A Heap of Proof.

[Hal Croves]

A HEAP OF PROOF
An Untidy Collection of Evidence

Hal Croves


View attachment 1181228


"The proof of the pudding is in the eating. By a small sample we may judge of the whole piece"

Miguel de Cervantes



The Tumlinson Clan & Texas Freemasonry

" - " (quote removed at authors request)


Recommended Reading: CAPTAIN PETER F. TUMLINSON: TEXIAN RANGER and MASON by Brett Laird Doyle


Gen. #1
James TUMLINSON
(1755- ----)




View attachment 1181229

THE OLD 300 FAMILIES: STEPHEN F. AUSTIN'S COLONY IN TEXAS (1821-1823)
​

 

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Treasure of Victoria Peak - Grab it through Amazon!

[Hal Croves]

Gen #4
Children of: Peter Frank Tumlinson
And: Anne Tidwell

John J. TUMLINSON,
b. Abt 1825, Arkansas Territory, USA


View attachment 1181271

Absalom Tidwell TUMLINSON,
b. 14 Dec 1827, Arkansas Territory, USA , d. 16 Feb 1889, Pleasanton, Atascosa, Texas, USA (Age 61 years)

Ragsdale's Battalion, Texas Cavalry
Private in Private out - Company D

Organization: Organized with five companies ca. January 1864. Dismounted in February 1865. Surrendered by General E.K. Smith, commanding Trans-Mississippi Department, on May 26, 1865.
First Commander: Andrew Daly, LTC
Field Officer: Samuel G. Ragsdale, MAJ, LTC
Assignments: Eastern Sub-district, District of Texas, New Mexico, and Arizona, Trans-Mississippi Department (Jan-Sep 64); Unattached, 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] (Drayton’s) Texas Cavalry Division, 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] Corps, Trans-Mississippi Department (Sep 64-Feb 65); 6[SUP]th[/SUP] (HEBERT’s) Texas Infantry Brigade, 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] (HEBERT’s) Texas Infantry Division, 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] Corps, Trans-Mississippi Department (Feb-May 65)

Battles: Calcasieu Pass (May 6, 1864)

From Sifakis, Compendium of C.S. Armies: Texas, 96:
​

From Bergeron, "Free Men of Color in Grey," 251:

"This unit had moved into southwestern Louisiana [by September 1864] to perform guard and picket duty around the Calcasieu and Mermentau rivers and had enlisted several dozen Louisianians."

Art Bergeron 1997:
"On several occasions during 1863 and 1864, Texas Confederate troops moved into southwestern Louisiana. These soldiers entered the state to collect supplies or to assist in protecting the area from Union invasion. While performing these tasks, the Texans took advantage of their situation to recruit local men into their military units. One unit that enlisted a sizeable number of Louisianians was Lieutenant Colonel Andrew Daly’s Texas Cavalry Battalion (later commanded by Lieutenant Colonel Samuel G. Ragsdale). Some of the Louisianians had served previously in units from their own state, while others were enlisting for the first time."
​

View attachment 1181271

William Ormand TUMLINSON,
b. 1 Oct 1830, Miller County, Arkansas Territory, USA , d. 25 Jul 1913, Atascosa County, Texas, USA (Age 82 years)

Texas 36th Cavalry
Private in Private out - Company K

"The Texas 36th Cavalry Regiment [also called 32nd Regiment] completed its organization in Boston, Texas, late in 1863. It contained 823 men of which many were from Sulphur Springs and Belton, and Caldwell and Gonzales counties. The regiment was assigned to H. Bee's and Bagby's Brigade, Trans-Mississippi Department, and was involved in numerous engagements at Louisiana including Mansfield and Pleasant Hill. Later it moved to Galveston, Texas and there surrendered in June, 1865."

