hot sweaty nags fresh off the trail, with their packs stuffed full of high grade rose.
 

[4 Miscellaneous / Dowsing / Re: Why does everyone hate dowsers so much?on: Sep 28, 2007, 05:07:15 PM
Started by bigticket, Message by Twisted ForkRelevance: 7.3%
I am a direct descendant of a little know old German by the name of George Mason Adams. He is however famous according to an Arizona legend know as the "Lost Adams Diggings." Grandpa Adams returned from the desert 5 times with his horses loaded down with chunks of pure gold and rose quartz. 8 of his friends were killed by the Apache Guards of the mine and on the fifth trip, George came back into Show Low with an arrow shot through his gut. He left a map in the family and never returned to the mine and caches. The map was handed down through his daughter, but was eventually lost hidden in a bible. However, enough knowledge was retained by family members to tie it all together and locate the site back in the early eighties. It is a sorry fact of life that all of those folks looking for the Dutchman off in the distance, are no where near the location and that 3 German buddies all died with the secret. Twisted]
_________________________________

There should be considerable doubt about the above story.

"George Mason Adams, born October 1, 1856, in Northamptonshire, England. He is the third son of David and Maria Thetford Adams." Source: "George Mason Adams And Martha Louise Devey Descendants And Ancestors" by Emma H. Adams

Both parents were English, and so was George. The first clue.......might be his last name. He was not German.

George M. Adams has nothing to do with the Lost Adams legend.

Just keeping it real.

Joe Ribaudo
 

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