Xterra 505 or Vaquero

[DeepThought]

I think you are going to be a little disappointed when you continue to pull the same stuff from the the same depth as your Silver w/o pulling anything deeper.

There are a couple of places I hunt where almost every coin we've pulled has been 6" or less. Everything from pre 1900's copper/silver to modern clad. ALL in the top 6". Old no deeper than the new. These two areas have had HEAVY foot traffic over the last 150yrs and we're just not getting anything below that. One of the areas is nice black dirt thats fairly packed and the other is much like the soils you are hunting in. We've thrown some pretty heavy machinery at it too. E-tracs, Spectra, MXT Pro, Vaquero & AT Pro to name a few (most). Not one of those have pulled anything deeper than any of the others or any deeper than the Aces , BH's & CM's for that matter.
I went on the deeper quest convinced, like you, that it has to be there. Fact is, is doesn't.

Not trying to be a Negative Nancy but it just might not be there. I hope it is and wish you luck with whatever direction you decide to go.

I recently went out after a 3-day rain to a sandy area covered by sod (used to be a volleyball court, now covered by grass). I was pulling a dimes as deep as 10" with my BH T4. Normally I can get upwards of 5" in the Alabama clay. Sure - I would like more depth (in the clay) but ask myself whether I really want to dig up 10" of packed clay for a dime...

 

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[rainyday101]

I would love to try a 505, but think I am gonna stick with what I know and get another Tesoro. Right now the wife says it's on hold anyways, so I will have to wait till later this fall. Right now I am looking at the Vaq. and Outlaw. I do so good with the Silver uMax my thinking is to stick with what I know. It's tough to compare 2 machines because both have small advantages and disadvantages. On top of that there are a lot of good detectors made in any price range. The great thing about a forum is getting all the opinions of everyone, whether we agree or disagree.

 

[christo000]

I would love to try a 505, but think I am gonna stick with what I know and get another Tesoro. Right now the wife says it's on hold anyways, so I will have to wait till later this fall. Right now I am looking at the Vaq. and Outlaw. I do so good with the Silver uMax my thinking is to stick with what I know. It's tough to compare 2 machines because both have small advantages and disadvantages. On top of that there are a lot of good detectors made in any price range. The great thing about a forum is getting all the opinions of everyone, whether we agree or disagree.

Well said. Im starting to have a similar issue when I get ready to head out & detect I just dont know which detector to go with Atpro,v3i, or deus xp I like things from each, each have an advantage over the other. Its the spice of life variety

 

[atomicscott]

Well said. Im starting to have a similar issue when I get ready to head out & detect I just dont know which detector to go with Atpro,v3i, or deus xp I like things from each, each have an advantage over the other. Its the spice of life variety

That's a problem most detectorists would love to have! I've got my F2 for the parks/tot lots, and the 505 for everything else. I figure if I really learn it inside and out, instead of constantly switching and having to learn other detectors, it will do everything I need it to (especially with some additional coils). I know some guys who use the same 10-15 year old machines, and have no desire or need for anything different. They are still finding the goodies, so feel no need to switch. I also know people who buy a new machine every year or so, and their finds don't really get any better. I would like to (one day, lol) pay for my detectors with the hobby, and the more detectors I buy the more difficult that will be!

 

[liftloop]

xtera is 100 time the detector a tesoro will ever be
hands down Ive listened to though tesoro they sound like two blonds in a coffee shop talking a bought shoes chatty verys chaty
they sound to unstable for me they can't have a very good speaker with one 9 volt battery...

 

[chinchilla]

xtera is 100 time the detector a tesoro will ever be
hands down Ive listened to though tesoro they sound like two blonds in a coffee shop talking a bought shoes chatty verys chaty
they sound to unstable for me they can't have a very good speaker with one 9 volt battery...

It sounds you haven't used tesoros enough

 

[goldnrelics]

I would go for the Xterra 505. Good luck!

