Swamp Gold

[Bigcypresshunter]

ECS your last link doesnt work.

BDD I repeat Im not backing anybody. Im not playing games. Im after the truth and nothing but the truth. I may ask tough questions and/or make requests you dont like and Im sorry if anyones feelings are hurt along the way. Im not really a treasure hunter and I dont care how long it takes to collect historical research. I realize it takes time and I am enjoying the mystery.

Im sorry but I clicked like to GMD52's post. He is giving you a readers viewpoint.

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

BCH-This site contains records and maps of Miami and the Everglades during the Civil War.Most were compiled from articles written in THE MIAMI NEWS by Rose Wagner,who was 9yo in 1861 and are eyewitness accounts.
Note the mention of CSA John C Breckinridge who stoped in Miami,April 6,1865 with CSA blockade runner John Taylor Ward on their escape to Cuba.Remember,Breckinridge had a part of the remaining CSA Treasury with him.Another source for the legend?
Also is mentioned the Confederate deserters who hid and had shacks in the Everglades.Another source for the legend?
http://digitalcollections.fiu.edu/tequestafiles/1993/93_1_03.pdf

Would CSA Treasury information be found in Washington DC?

Would love to read the link.

 

[releventchair]

punch in library of congress c.s.a. treasury. or maybe better, Library of Congress Home

when searching abbreviation is no good, enter Confederate States of America treasury. on second page is records 1854 1889 18,500 items.if any one dares!

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

punch in library of congress c.s.a. treasury. or maybe better, Library of Congress Home

when searching abbreviation is no good, enter Confederate States of America treasury. on second page is records 1854 1889 18,500 items.if any one dares!

Ok thanks

 

[Bigdogdad]

BCH-Thanks for posting the article about the 1000 pounds of gold. Maybe more can be found about it. As I said before the guys with me that day a long time ago had a book with them that talked about it. I am really not sure what they had as I was driving and they were in the back and I never asked to see it. I was young and cocky and I had Ovid leading me to the gold. That was all I felt I needed at the time. To this day I still believe in him and this site. Yeah I know, now I am old and still cocky, only now I am a bit grumpier.

 

[releventchair]

box 116 reel 66 in previously mentioned area would be interesting,computer not my forte but i,ll try figuring access with out some one going to physical site. not seeing how though, sixty million manuscripts l.o.l.

 

[ECS]

Would CSA Treasury information be found in Washington DC?

Would love to read the link.

I posted the CSA treasury link previously on this thread.
The FIU link does not open?-Search FIU.EDU Miami during the Civil War,there is great information there-a census from 1861 with all names listed,accounts od schooner runs to Key West for supplies,the Jupiter lighthouse incident,Breckinridge's stopover during his flight to Cuba,"yellownecks" in the Everglades,ect,all from eyewitness accounts of the people that lived it.

 

[ECS]

box 116 reel 66 in previously mentioned area would be interesting,computer not my forte but i,ll try figuring access with out some one going to physical site. not seeing how though, sixty million manuscripts l.o.l.

REPORTS OF THE SEC OF THE TREASURY OF THE CSA 1861-1865 Call# 1-5071 Reel 1pos2
REPORT ON THE CONDITION OF THE TREASURY DEPT Call#1179conf
The CSA was near bankrupt at the end of the war,England and France had claims against the CSA for money loaned for future cotton shipments.
To resolve this issue,the United States enacted the 14th Amendment to the Constitution,Sec 4,stating that the US government or any state would be obligated to pay any and all debts that occured from the insurrection and rebellion against the US,ie,the CSA states,which were now part of the United States.
The United States also sued England for damages for doubling the duration of the war by aiding the CSA.At the GENEVA TRIBUNAL,Sept 14,1872,the US was awarded damages of $15,500,000 in this case.

 

[releventchair]

Wanted to get into army quartermasters records,a mention of lost and destroyed within them( or stored with them).
Curious if any lost gold reported or info on cattle acquisitions.

 

[ECS]

... Notice this paragraph from the Miami News 1949. Yes it says a half ton of gold which Im sure you noticed..