"The Thirty-Sixth Texas Cavalry, the highest officially numbered Texas Cavalry regiment, was organized in late 1863 at Belton, Texas. It contained 823 men of which many were from Sulphur Springs and Belton, and Caldwell and Gonzales counties. The regiment was assigned to H. Bee's and Bagby's Brigade, Trans-Mississippi Department. For some unknown reason, the regiment was frequently known as the Thirty-Second Texas Cavalry. There was a previously organized regiment with that designation and there was no connection between the two units. (To further complicate identification, the Thirty-Second Texas Cavalry was often incorrectly known as the Fifteenth Texas Cavalry, and, needless to add, there was another unit by that number.) The field officers were Colonel Peter C. Woods, Lieutenant Colonels Nat. Benton and W.O. Hutchison, and Major Stokely M. Holmes."

• Company K (men from Caldwell County)

​

Gen #4
Children of: Peter Frank Tumlinson
And: Harriett Jane West



View attachment 1181255 View attachment 1181271

​

Joseph TUMLINSON,

b. 26 May 1840, Texas, USA , d. 29 Jan 1893, La Salle County, Texas, USA (Age 52 years)

Texas 36th Cavalry
Private in Private out - Company K
"The Texas 36th Cavalry Regiment [also called 32nd Regiment] completed its organization in Boston, Texas, late in 1863. It contained 823 men of which many were from Sulphur Springs and Belton, and Caldwell and Gonzales counties. The regiment was assigned to H. Bee's and Bagby's Brigade, Trans-Mississippi Department, and was involved in numerous engagements at Louisiana including Mansfield and Pleasant Hill. Later it moved to Galveston, Texas and there surrendered in June, 1865."

"The Thirty-Sixth Texas Cavalry, the highest officially numbered Texas Cavalry regiment, was organized in late 1863 at Belton, Texas. It contained 823 men of which many were from Sulphur Springs and Belton, and Caldwell and Gonzales counties. The regiment was assigned to H. Bee's and Bagby's Brigade, Trans-Mississippi Department. For some unknown reason, the regiment was frequently known as the Thirty-Second Texas Cavalry. There was a previously organized regiment with that designation and there was no connection between the two units. (To further complicate identification, the Thirty-Second Texas Cavalry was often incorrectly known as the Fifteenth Texas Cavalry, and, needless to add, there was another unit by that number.) The field officers were Colonel Peter C. Woods, Lieutenant Colonels Nat. Benton and W.O. Hutchison, and Major Stokely M. Holmes."

• Company K (men from Caldwell County)
  

"JOSEPH TUMLINSON, SR.
He and his twin sister Kathryn were born May 26, 1840 in Shelby County, Texas. Joseph was the son of Harriet West McEnvale & Captain Peter Tumlinson. Joseph married Morelda English on June 28, 1860 at Atascosa County, Texas.

CSA SERVICE: Joseph Tumlinson
Regiment Name: 36 Texas Cavalry
Side: Confederate
Company K
Soldier's Rank-in Private
Soldier's Rank-out Private
Film Number M227 roll 37
36th Regiment, Teas Cavalry (Woods). Most of the men were from Sulphur Springs, Belton, Caldwell and Gonzales Counties. The regiment was assigned to H. Bee's and Bagby's Brigade, Trans-Mississippi Department. They were involved in numerous engagements at Louisiana including Mansfield and Pleasant Hill. Later moved to Galveston, Texas and there surrendered in June 1865.

After the CW, Joseph moved his family Carrizo Springs.
December, 6, 1880, Joseph was elected Sheriff of Dimmit, Carrizo Springs, Texas. Joseph was elected Sheriff in this County. He also served as County Judge. "According to an article for the Washington Post dated March 5, 1893, Shefiff Joseph Tumlinson had a gunfight in the living room of his house. " Three stockmen with whom he was unfriendly, entered to kill him, It was nearly 12:00 midnight when Tumlinson was in his nightgown and slippers, his weapons were in the adjoining room.. His assalients, began shooting. It is supposed they fired over a dozen shots, but Tumlinson dived through them, somehow managing to enter the other room to retrieve his revolver, and returned fire. In the span of twenty seconds time Tumlinson killed all three men and miraculoously was unscratched."