 

[atomicscott]

xtera is 100 time the detector a tesoro will ever be
hands down Ive listened to though tesoro they sound like two blonds in a coffee shop talking a bought shoes chatty verys chaty
they sound to unstable for me they can't have a very good speaker with one 9 volt battery...

Haha! Liftloop, that is too much. LMAO!!!!

 

[PostalTwo]

rainy if i were u i would get the outlaw. umax same as ur silver so u know the language and u can run the big concentric coil without having to send it in.

 

[Ronzie]

xtera is 100 time the detector a tesoro will ever be
hands down Ive listened to though tesoro they sound like two blonds in a coffee shop talking a bought shoes chatty verys chaty
they sound to unstable for me they can't have a very good speaker with one 9 volt battery...

As a former Minelab guy that's not true. Now I can't say I've actually used a X-Terra, but had a Explorer SE w/pro coil for 5 years. That would make an Ex-Terra 100 x better than an Explorer. There is nothing my Tesoro can't do that the double the price Explorer could. It only needs a 9 volt because it doesn't have a screen to distract you.
Before this year I'd agree with you because I use to laugh at Tesoro's as old dinosaur machines. Now I'm laughing at how wrong I was.
Tesoro's are the most underrated detectors, bar none. I did like the 2 blondes joke and can had one myself, if you put an Etrac with a Teknetics 8000 you get the sound of R2D2 raping a duck.

 

[chinchilla]

As a former Minelab guy that's not true. Now I can't say I've actually used a X-Terra, but had a Explorer SE w/pro coil for 5 years. That would make an Ex-Terra 100 x better than an Explorer. There is nothing my Tesoro can't do that the double the price Explorer could. It only needs a 9 volt because it doesn't have a screen to distract you.
Before this year I'd agree with you because I use to laugh at Tesoro's as old dinosaur machines. Now I'm laughing at how wrong I was.
Tesoro's are the most underrated detectors, bar none. I did like the 2 blondes joke and can had one myself, if you put an Etrac with a Teknetics 8000 you get the sound of R2D2 raping a duck.

quack quack

 

[Longhair]

As a former Minelab guy that's not true. Now I can't say I've actually used a X-Terra, but had a Explorer SE w/pro coil for 5 years. That would make an Ex-Terra 100 x better than an Explorer. There is nothing my Tesoro can't do that the double the price Explorer could. It only needs a 9 volt because it doesn't have a screen to distract you.

As a former Tesoro guy, I disagree to a point.
For starters, the Xterra shares far more in common with the CTX than it does an E-trac/Explorer. So that comparison doesn't work for me. I have both an Xterra and an Explorer SE, and they are very different from each other.
Beyond that, the Xterra uses 4 AA batteries, and is under 3lbs. The screen should never be a distraction, as it is just like any other detector in that you go by audio first....the screen is just additional info for you to use or ignore as you choose.

Comming from decades of single tone detectors, I found that multi-tones made for much more pleasurable and productive hunts. If you want to talk about distractions and constantly fiddling around with the machine, then I have to say that thumbing a disc knob and having to look at where it is is at least if not more screwing around than I ever do with my Minelabs.
JMO

 

[rainyday101]

Longhair, I believe they are both formidable detectors in different ways. The Xterra series has always caught my eye. Both Lucky Larry and Terry Soloman say they are equal in depth. The only factor left for me to consider then is which has better target separation in trashy areas. My Silver uMax excels at this, at least as far as I can tell because I don't have anything to compare it with. I have done several test with pulltabs and iron nails near and on top of the coin and the silver hits the coin loud and clear with the disc set right. I see the same results in the ground when detecting. Some of my best finds come in trashy areas where I am sure others have missed the coin, so although more depth is a desire, target separation is very important to me.

