What banks order from the fed

[boxerchip]

Im not sure if this changes bank to bank or area to area, but in your experience what banks order from the fed?
Brinks may or may not search their coins but ill tell you what, ive never found more than one coin a roll in a brinks box, and never more than 2 coins in a box. ive had fed boxes with 11 coins a roll, and 4 rolls a box so im not interested in brinks... only fed.

I know Bank of America orders from the fed... Who else?

BBT does not, they get brinks.

 

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[phrostie]

chase does, around here fifth third doesn't, nat city doesn't, old national doesn't, huntington doesn't.

 

[jim4silver]

Im not sure if this changes bank to bank or area to area, but in your experience what banks order from the fed?
Brinks may or may not search their coins but ill tell you what, ive never found more than one coin a roll in a brinks box, and never more than 2 coins in a box. ive had fed boxes with 11 coins a roll, and 4 rolls a box so im not interested in brinks... only fed.

I know Bank of America orders from the fed... Who else?

BBT does not, they get brinks.

Although I cannot speak for every area, there seems to be some confusion on what it means to get coins from the "fed".

That term is used generically by banks on where they get their coins because the banks have accounts with the fed. However, coin couriers (such as Brinks, Dunbar, Garda, Loomis, etc.) act as liasons for the banks and the fed. These couriers count, sort and roll coins for the banks on behalf of the fed.

To the best of my knowledge there is no coin rolling that takes place at any of the Federal Reserve Banks (12 regional banks with a total of 25 branches per Wikipedia). I cannot prove this with evidence, but the fact that all the coin courier websites mention that they count, sort and roll coins for banks tells me that is how it is done.

Some CRHers refer to the yellow striped CWI rolls as fed rolls, but those wrappers are used here by Garda, who rolls the coins not the fed itself. I imagine it is the same in other areas. Dunbar here uses generic brown wrappers that say $10 halves and Brinks uses its familiar brown and white striped wrappers that bear its name.

By the way, in the past I have had some Brinks rolls that were completely silver (mix of 40s and 90s), but those were few and far between.

Jim

 

[enamel7]

Jim you are correct. Someone always calls them "fed" boxes, but what does the wrapper have on the outside? None of them say Federal reserve. Brinks usually has their own wrapper, yet others purchase theirs from companies that make them. Like the "String" wrappers.

 

[boxerchip]

hemm, I am not sure BOA does get boxes from the fed then my mistake. I know they get boxes that are quarter boxes flipped inside out, contain the marks 500 halves on all sides, and the rolls are white with brown stripes on the ends (sort of like brinks rolls) but with out saying brinks on them. I would have thought a company (such as brinks) would always mark its rolls but dunbar garda and others maybe dont? I have no idea... just know brinks = crap in my neck of the woods, and BOA rules. I want more coins but have all the BOAs maxed out. looking for other branches, tried BBT and just got crap.

 

[FingerGrime]

What about brand new coins that you get. Would those most likely come from a federal reserve rolling facility?

Perhaps we could perform some sort of experiment...get everyone on here to take pics of their type of rolls and then ask their banks where they get their coins from?

 

[boxerchip]

Im not sure if this changes bank to bank or area to area, but in your experience what banks order from the fed?
Brinks may or may not search their coins but ill tell you what, ive never found more than one coin a roll in a brinks box, and never more than 2 coins in a box. ive had fed boxes with 11 coins a roll, and 4 rolls a box so im not interested in brinks... only fed.

I know Bank of America orders from the fed... Who else?

BBT does not, they get brinks.

Although I cannot speak for every area, there seems to be some confusion on what it means to get coins from the "fed".

That term is used generically by banks on where they get their coins because the banks have accounts with the fed. However, coin couriers (such as Brinks, Dunbar, Garda, Loomis, etc.) act as liasons for the banks and the fed. These couriers count, sort and roll coins for the banks on behalf of the fed.

To the best of my knowledge there is no coin rolling that takes place at any of the Federal Reserve Banks (12 regional banks with a total of 25 branches per Wikipedia). I cannot prove this with evidence, but the fact that all the coin courier websites mention that they count, sort and roll coins for banks tells me that is how it is done.

Some CRHers refer to the yellow striped CWI rolls as fed rolls, but those wrappers are used here by Garda, who rolls the coins not the fed itself. I imagine it is the same in other areas. Dunbar here uses generic brown wrappers that say $10 halves and Brinks uses its familiar brown and white striped wrappers that bear its name.