On January 3, 1893 Tumlinson and hiis wife were found shot dead near an old railroad bridge south of Cotula. To this day their nurder remains unsolved.
The old Tumlison House was located at 137 West Nopal Street, at the corner of Highways 83 and 85 in Carrizo Springs until May 7, 2002 at which time it was demolished."
​

Catherine TUMLINSON,
b. 26 May 1840, Texas, USA , d. 3 Aug 1887 (Age 47 years)

Harriet TUMLINSON,
b. Jan 1843, Texas, USA , d. 8 Jan 1926, Goose Creek, Harris, Texas, USA (Age ~ 82 years)


View attachment 1181271

Peter Frank TUMLINSON, Jr.,
b. 28 Jul 1845, Texas, USA , d. 28 Dec 1904, Del Rio, Val Verde, Texas, USA (Age 59 years)

Texas 36th Cavalry
Private in Private out - Company K

"The Texas 36th Cavalry Regiment [also called 32nd Regiment] completed its organization in Boston, Texas, late in 1863. It contained 823 men of which many were from Sulphur Springs and Belton, and Caldwell and Gonzales counties. The regiment was assigned to H. Bee's and Bagby's Brigade, Trans-Mississippi Department, and was involved in numerous engagements at Louisiana including Mansfield and Pleasant Hill. Later it moved to Galveston, Texas and there surrendered in June, 1865."
​

James West TUMLINSON,
b. Jan 1847, Texas, USA , d. 24 Jan 1891, Pleasanton, Atascosa, Texas, USA (Age ~ 44 years)

Sarah Jane TUMLINSON,
b. Mar 1850, Texas, USA , d. 27 Feb 1928 (Age ~ 77 years)

Joel Maurice Walker TUMLINSON,
b. 17 May 1853, Floresville, Wilson, Texas, USA , d. 10 May 1903, Carrizo Springs, Dimmit, Texas, USA (Age 49 years)




​

 

[Hal Croves]

Gen #4
Children of: Joseph L. Tumlinson

View attachment 1183933View attachment 1181269

John Jackson TUMLINSON,
b. 31 Jul 1848, DeWitt County, Texas, USA , d. 31 Jan 1920, Sutherland Springs, Wilson, Texas, USA (Age 71 years)

​

Madison's Regiment, Texas Cavalry (Phillips') (3rd Regiment, Arizona Brigade)

"Founded in July 1862. John Robert Baylor founded the Arizona Brigade following a successful CSA invasion then a disastrous retreat. Some of these commanders, and men, were in more than one company of the Arizona Brigade by June 1865. " ... It may be said that the term “Arizona Brigade” is a misnomer. It was formed for the invasion and recapture of the Confederate Territory of Arizona (which was lost to Union invaders in July 1862), and yet never once set foot in Arizona. The Regiments within the Brigade were unofficially known as “Arizona Cavalry Regiments,” and yet almost all the men within them were from Texas. And it was called the “Arizona BRIGADE,” and yet never fought together as a Brigade...its Regiments were detailed to other Brigades instead. ...". per Robert P. Perkins

View attachment 1181425

Madison Reg. TX Cavalry (Philips) 3rd. Reg Arizona Brigade - Movements

21 Feb, 1863 Org.
23 April, 1863 to Louisiana
?? December, 1863 to Galveston, Texas
?? March, 1864 to Lousiana
?? September, 1864 to Arkansas
?? December, 1864 Texas
26 May, 1865 - Trans Mississippi Dept. Surrender