Now although I like Tesoro beep and digs and am very proficient with them, it would be hard for me to dismiss a display, because I haven't used one in 12 years. I can see they might offer more target information than just a tone. I personally don't thumb the disc. knob as I set it to cherry pick and dig only clean tones which about ninety percent of the time are coins. I am a silver hunter that takes the clad as it comes. The 3Khz coil would be great for silver. My hesitation comes when add the price of that coil to the detector- things get pricey quick. Of course a used 505 is an option. I am in no hurry to buy yet and will probably wait until next year real early spring to purchase. Just looking for opinions on these two detectors and as you can see there is no shortage of them! They both look like good detectors, just suited to different personal taste.

What would be the deciding factor for me would be to see somebody do Monte's nail board test with them using comparable coils. IE concentric vs concentric, or DD vs. DD.

 

[atomicscott]

Longhair, I believe they are both formidable detectors in different ways. The Xterra series has always caught my eye. Both Lucky Larry and Terry Soloman say they are equal in depth. The only factor left for me to consider then is which has better target separation in trashy areas. My Silver uMax excels at this, at least as far as I can tell because I don't have anything to compare it with. I have done several test with pulltabs and iron nails near and on top of the coin and the silver hits the coin loud and clear with the disc set right. I see the same results in the ground when detecting. Some of my best finds come in trashy areas where I am sure others have missed the coin, so although more depth is a desire, target separation is very important to me.

Now although I like Tesoro beep and digs and am very proficient with them, it would be hard for me to dismiss a display, because I haven't used one in 12 years. I can see they might offer more target information than just a tone. I personally don't thumb the disc. knob as I set it to cherry pick and dig only clean tones which about ninety percent of the time are coins. I am a silver hunter that takes the clad as it comes. The 3Khz coil would be great for silver. My hesitation comes when add the price of that coil to the detector- things get pricey quick. Of course a used 505 is an option. I am in no hurry to buy yet and will probably wait until next year real early spring to purchase. Just looking for opinions on these two detectors and as you can see there is no shortage of them! They both look like good detectors, just suited to different personal taste.

What would be the deciding factor for me would be to see somebody do Monte's nail board test with them using comparable coils. IE concentric vs concentric, or DD vs. DD.

The 3hkz 6" coils are about $40-50 more than other manufacturers, but it's the FREQUENCY CHANGE that makes it worth the money. The 6" 18.75 coil is $142, the Vaquero 5.75 dd is $129. You do the math. That 18.75khz coil will smoke the V on small gold, and the 3khz coil will smoke the V on silver. No matter how much you want to spend on a Vaquero coil, it will NEVER change the frequency.

 

[mojotrout]

Dammit Rainy, now I have to go out and research the Xterras!

I was having a hard enough time figuring out the Tejon vs Outlaw vs Vaq issue and now this!

 

[Longhair]

AtomicScott is absolutely right, but....

You guys are looking at it a bit sideways. To change frequency with a Tesoro (or most others really) you are looking at buying another detector. With an Xterra, instead of shelling out the $ for another machine, you just buy a slightly pricey coil, and attach it to a machine that you're already familiar with. There's still a learning curve, because you need to learn the differences in how various target metals respond to the new frequency, but that is a fairly flat curve compared to a whole different machine.

Due to SmartCoil™technology, you can think more of the machine itself like a universal powerhead that you attach different tools to. Kind of like your Ryobi weedeater that can also be a cultivator, or an edger. The control unit handles the bulk of the work, but also interprets information sent to it from whatever coil you have on, based on parameters that are set for that frequency.

That all said, each manufacturer has developed firmware that enables their machines to interpret various targets the best that they can for that particular unit's frequency. They (for the most part) just keep getting better at it. And most are in the 5-15kHz range. However, there is a reason that the E-Trac, CTX, and DFX have their silver sucker legacies, just as the GMT, GB II, and Lobo Supertrak have built reputations on gold, and that has everything to do with frequency. The CTX, E-Trac, Xterra, and DFX have the ability to run 2-3kHz, while the GMT, GB II, Lobo Supertrak, and Xterra run 18.75kHz and above. Frequency matters!

Just some more to chew on.