This article may well be the origin of the CSA swamp gold legend,and may be an embellishment of the reporter.
Prior to this article,there is no mention of this in any newspaper,eyewitness diary,or historical record.All other mentions of this story came after this,be it in books or treasure mags.
In 1865,the CSA did not have a 1/2 ton of gold in their treasury,nor would they have sent a payment to England in the last 4 months of the war-they knew by that time the cause was lost.
The remenants of the CSA treasury after Richmond's fall,April 2,1865 went with Davis,Benjamin,and Breckinridge,and some was recovered at Chennault's Washington,Ga plantation and at Yulee's Cottonwood plantation in Archer,Fl,and yes,there are also legends that gold can be found at those locations.

 

[Bigdogdad]

What are the chances that anyone may have before, during, or after the Civil War, altered, lied, fudged, misrepresented, hidden, scammed, skimmed, stole, mistaken, misled, "borrowed", or otherwise, as far as facts, figures or how much money there actually was and what happened to it? I guess we are supposed to believe anything in writing? Come on, get real. At what point in the war was gold being shipped, before, during, after? Our government can't keep track of the money now even with all the computers and "safeguards" that we have in place. What was it like during a CIVIL WAR almost 150 years ago? There is hidden gold waiting to be found. Who knows when it was put there or by whom? Not me. Not ECS.

 

[lastleg]

Wanting to believe against all odds is a peculiar manifestation of true treasure hounds. It's like
my little dog who thinks she can catch a sparrow. Funny thing is she does sometime catch one.
Then she always looks at me as if to say, "See, I can catch birds, you doubter."

 

[ECS]

After the fall of Fort Sumter,April 13,1861,the newly formed CSA scrambled to obtain hard money.Southern banks were liberated of their gold and silver deposits,the US mint at New Orleans was captured,and southern belles were ask to donate their jewelry for the cause.The CSA secured specie loans by selling bonds to investment houses and speculators in England and France ffor future cotton sales.Most of this money was used to buy warships,munitions,small arms,and supplies.
Later on,under CSA Sec of State Judah Benjamin,a network of blockade runners were established,but most carried cotton,not gold,for trade in England and France.The "Cow Calvary" out of Fort Meade traded cattle in Cuba for gold coin,because cracker cowman,Jacob Summerlin would only accept gold for payment for his cattle.
Hard currency was so scarce for the CSA,even by Oct 1,1862 when a shipment 900oz of gold and 17,000oz of silver (remaining bulk from the New Orleans mint)went missing after Lewis Quillian converted it to bars(CSA ASSAY OFFICE,Dahlonega,Ga) and crated it for shipment to Atlanta,CSA Sec of Treasury Christopher G Memminger wrote several letters of despair,noted its loss in CSA Treasury records,which still exist today.That shipment amounted to $38,570 and was considered a major loss.
The point being,the Confederacy kept close watch on their limited hard assets,every purchase(many on specie loan credit) and loss were well documented,and the records exist today.
No CSA gold shipments were made after the war,unless one considers that which Benjamin and Breckinridge had with them during their flight.
Every state of the former CSA has tales and legends of lost Confederate gold,if you add the amount of gold from all of
these,it would add up to more than ever existed in the CSA Treasury-and to believe the Confederacy was that inept with their money,is ridiculous and blind wishful thinking.

 

[releventchair]

Thats a good way to put why when i see destroyed or stolen on the big library's list in war department documents i want in them. froggin around the only story is far away near fort Tombecbe civilian gold,course its a story.

 

[Salvor6]

Here is another twist to the story of the CSA treasury. In April 1865 a schooner called the Abbey Bee left the Steinhatchee River with 20 million in gold headed for Cuba. This private vessel was owned by David Yulee. After leaving the river you would think it would head south for Cuba but the A/B saw smoke from a steamship. The USS Sagamore of the East Gulf Blockade Fleet gave chase. The A/Bee headed north. The Sagamore caught up and sank the A/B. In 1972 a shrimper snagged the anchor of the A/B and brought it up. In the net was a one foot tall gold statue of an angel. The angel fell out but the shrimper brought the anchor on board and cut the chain.