1881 - 1889

​

Dallas Morning News (Dallas TX)
San Antonio Siftings
Thursday 04 April, 1889

May 16, 1881, occurred the Altita pen killing, one of the most celebrated in the criminal annals of Texas. It was a fight over some alleged stolen cattle, and was between what was known as the Wright gang on one side and officers on the other, and Deputy Sheriff McCoy of Gonzales County was slain. Numerous indictments followed and some arrests were made. One Daly Durand turned state's evidence and joined the ranger service for protection. One year later Young Loyns of Karnes County was put on trial, with change of venue. Durand testified against him but he acqquitted. About a dozen others were indicted and their trials were to come up subsequently. Among this number was John Tumlinson, a one-legged man from Atascosa County. On the day after Loyn's trial Durand concluded that he no longer needed protection and left for Atascosa County with two or three parties suspected in the Altita affair. He did this in the face of strenuous advice from the officers. Three days later his body was found on the side of the road riddled with bullets. Tumlinson was afterward convicted of hog theft and was given five years in the penitentiary He has served his term and yesterday passed through on his way to Atascosa in charge of officers and will be put on trial charged with the murder of Daly Durand. It is supposed that some new evidence has been secured.

Martha Elizabeth TUMLINSON,
b. 13 Nov 1849, Cuero, DeWitt, Texas, USA , d. 8 May 1920, Kerr County, Texas, USA (Age 70 years)

Ann Eliza TUMLINSON,
b. 15 Jan 1842, Republic of Texas , d. 19 Oct 1923, Floresville, Wilson, Texas, USA (Age 81 years)

Sarah Barthena TUMLINSON,
b. 30 Apr 1851, DeWitt County, Texas, USA , d. 20 Nov 1930, Alpine, Brewster, Texas, USA (Age 79 years)

Rachel N. TUMLINSON,
b. Abt 1853, Texas, USA

Peter Creel TUMLINSON,
b. 10 Sep 1855, Texas, USA , d. 1 Jan 1936, San Antonio, Bexar, Texas, USA (Age 80 years)

​

 

[Azquester]

Fantastic work Hal!I think you have given ample fuel to argue Travis was a Free Mason and as such would have been privy to secret signs and information only advanced freemasonry would afford a member of the order to which he served at that place or time in history.

 

[sdcfia]

[OT, a bit]

When you have some spare time, see if you can find more info on the known protagonists in the Caballo Mountains treasure rumors. Doc Noss (buried in a Masonic cemetery), Willie Douhthit (statements in the book he wrote), Buster Ward (taken to a Masonic hospital) - maybe "coincidences", maybe not. Try Margaret Perrone's husbands too. Then, over at Victorio Peak with Noss - his murderer Charlie Ryan. Maybe a widespread pattern in the good old treasure game?

 

[Hal Croves]

Fantastic work Hal!I think you have given ample fuel to argue Travis was a Free Mason and as such would have been privy to secret signs and information only advanced freemasonry would afford a member of the order to which he served at that place or time in history.

BIll,
Hang in there until I finish posting everything. It gets even better because just when you think that you understand everything, there is an unexpected twist waiting to trip us all up and then, out of nowhere, another twist on the twist.

 

[Hal Croves]

Gen #5
Children of: Joseph Tumlinson
And: Morelda J. English

Peter C. TUMLINSON,
b. Sep 1861, Texas, USA , d. 26 Apr 1913, San Antonio, Bexar, Texas, USA (Age ~ 51 years)


View attachment 1181616

John A. TUMLINSON,
b. Apr 1864, Texas, USA , d. Bef May 1939 (Age ~ 75 years)



Benjamin Thomas TUMLINSON,
b. 11 Apr 1869, Carrizo Springs, Dimmit, Texas, USA , d. 19 May 1939, Bishop, Nueces, Texas, USA (Age 70 years)

Joseph B. TUMLINSON,
b. 6 Apr 1876, Pleasanton, Atascosa, Texas, USA , d. 16 Sep 1925, Taft, San Patricio, Texas, USA (Age 49 years)


View attachment 1181618

Bell TUMLINSON,
b. 17 Jun 1879, Texas, USA , d. 3 May 1959, Mendocino County, California, USA (Age 79 years)

Lott TUMLINSON,
b. Carrizo Springs, Dimmit, Texas, USA , d. La Ceiba, Atlántida, Honduras

