Public beaches or private?

[ghost7071]

Are most beaches considered pubic unless they're adjacent to a home or hotel? Do the hotels own them out to a certain distance from their building fronts? How do you go about finding out if it's ok to hunt or not other than by just going in and asking?.....

 

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[S.S.Tupperware]

Well if we knew where you where, someone might be able to help...

 

[Dano Sverige]

Doesn't really matter where he is, it's the same the world over. Detect until someone tells you otherwise and then write to the county council involved for permissions. If you're worried about a place or get given hassle...just do the 4am - 9am shift.

 

[N2CU]

I was detecting a public beach (see my recent post) and someone told me there's a law something to the effect that 20 feet from the high water mark is public, no matter what the "owner" claims. They gave the legal term but I can't recall what it was to look it up.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Only land above the dunes (or highest water mark) can be privately owned along the ocean-fronts (lakes and rivers of course are going to be different). I know here in CA, for instance, this is an issue at various times where rich property owners in Malibu (where movie stars and millionaires live) have tried to claim their beach (even the wet sand zone) is "private". But they have been over-turned again and again, and restricted from forbidding access, so long as the persons are below the high water mark. I don't think that's strictly a CA thing either. I believe it applies to all the pacific and atlantic seafront beaches.

And as for the definition of "highwater" I would deem to be historical high-water mark. Ie.: up hiiiggghhhh, since ....... as we know ........ some storms reach further back in the dunes occasionally. Ie.: not the "high water" mark of the previous night's high tide (since tides fluctuate of course each day, week, etc....)

So as Dano says, just go. Ask no one. If someone has an issue, they're welcome to tell you, but I seriously doubt anyone cares. If it aint posted or fenced, I'd say they're full of bologna. But as I say, I seriously doubt anyone cares. If other people can stroll on by as regular beach-goers, why can't you?

 

[Can Slaw]

What state? What country? Laws vary. You have National Seashores (closed), State Parks, all are different, Leased water rights, antiquity laws. Lots of variables not knowing what beach area you area asking about.

 

[Buried Crap NJ]

To add to the great answers here. There's always a but! While its mostly true most any where's in the USA that your good to the high water mark for that giving day, the but here is you must stay15 feet from any structure. Same in true in the water with Boats and docks 15 ft! Now the other but is you MUST gain access to below the high water mark by a legal means. Getting there through the gates at a closed beach is not technically legal.( rarely enforced) Going through the free access points is. Paying at any one beach is! When I get stopped on Private? beaches. I just tell them the Supreme Court Says that's the beach
(point finger) This is the ocean!

 

[OBN]

Riparian Rights


Riparian rights are a system of rights and duties that determine the reasonable use, duties, and allocations of water to owners of waterfront property. Riparian rights are rooted in English common law, so they are typically implemented in former British colonies such as the eastern United States, Canada, and Australia. In principle, these rights ensure that riparian owners can make reasonable use of water adjacent to their property while protecting the rights of other riparian owners.



Riparian Rights
Thomas Strong, P.L.S.


Laws with respect to the claims of ownership of lands under bodies of water and waterways have its foundation in English common law. U.S. National Water Commission, A Summary-Digest of State Water Laws, p.3, 1973.
While England recognized a public interest in all waters affected by the ebb and flow of the tides, all fresh water inland lakes and streams above tidewater were classified as private waters in which the public had no rights. Thus, under English common law, the public's ownership interest extended only to the bed of the lakes and streams that were subject to the ebb and flow of the tide. Barney v. Keokuk 94 U.S. 324, (1876).
Those bodies of water and waterways which were subject to the ebb and flow of the tide were considered to be" navigable waters" under English common law. The English crown owned the bed to the navigable waters in trust for the public use. The bed of non-navigable waters, (private), was owned by those who owned the land adjacent to or upon which the non-navigable water flowed.
As a result of the American Revolution, each state acquired absolute ownership of all land beneath their respective navigable waters which had been held by the English sovereign under the so called "public trust doctrine". Shively v. Bowlby, 152 U.S. 1, (1894).
New states admitted into the Union since the adoption of the Constitution have the same rights as the original States in the tide waters, and the land under them, within their respective jurisdictions. The title and rights of riparian or littoral owners in the soil below the high water mark are governed by the laws of the states, subject to the rights granted to the United States by the Constitution. Skelton on the Legal Elements of Boundaries and Adjacent Properties, Second Edition, (1997).
Navigability
In determining riparian ownership it is important for the land surveyor to determine whether the waterway is navigable or non-navigable. Basically the surveyor needs to determine if the waterway is navigable- in- law or navigable- in- fact. Tidal waters are generally considered navigable-in-law, if said waters can serve some useful commercial purpose. This is according to the Federal definition.


Navigable-in-law is based on the English common law definition of what waters were considered navigable and include only those waters, which are tidal.
Navigable- In-Fact pertains to whether or not the waterway has ever been used for trade or commerce, or other valid purposes under state law. Also, a determination of whether or not the waterway is susceptible to the use of the public applies. A great deal of time often results in research in order to determine this type of navigability. In non-tidal waters, navigability for title purposes generally is a question of navigability-in-fact.
In the United States a general rule is that riparian owners along tidal, navigable waters own to the high water mark. This also applies where the water is tidal but not navigable. However along navigable, non-tidal rivers the laws of the state you are in would apply.
Along non-tidal, non-navigable waters, the riparian owners generally hold the title to the bed. Along tidal or navigable waters the title to the bed in generally held by the state for the benefit of the public.
In tidal waters, navigability for title purposes appears to be not always based on navigability-in-fact. In some states public ownership appears to extend to submerged lands subject to the ebb and flow of the tide, regardless of actual navigability. For example, in Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, New Jersey, New York and Texas, State ownership extends to all waters subject to tidal ebb and flow, but in California, Connecticut, Florida, North Carolina and Washington, public ownership is based on navigability-in-fact. Maloney andAusness 1974.
Boundaries in Streams
The most common case involving non-sovereign water boundaries is that involving a stream as the boundary between two parcels of land. In such cases where the deeds of the premises call, "to the stream", the center of the main stream would be the boundary. This is called the thread of the stream. When there are multiple channels, then the main channel would form the boundary. This is called the thalweg. It is the deepest part of the channel. This type of boundary would shift if the thread of the stream shifts with time, unless such a shift is due to avulsion.
Boundaries in Lakes
Rights associated with water that is not flowing are called "Littoral". Generally land beneath non-sovereign lakes are owned by the surrounding upland owners. When all the deeds call "to the lake", each owner has title to a center point. This creates a complicated boundary problem since there is a lack of a main channel and a lake is rarely perfectly round. Where the description in the conveyance uses language such as "to the shores" or "along the shore", then title to the lands underwater is not conveyed. Similarly where the description in the deed makes reference to features on dry land, such as the bank, shore

 

[ghost7071]

Presently I'm in north Louisiana but I was talking in general for when I get to go to the gulf coast of MS and LA, or other places.

 

[Can Slaw]

Presently I'm in north Louisiana but I was talking in general for when I get to go to the gulf coast of MS and LA, or other places.

To answer your question in general, the states own the water rights from the high tide line down to and including the water, making it public property. The exception would be if the State has leased that ground to a Marina or similar business. Hotels, resorts, condos do not own from high tide down to the waters as much as they wish the did, they do not. They can however kick you out of their dry sand, they do own that.