When treasure hunters found out about this they searched all over the Gulf off Steinhatchee. Problem is that they all searched south of the river. My buddy got stopped by the Coast Guard because they thought he was a drug boat. My buddy has a 32' Fountain. Local fishermen would follow him all day. The shrimper that found the anchor died in a fire aboard his boat. I met a friend of the shrimpers son who has his dad's log book with the Loran numbers of the wreck. I know approximately where the wreck is but its a long drive up to Steinhatchee and I can't find the time to go there.

Does the Abbey Bee have whats left of the Confederate treasury? Who knows since there were no records kept. Hey ECS, maybe you could find something more about this. I tried to get the logbook of the USS Sagamore but the National Archives wants $200 to copy the month of April from microfishe.

 

[Salvor6]

More to this story: The anchor was conserved by the state archaeologist. They confirmed that it was Civil War era. A restaurant owner in Crystal River bought the anchor and it sits in the parking lot now.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

BCH-Thanks for posting the article about the 1000 pounds of gold. Maybe more can be found about it. As I said before the guys with me that day a long time ago had a book with them that talked about it. I am really not sure what they had as I was driving and they were in the back and I never asked to see it...

The Miami News article I posted was 1949. I dont believe they completely made up the half ton story but its possible the story got twisted. LP Harvey says the information came from the Historical Society. I am guessing the Davie Historical Society near were LP Harvey and his buddies lived. I will just have to go there myself to see if there is anyone still alive that can help. I should also like to speak with LP Harvey himself, Hully Stirling or William Gill. Does anyone have any contact information or know if these men are still alive? I work for the Game Commission seasonally so I may be able to ask around again. I tried before but I dont have a lot of free time and I dont want to jeapardize my job. . Maybe Bramblefind will track them down or a living family member.

I spoke with the son of a man who worked with the Game Commission in the 50s and I obtained some exremely interesting and valuable information that cannot be found in any book. The point is that the book you guys had a long time ago was probably written after the story hit the news wire and may not be of much help even if you remembered the author. I need to track down the original source. LP Harvey stated he was searching since 1946 so we need something older than 1946.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Here is another twist to the story of the CSA treasury. In April 1865 a schooner called the Abbey Bee left the Steinhatchee River with 20 million in gold headed for Cuba. This private vessel was owned by David Yulee. After leaving the river you would think it would head south for Cuba but the A/B saw smoke from a steamship. The USS Sagamore of the East Gulf Blockade Fleet gave chase. The A/Bee headed north. The Sagamore caught up and sank the A/B. In 1972 a shrimper snagged the anchor of the A/B and brought it up. In the net was a one foot tall gold statue of an angel. The angel fell out but the shrimper brought the anchor on board and cut the chain.

When treasure hunters found out about this they searched all over the Gulf off Steinhatchee. Problem is that they all searched south of the river. My buddy got stopped by the Coast Guard because they thought he was a drug boat. My buddy has a 32' Fountain. Local fishermen would follow him all day. The shrimper that found the anchor died in a fire aboard his boat. I met a friend of the shrimpers son who has his dad's log book with the Loran numbers of the wreck. I know approximately where the wreck is but its a long drive up to Steinhatchee and I can't find the time to go there.

Does the Abbey Bee have whats left of the Confederate treasury? Who knows since there were no records kept. Hey ECS, maybe you could find something more about this. I tried to get the logbook of the USS Sagamore but the National Archives wants $200 to copy the month of April from microfishe.