Alta Isola TUMLINSON,
b. 18 Sep 1884, Dimmit County, Texas, USA , d. 1977, San Bernardino, San Bernardino, California, USA (Age 92 years)



Gen #5
Children of: John Jackson Tumlinson
And:Isabella G. Cresap

Joseph William TUMLINSON,
b. Feb 1867, Karnes City, Karnes, Texas, USA , d. 4 Jun 1923, San Antonio, Bexar, Texas, USA (Age ~ 56 years)

Kate TUMLINSON,
b. Abt 1869, Texas, USA

Lillie E. TUMLINSON,
b. Abt 1874, Texas, USA

Penelope Barthena TUMLINSON,
b. 1877, d. 1953 (Age 76 years)


View attachment 1181622

John Jackson TUMLINSON,
b. 1 Mar 1882, Fairview, Wilson, Texas, USA , d. 4 Nov 1957, Cuero, DeWitt, Texas, USA (Age 75 years)

Robert Garland TUMLINSON,
b. 1883

Daisy TUMLINSON,
b. 1883, d. 1968 (Age 85 years)

​

 

[sgtfda]

Ryan
Travis was a known Criminal. He would not have been accepted in a Masonic lodge as a member. He would not have been employed as a police officer either. Perhaps some political appointment to keep the fruit farm in line. One thing for sure he was a bad ass.

 

[Hal Croves]

I trust that as part of your research you have Travis' obituary. Assuming you don't though - otherwise you'd never have made a Masonic connection. This is a waste imho. Lol

Tumlinson's in Texas are about prevalent as Smith's anywhere else.

I can see where original historical research would be a waste of time for you, its not your thing as you have made clear in your posts and conclusions.

As it has been pointed out to you now several times by other members, your understanding of things is superficial, meaning, without much depth. This is not meant as an insult as it takes time to absorb and to process information. The is no substitute for time. As I said before, if you spent time digging deep, beyond Greg's library, beyond Gary's posts elsewhere, I think that you could have made a great video.

What I will show here is that there is a very real Masonic connection, a Confederate connection, a secret kept among at least two families that begins in Arkansas Territory, and that the Heart & Trail stone were known to exist as early as 1910. Are they authentic stone maps to a lost mine or treasure? No one, not even you can answer that question positive until the maps are followed with success. All we can do is hope to date them.

I am not trying to convince anyone that they are real, only that knowledge of their existence (their discovery) predates Travis. The bumper photo is only one clue.
"This is a waste imho. Lol" And you wonder why your having a difficult time on TNet? I am going to remind you of this quote later. : )

And remember to always "quote accurately", BTW, kindly point out exactly where I wrote that Travis was a Freemason?
See my point?

 

[Las Vegas Bob]

Hal

It would be of great benefit to all your many readers and fan if your were to make the connection at least one of these people to Travis. If you can.

 

[Hal Croves]

Ryan
Travis was a known Criminal. He would not have been accepted in a Masonic lodge as a member. He would not have been employed as a police officer either. Perhaps some political appointment to keep the fruit farm in line. One thing for sure he was a bad ass.

Frank,
You are dead on. After the Civil War, those values and principles that define the Masonic Brotherhood and even the Texas Rangers begins to break down in the Tumlinson clan. John Jackson Tumlinson "Peg Leg" is the perfect example. I think that the soldiers in the Confederacy believed that a victory was possible and after sacrificing so much and walking away the loser, I think that it just devastated many of the men who remained in the South, those who struggled to assimilate. The men who did not emigrate to Brazil (some 10,000?) or Sonora (even with pardons) must have felt strangers in their own country. Peg Leg being one of them, was a bad ass for sure. But, he did ride with some remarkable men who knew Arizona intimately.

The Confederacy and today's Southern Arizona are historically tied to the mares tail.

On a side note, since my knowledge of firearms is limited to their use, do you have any idea what the composition of a Civil War period bullet/slug would be? I am thinking about the Tucson Lead Objects and wondering if they were made from munitions lead. Not a bad trick to play on the invading Yanks who may simply have missed finding it.