 

[rainyday101]

Yeah I know Mojo, if you get a DISPLAY machine for coinshooting I think hands down the Xterra 505 and possibly the Whites M6. Atomic Scott is one of only a handful that have had both the Vaq. and Xterra. He is right about that 3 KHZ coil being a silver sniffer. I still come back to the target separation issue though. Mojo you know from your use how well the target separation is on the Tesoro's. Atomic Scott had the Vaq but I am not sure how long he used it before dumping it. It kinda sounds like he thought it was the magic detector and got rid of it shortly. He also had some problems with his disc. circuit not working correctly. With his disc. not working right it is hard to get a fair comparison. I wish I could rent both of them and put them through a ringer of test to see which performs the best!

Getting an opinion from a dealer is worse yet. With the exception of one dealer you get very biased opinions and it seems the only thing they want to sell is a Minelab or AT Pro or whatever detector they are using at the current time. It seems their mind is made up on what they are going to sell you before you even begin to talk.

 

[rainyday101]

Yep Longhair you are right on the frequency matters issue, no doubt about it. The thing I keep going back to is that nobody wants to address is target separation. Freq. won't matter one bit if it can't do REALLY well at separating a target from trash. Now you current Xterra users may think you have good target separation, but what have you compared it to? Has anyone compared it to a Tesoro? Even the least expensive Tesoro's will pass Monte's nail board test where a fair amount of other brands detectors fail miserably. Has anyone done the nail board test with it and do you have a video of it? If it did well I would probably take a sip of the koolaid and add a Minelab to the detector stable.

 

[atomicscott]

Yeah I know Mojo, if you get a DISPLAY machine for coinshooting I think hands down the Xterra 505 and possibly the Whites M6. Atomic Scott is one of only a handful that have had both the Vaq. and Xterra. He is right about that 3 KHZ coil being a silver sniffer. I still come back to the target separation issue though. Mojo you know from your use how well the target separation is on the Tesoro's. Atomic Scott had the Vaq but I am not sure how long he used it before dumping it. It kinda sounds like he thought it was the magic detector and got rid of it shortly. He also had some problems with his disc. circuit not working correctly. With his disc. not working right it is hard to get a fair comparison. I wish I could rent both of them and put them through a ringer of test to see which performs the best!

Getting an opinion from a dealer is worse yet. With the exception of one dealer you get very biased opinions and it seems the only thing they want to sell is a Minelab or AT Pro or whatever detector they are using at the current time. It seems their mind is made up on what they are going to sell you before you even begin to talk.

I owned my Vaq for over a year with over 80 hours on it. I tried so hard to like it. Myself and another forum member (he had his almost 2 years) had the same concerns about the V not liking silver at good depths and digging ALOT of rusty iron that rang as 'good' targets. We both sent them back to Tesoro, had coils retuned & still had the same performance issues after we recieved the 'ok' by Rusty on final testing. That is when I knew it was time for a change.

 

[atomicscott]

Yep Longhair you are right on the frequency matters issue, no doubt about it. The thing I keep going back to is that nobody wants to address is target separation. Freq. won't matter one bit if it can't do REALLY well at separating a target from trash. Now you current Xterra users may think you have good target separation, but what have you compared it to? Has anyone compared it to a Tesoro? Even the least expensive Tesoro's will pass Monte's nail board test where a fair amount of other brands detectors fail miserably. Has anyone done the nail board test with it and do you have a video of it? If it did well I would probably take a sip of the koolaid and add a Minelab to the detector stable.

Of course I compared my xterra to a Tesoro. Thats the only way I could come to a conclusion. I dont think Rusty was lying when he said that 2 detectors were ok on final testing. Why do you insist my disc was not working properly? Many have had the same issues, not hard to find that info. Rusty assured me everything was working as expected. Higher freq detectors like gold, (low conductors) but they also like iron. Thats just the way it is. Other than Ronzie, I havent found anyone who prefers their Vaquero after using a minelab, and that was NOT an xterra.