Interesting thanks for posting

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

After the fall of Fort Sumter,April 13,1861,the newly formed CSA scrambled to obtain hard money.Southern banks were liberated of their gold and silver deposits,the US mint at New Orleans was captured,and southern belles were ask to donate their jewelry for the cause.The CSA secured specie loans by selling bonds to investment houses and speculators in England and France ffor future cotton sales.Most of this money was used to buy warships,munitions,small arms,and supplies.
Later on,under CSA Sec of State Judah Benjamin,a network of blockade runners were established,but most carried cotton,not gold,for trade in England and France.The "Cow Calvary" out of Fort Meade traded cattle in Cuba for gold coin,because cracker cowman,Jacob Summerlin would only accept gold for payment for his cattle.
Hard currency was so scarce for the CSA,even by Oct 1,1862 when a shipment 900oz of gold and 17,000oz of silver (remaining bulk from the New Orleans mint)went missing after Lewis Quillian converted it to bars(CSA ASSAY OFFICE,Dahlonega,Ga) and crated it for shipment to Atlanta,CSA Sec of Treasury Christopher G Memminger wrote several letters of despair,noted its loss in CSA Treasury records,which still exist today.That shipment amounted to $38,570 and was considered a major loss.
The point being,the Confederacy kept close watch on their limited hard assets,every purchase(many on specie loan credit) and loss were well documented,and the records exist today.
No CSA gold shipments were made after the war,unless one considers that which Benjamin and Breckinridge had with them during their flight.
Every state of the former CSA has tales and legends of lost Confederate gold,if you add the amount of gold from all of
these,it would add up to more than ever existed in the CSA Treasury-and to believe the Confederacy was that inept with their money,is ridiculous and blind wishful thinking.

I used to collect treasure stories as a kid. I cut an article from a newspaper and saved it. In around 1970ish, some heavy equipment digging in a New Orleans street uncovered a large stash of gold and silver coins all dating from the Civil War era and older. It was quite a surprising large amount. The article says that people jumped into the hole fighting and clawwing to fill their pockets with gold and silver coins. Its sounds crazy but true.

Im sure I have the article somewhere. I have several large boxes of this type of stuff (newspaper clippings) I collected but I would have to search. I posted the article here in 2004 but I cant find it. TN couldnt save everything in the beginning days. Marcs server was too small.

The article is proof positive that somebody had a large amount of gold and silver during the Civil War and buried it.

 

[ECS]

Here is another twist to the story of the CSA treasury. In April 1865 a schooner called the Abbey Bee left the Steinhatchee River with 20 million in gold headed for Cuba. This private vessel was owned by David Yulee. After leaving the river you would think it would head south for Cuba but the A/B saw smoke from a steamship. The USS Sagamore of the East Gulf Blockade Fleet gave chase. The A/Bee headed north. The Sagamore caught up and sank the A/B. In 1972 a shrimper snagged the anchor of the A/B and brought it up. In the net was a one foot tall gold statue of an angel. The angel fell out but the shrimper brought the anchor on board and cut the chain...



Does the Abbey Bee have whats left of the Confederate treasury? Who knows since there were no records kept. Hey ECS, maybe you could find something more about this. I tried to get the logbook of the USS Sagamore but the National Archives wants $200 to copy the month of April from microfishe.

The final action of the USS SAGAMORE was June 7,1864.Along with the USS CYLDE,they captured over 100 bales of cotton in the vicinity of Clay Landing on the Suwwannee River.
The USS Sagamore was decommissioned Dec 1,1864 at Philadelphia and was sold June 13,1865 in New York.
If this event ever happened,it did not involve the Sagamore.
Also the CSA Treasury had a liitle over 20 million dollars in its coffer at the early stages of the war.
This story may be local lore.
Jan 15,1862,the Union USS HATTERAS entered Cedar Key and set fire to 5 schooners and 3 sloops loaded with cotton and turpentine,burned Yulee's RR depot and 7 rail cars loaded with turpentine,and pulled down the telegraph wires.On Oct 4-6,1862 a landing party from the USS SOMERSET ended the Confederate salt works at Cedar Key,by destroying the boilers.
By 1864,Cedar Key became headquartes for a Union force.
Yulee's Margarita Plantation and sugar mill at Homosassa was burned to the ground by a landing party from the USS ARIEL.
Yulee was arrested May 27,1865 and taken to Jacksonville,Fl,and later to Fort Pulaski in Savannah,Ga.
Correspondence between Yulee ,Jefferson Davis,Judah Benjamin(Yulee's cousin)can be read at:
http://drbronsontours.com/bronsonlevydavidmosebiography.html