On another side note, do you know the history of the Holmes family? There is a Richard who served in the CSA from Texas but I have not confirmed the connection if one even exists. If this is the same man, or if Richard Holmes served in the Confederacy, then we start to have a pattern. As I said, I am not sure if its the same man. Perhaps you or someone else can help to resolve it either way.

"Arriving at" or born?

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica][SIZE=-1]"The Holmes' were among the earliest pioneers in the Arizona Territory beginning with Richard "Dick" Holmes' father, R.J. Holmes arriving at Fort Yuma, Arizona from Mississippi in 1847 (the presumed year of the Peralta mining party massacre). R.J. Holmes worked in the cattle business then and later in mining traveling to Canada and Alaska then back to Arizona. Richard "Dick" Holmes was born in 1865 in Arizona. The family name has remained in Arizona ever since." [/SIZE][/FONT]

Holmes, Richard
[h=2]18th Regiment, Texas Infantry (Ochiltree's)[/h] Overview: 18th Infantry Regiment was organized during the summer of 1862. Many of its members were from the towns of Rusk, Jefferson, Sulphur Springs, and Jacksonville. It was assigned to O. Young's and Waul's Brigade, Trans-Mississippi Department, and fought in Louisiana and Arkansas. The unit lost 10 killed, 40 wounded, and 4 missing at Bayou Bourbeau, took part in the operations against Banks' Red River Campaign, and was engaged at Jenkins’ Ferry. Later it moved to Hempstead, Texas, and in May, 1865, disbanded. The field officers were Colonels Thomas R. Bonner, David B. Culberson, William H. King, William B. Ochiltree, John R. Watson, and Joseph G.W. Wood; and Major Matthew A. Gaston.

 

[Hal Croves]

Hal

It would be of great benefit to all your many readers and fan if your were to make the connection at least one of these people to Travis. If you can.

Other than the obvious?
Are you saying that Travis never knew his father or Grandfather?
That he never knew Bell Tumlinson or Robert?

Perhaps you can be more specific.
Being my one fan you would do that for me correct?
Fans are for waving on pews and in parlors.

"Such as thy words are, such will thine affections be esteemed; and such as thine affections, will be thy deeds; and such as thy deeds will be thy life." - Socrates

 

[RG1976]

Oh Victor - I just thoroughly enjoy hearing from you. As you say "the cockles of your heart".

Id invite you to watch V.6 - where we go into the bumper photo in detail. I'd invite you to see the research done by Old - in regard to the bumper photo. She helped a lot with V.6, she is one smart lady! The only struggle was seeing how different that photograph is to photographs that Travis took himself (oops, did I give a hint?)

Am I okay? Yes, "Dr." Bianchi, Frank and I are so thankful and humbled for the folks that have graciously worked with us. We are thankful for people like Gollum - that I had a great conversation with yesterday by phone.

I'd suggest you be cautious with a masonic connection to Travis, like I mentioned. While its entirely true his relatives were masons, that doesn't apply to the story or legend any more than my own families association with things that I don't involve myself in....and vice-versa. Frank is a mason - we work together - perhaps down the line someone will also falsely assume I am a mason.

As to your Arkansas theory - I cannot wait to see what you discover. I may be wrong, and correct me if I am, but you are suggesting that Travis got the maps "hand-me-down style" from a masonic relative? That is similar to Frank and I's research - but yours has a different twist. I don't think any of us have heard of that story - and I for one, am deeply interested. Do you feel there are masonic carvings on the maps? Were you able to find other examples of similar masonic carvings on maps - stones - literature, etc? Would you be willing to share this to back up your theory?

Thanks for sharing your research and digging deep.

 

[Las Vegas Bob]

Other than the obvious?
Are you saying that Travis never knew his father or Grandfather?
That he never knew Bell Tumlinson or Robert?