By the way, in the past I have had some Brinks rolls that were completely silver (mix of 40s and 90s), but those were few and far between.

Jim

From the US Treasury FAQs
"According to Federal Reserve sources, over 20 billion coins valued at well over $2 billion pass through their coin processing units each year."

"When a private bank needs coins to provide to you and its other customers, it purchases them from a Federal Reserve Bank. Banks have checking accounts at the Federal Reserve Banks, just as you do at your bank. To buy cash for you, your bank uses special checkbook money called a “reserve balance.” The coins make their way back to the Federal Reserve Bank at some point because banks often accumulate more cash than they need for day-to-day transactions. They deposit the excess cash into their checking account at a local branch of the Federal Reserve Bank until their customers need it. Coins circulate from the Federal Reserve Bank to the private banks to you and back again until they are worn out, unfit for circulation. The Federal Reserve replaces those coins by ordering new ones from the U.S. Mint—and once those coins are minted, a new circulation cycle begins. A circulating coin generally lasts 30 years or longer."

Now im really confused. Perhaps different branches of the fed use different rolls?

http://www.ustreas.gov/education/fact-sheets/currency/distribution.shtml
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/coins/production.shtml#q3
in case you wanted to see where I got those quotes.

 

[FingerGrime]

I'm not sure if this information is totally accurate, but it seems like it could be... http://reviews.ebay.com/BU-Roll-Buy...re-Rolls-Come-From_W0QQugidZ10000000001449256

 

[jim4silver]

The coin couriers in a sense act as the fed in this process.

Here are some weblinks for the main coin couriers.

Garda
http://www.gardaglobal.com/cash_cash.php?lang=en

Brinks
http://www.brinksinc.com/Products-Services/Coin-Processing.html

Loomis
http://www.loomis.us/products-services/Pages/coin-processing.aspx


If you check out the Loomis one you actually see the guy pouring coins from a bag into a counter. It CLEARLY states that they act as the federal reserve coin depots center for the fed.

Dunbar
Could not get the site to open, but google it yourself and see.

Thus, if you see one of these coin couriers delivering to your bank, you can know that they are rolling and sorting the coins for the fed. Each website clearly states that they process the coins.

This is really more an issue for curiosity and not relevant to CRHing success. Find banks that use different couriers if you want a better mix of coins.

Jim

 

[boxerchip]

I'm not sure if this information is totally accurate, but it seems like it could be... http://reviews.ebay.com/BU-Roll-Buy...re-Rolls-Come-From_W0QQugidZ10000000001449256

If that is the case then brinks is pulling from the same fed branch as the other companies.... and there would be silver in brinks, but there is none! so either these companies have massive stock rooms and the BOA ones are much older, or brinks searches coins.

Back to the topic though... If that is the case then what company does BOA use for coin delivery and what other banks use them?

Thanks

Jim, I dont want a better mix of coins, I want the same ones!

Also I am not trying to argue or start a bickering or anything but this forum is labeled as: "Post your "Roll Hunting" experiences and questions here!" this question directly pertains to my coin roll hunting, so I thought it would fit best here, if you see it differently I would be more than happy to hear your view on it.

Thanks for all your help guys.

 

[joad]

I've had zero luck with BB&T...white with black stripes and no company marks. I have done really well with the white with yellow stripes. Quite a few babks around these parts get these. Wrappers have a company mark of Harrisburg, PA. Then their are the white with brown stripes which I have not found in boxes yet, only a few rolls at a time, but I have done well with those.

 

[boxerchip]

hahaha alright so ive been researching this all night trying to figure out whats going on. I found this news article:

http://www.king5.com/topstories/stories/NW_100108WAB_monroe_robber_floating_escape_TP.ce3930c1.html

Great story, and a video well worth watching.

But my question is, if that BOA uses brinks it seems like they all would, but the ones around here dont. So do banks just pick a coin service? do they all use different ones? Jim, you may have been right... this is heading more towards curiosity the more we get into it. haha.

hemm well perhaps ill just have to sample a few different banks and see what I can find.
Thanks everyone whos helping to figure this out

 

[jim4silver]

I'm not sure if this information is totally accurate, but it seems like it could be... http://reviews.ebay.com/BU-Roll-Buy...re-Rolls-Come-From_W0QQugidZ10000000001449256

If that is the case then brinks is pulling from the same fed branch as the other companies.... and there would be silver in brinks, but there is none! so either these companies have massive stock rooms and the BOA ones are much older, or brinks searches coins.