Perhaps you can be more specific.
Being my one fan you would do that for me correct?
Fans are for waving on pews and in parlors.

"Such as thy words are, such will thine affections be esteemed; and such as thine affections, will be thy deeds; and such as thy deeds will be thy life." - Socrates

OH and the fan thing gee don't know what to tell you, by Jove the "s" is missing LOL. This site hangs up at times with my uncanny ability to type several hundred words a minute. I'll try and type slower for you. Your many readers and fans, there we go all better now.

I never said any such thing how terribly unkind of you to twist what I was asking. And please point out to me where I actually said if "Travis never knew his father or Grandfather? That he never knew Bell Tumlinson or Robert?"

How much more specific can it be, you posted this a convoluted master piece so a simple answer and not a diatribe would suffice, where does Travis tie into this? You posted it now come to a conclusion. I'll type slowly, who is Travis's daddy, who was his Granddaddy, and whilst at it was Travis a Mason? Was he a Ranger? Was he in the military? That all seems to be a missing part as well.

 

[sgtfda]

There was no exact lead composition then or now. Even today commercial casters all have their favorite mix. In the past they used what they could get. Same as today. A lot of the guys use wheel weights for casting. Here is a silver ore sample from deep inside the Silver King. I could melt this down and use the silver for casting. If vampires become a issue I may do just that. Wonder if a silver mine would be a good hiding spot

 

[Hal Croves]

Oh Victor - I just thoroughly enjoy hearing from you. As you say "the cockles of your heart".

Id invite you to watch V.6 - where we go into the bumper photo in detail. I'd invite you to see the research done by Old - in regard to the bumper photo. She helped a lot with V.6, she is one smart lady! The only struggle was seeing how different that photograph is to photographs that Travis took himself (oops, did I give a hint?)

Am I okay? Yes, "Dr." Bianchi, Frank and I are so thankful and humbled for the folks that have graciously worked with us. We are thankful for people like Gollum - that I had a great conversation with yesterday by phone.

I'd suggest you be cautious with a masonic connection to Travis, like I mentioned. While its entirely true his relatives were masons, that doesn't apply to the story or legend any more than my own families association with things that I don't involve myself in....and vice-versa. Frank is a mason - we work together - perhaps down the line someone will also falsely assume I am a mason.

As to your Arkansas theory - I cannot wait to see what you discover. I may be wrong, and correct me if I am, but you are suggesting that Travis got the maps "hand-me-down style" from a masonic relative? That is similar to Frank and I's research - but yours has a different twist. I don't think any of us have heard of that story - and I for one, am deeply interested. Do you feel there are masonic carvings on the maps? Were you able to find other examples of similar masonic carvings on maps - stones - literature, etc? Would you be willing to share this to back up your theory?

Thanks for sharing your research and digging deep.

Dr. B? That is like totally 5th grade banter Ryan.

Actually, I was in the middle of posting the back story as you jumped in. See, if you post all the facts, openly, it gives TNet members the chance to draw their own conclusions. I want members to read it here on TNet, you want them to watch your video and to hear you speak, uninterrupted. You and I are motivated by two entirely different set of circumstances and principles. We shouldn't expect to agree on anything. We can however work to keep it civil.

As I said, at this point, all we can hope to do is date the stone maps accurately. The rest remains theory and speculation.
I am telling a story and there is no rushing to the end.

Masonic carving? I think that the Heart and trail stones are Spanish or Mexican treasure maps discovered by (and I use "discovered" loosely) and kept in possession of Masons, until 1956. I don't know if the person who made the maps was a Mason or not. Its not inconceivable but since we don't have that name, how can we know?

The Priest and Horse stones are problematic for me because I can not find a reference to them before Travis.

They were passed to Travis in 1956, or 1948, pick your poison. I say 1956.

Since we are now among the civilized nations, here is a tip offered much like an olive branch..
Look again at Gary's treasure chest stone.
Are you convinced that it was carved by Travis? When?
If so, does that fact mitigate their relevance as a potential treasure map?
Do you think that he was working from the imagination or some historical document?