Back to the topic though... If that is the case then what company does BOA use for coin delivery and what other banks use them?

Thanks

Jim, I dont want a better mix of coins, I want the same ones!

Also I am not trying to argue or start a bickering or anything but this forum is labeled as: "Post your "Roll Hunting" experiences and questions here!" this question directly pertains to my coin roll hunting, so I thought it would fit best here, if you see it differently I would be more than happy to hear your view on it.

Thanks for all your help guys.

Boxerchip,

This is the exact place to post your questions. But remember that the coins you will want if you are like most of the CRHers are the older ones. Unlike dimes, nickels, pennies and quarters, there are no new halves coming out each year except what are referred to as NIFC ( not intended for circulation). These are sold by the MInt to the general public and they do find their way into rolls. Thus, the halves you are going to be searching are either being dropped off at local banks for re processing, or have been in bags sitting on pallets for years waiting to be rolled and ordered by the banks. I believe that the coin couriers stock the coins in their warehouse until they are needed. With the great increase in CRHing lately I doubt there are many old bags sitting on pallets in most areas.

You can always ask your bank what courier delievers their coins. Then you should be able to figure out where they are coming from. The big couriers like Brinks commingle incoming coins from all banks and send out boxes as they are ordered. So you might be getting the same coins over and over again even though you are ordering from different banks. It is also possible that some big couriers feed bags of coins to other couriers if they need them. No way to know for sure where they are coming from. Best to find techniques that work for you and do them over and over.

I guess it is possible that there are bags of halves sitting in some federal reserve branch waiting to be ordered by coin courier companies? I dont know for sure.

PS In my town some of the BOA branches use Brinks, and some use Dunbar.

Good luck.

Jim

 

[Ju8vP3t]

When I inquired, my friend(teller) told me there was a company, forgot the name, that she placed the coin/currency order with, and it wasn't a courier company,(it was a vault company) ...then the courier company would deliver, so it led me to believe that the banks don't call up the courier company to order, the courier company just delivers, and this would make sense, because I marked some dumps recently and returned them to another bank that uses a different courier than the bank I use to order with, and I got back some of my dump coins, so that meant that 2 different courier companies were involved, and I still got back some of my dump coins...

 

[jim4silver]

When I inquired, my friend(teller) told me there was a company, forgot the name, that she placed the coin/currency order with, and it wasn't a courier company,(it was a vault company) ...then the courier company would deliver, so it led me to believe that the banks don't call up the courier company to order, the courier company just delivers, and this would make sense, because I marked some dumps recently and returned them to another bank that uses a different courier than the bank I use to order with, and I got back some of my dump coins, so that meant that 2 different courier companies were involved, and I still got back some of my dump coins...

I guess it is different in other places. Do they use the same wrappers when you get from different couriers? It would seem strange that the vault company would use different wrappers.

The websites I posted earlier mention that each company processes their own coins, wraps and count, etc.

I guess it is a mystery that is unsolvable here.

Jim

 

[Yinzi50]

If you check out the Loomis one you actually see the guy pouring coins from a bag into a counter. It CLEARLY states that they act as the federal reserve coin depots center for the fed.

That would the most painful job for me! When you see many goodies in front of you and can't put in your own pocket.

If a CRHer commits a felony, let's sentence him to be that guy pouring coins in Loomis.

 

[jim4silver]

If you check out the Loomis one you actually see the guy pouring coins from a bag into a counter. It CLEARLY states that they act as the federal reserve coin depots center for the fed.

That would the most painful job for me! When you see many goodies in front of you and can't put in your own pocket.

If a CRHer commits a felony, let's sentence him to be that guy pouring coins in Loomis.

Yinzi,

Wouldn't that be cruel and unusual punishment and violate the Constitution?

Jim

 

[Ju8vP3t]

When I inquired, my friend(teller) told me there was a company, forgot the name, that she placed the coin/currency order with, and it wasn't a courier company,(it was a vault company) ...then the courier company would deliver, so it led me to believe that the banks don't call up the courier company to order, the courier company just delivers, and this would make sense, because I marked some dumps recently and returned them to another bank that uses a different courier than the bank I use to order with, and I got back some of my dump coins, so that meant that 2 different courier companies were involved, and I still got back some of my dump coins...