Gary, the Treasure chest stone may have been carved by Travis, I honestly can't say but when I am done posting, you are going to see just how relevant and potentially important your find MAY be. If this idea (still just theory) is right you made a bingo.

 

[starman 1]

Hello Hal,


"the Heart & Trail stone were known to exist as early as 1910. Are they authentic stone maps to a lost mine or treasure? No one, not even you can answer that question positive until the maps are followed with success. All we can do is hope to date them". Hal Crove


Look forward to your analysis. Should be a good read for anyone interested in the Maps.

Good luck.

Starman

 

[Hal Croves]

OH and the fan thing gee don't know what to tell you, by Jove the "s" is missing LOL. This site hangs up at times with my uncanny ability to type several hundred words a minute. I'll try and type slower for you. Your many readers and fans, there we go all better now.

I never said any such thing how terribly unkind of you to twist what I was asking. And please point out to me where I actually said if "Travis never knew his father or Grandfather? That he never knew Bell Tumlinson or Robert?"

How much more specific can it be, you posted this a convoluted master piece so a simple answer and not a diatribe would suffice, where does Travis tie into this? You posted it now come to a conclusion. I'll type slowly, who is Travis's daddy, who was his Granddaddy, and whilst at it was Travis a Mason? Was he a Ranger? Was he in the military? That all seems to be a missing part as well.

You are rushing ahead. Travis wold be generation #6. Not there yet. If you slow down and read the post again, the lineage is quite clear. The posts are a work in progress as it they take time to build and unfortunately, I am a bit on the slow side.

Before anyone can understand these convoluted facts, you (everyone) would need to read up on the Civil War. Specifically, the Tucson area in 1861. The area was a Confederate Territory recognized by the Emperor of Mexico (Max). The same man who invited some 1500 exConfederate soldiers to invade Sonora in 1865. BTW-That invitation may have cost him his life when Diaz (Mason) captured power. It is a decent example of the rift between Masonic groups (infighting). Emperor Max was a Mason.

By 1864, the New Mexico Territory (including Arizona) was firmly in Union control.

View attachment 1181870
​

 

[cw0909]

Las Vegas Bob, im guessing Hal figured we would go look at the
connections, i think this is the easier route, at least for me
at Travis link, click the group sheet link for his father, using the
group sheet for which ever retaliative, just seems easier to me
but i do like the history of each person too, ya never know what
youll find in a family tree

Travis
Travis Elmo TUMLINSON b. 1910 Texas, USA d. 1961 Hood River County, Oregon, USA: Robert and Christina Barritt's Family History Page
Travis father
Family Group Sheet for John Jackson TUMLINSON/Alice Melvina LEASMAN (F20078) m. Abt 1910 : Robert and Christina Barritt's Family History Page
Travis grandfather
Family Group Sheet for John J. TUMLINSON/Isabella G. CRESAP (F153) m. 8 Mar 1866 : Robert and Christina Barritt's Family History Page

 

[Hal Croves]

There was no exact lead composition then or now. Even today commercial casters all have their favorite mix. In the past they used what they could get. Same as today. A lot of the guys use wheel weights for casting. Here is a silver ore sample from deep inside the Silver King. I could melt this down and use the silver for casting. If vampires become a issue I may do just that. Wonder if a silver mine would be a good hiding spot
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When War was declared, union troops all but abandon the territory. A dangerous vacuum was created and the Apache went wild. The majority of Southern Arizona feeling abandon were pro-Confederate simply for protection from marauding natives. Many were sympathetic to the Rebel cause and idea of succession.

The new owner of the once Patagonia Mine (1860), Sylvester Mowry served five moths for selling lead to the Confederates. Even with no evidence against him and dismissal of the charges, he defended his right to sell to any white man because of hostile natives. The charges were personalty motivated (a feud with Union General J. H. Carleton). Mowry's mine was returned in 1865.

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