I guess it is different in other places. Do they use the same wrappers when you get from different couriers? It would seem strange that the vault company would use different wrappers.

The websites I posted earlier mention that each company processes their own coins, wraps and count, etc.

I guess it is a mystery that is unsolvable here.

Jim

It si puzzling,'cause after reading some of the couriers web-sites, it would seem they do sort and roll, and I don't know, they may use different wrappers for different couriers, seems it may be a way to distinguish between orders, but I do know,when I asked my friend, that's what she said,..I'd send her an E-mail everyday or so, to let her know what I wanted in the way of boxes, and she told me she E-mailed her coin/currency order in everyday in the morning, but it wasn't to a courier company, and that was at BOA....so I guess it remains a mystery.....what got me to thinking is, my dumps....dumping 'em at one bank that uses Brinks, but ordering 'em from a bank that uses Loomie, so some how they're getting mixed in between couriers, that's why I was thinking there was some sort of central clearing, that all the couriers use....

 

[phillips24]

If you check out the Loomis one you actually see the guy pouring coins from a bag into a counter. It CLEARLY states that they act as the federal reserve coin depots center for the fed.

That would the most painful job for me! When you see many goodies in front of you and can't put in your own pocket.

If a CRHer commits a felony, let's sentence him to be that guy pouring coins in Loomis.

Yinzi,

Wouldn't that be cruel and unusual punishment and violate the Constitution?

Jim

Constitution? What Constitution? Hasn't that old moldy piece of parchment been effectively nullified for a while now? Try to exercise your right to bear arms, your right to peacefully protest, your duty to be in the local militia. The fact that the states rights are being trampled on by unfunded federal mandates that are outside of their scope written in this document.

 

[XX]

It's been awhile for me, but Jim4Silver pretty much has it dead on.

Years ago, the Fed moved to contract out 100% of all coin handling operations. The Federal Reserve itself
deals with no physical coins. It's all contracted out to the Depository Institutions.

While the DI's physically roll, store, and handle all the coins, no all of them belong to the DI.

This is where it's going to get very confusing.

The Federal Reserve began a program whereby certain eligible banks/institutions could
transfer cash back to the Federal Reserve, but not have to physically ship the currency.
There were strict requirements for the program such as maintaining completely separate
vaults. It is this program that introduces the greatest confusion for many CRHers and their tellers.

So, When we order coins, you come into one of several scenarios.

First, the bank is a member bank of the Federal Reserve and uses the Fedline to place their coin orders.
The bank is required to contract with a courier service to pick up and deliver their orders. Normally,
these types of orders are serviced by the same DI every week. The courier is paid for transportation
only. The bank typically pays no per item fees (as the Fed charges nothing to withdraw cash/coin)
unless the courier charges them based on volume, usually it's a flat rate with surcharges for exceeding
a threshhold like 15 or 20 items.

Second, the bank is a member bank, but uses their own cash management center. (Note while the fed
doesn't charge for most cash/coin orders, they did start charging for cross-shipping $10's and $20's
that are fit for circulation) The cash management center handles that bank's cash/coin needs. They
could also be a DI too, but the coin for both operations is maintained separately as required by the
Fed. This bank would again contract with a courier service for transportation only and the courier
may charge based on volume similar to how I stated above.


Third, the bank could be a non-member bank. They need to contract with a cash handling service, a
DI, or even just another bank to meet their cash needs. This could mean that they contract with a
courier service separately, or the courier service could also be the cash handling service (typical for
small non-member banks, restaurants, stores, etc...). Any bank in this category will have little
predictability as the coins may not come from the same location every week. If the courier has the
contract for both transportation and cash handling, they are going to manage their system to minimize
costs of getting what the bank ordered to them. Also, a typical cash handling service charges per
item and the contracted fees can vary widely from bank to bank (often dependent upon projected volume
and negotiation skills of the bank).

I've only covered the most common scenarios. There are also banks that are penny wise but dollar foolish.
They will have their tellers spend hours rerolling coins that could have been shipped out and exchanged
for rolls at a fraction of the teller's time and equipment costs.

Also not that transportation costs will be heavily dependent upon the distance from the nearest major
DI ($3 per gallon for Diesel, 10 miles per gallon, plus employees time).

Things constantly change and it's been a long time since I researched this, but this is a summary of the
main info I learned from talking to people at the Chicago Federal Reserve and at 3 major Chicago DI's.