Another Stupid Newbie Question

[Chops]

Sorry, new to this world of detecting. A while back there was some discussion that maybe the anchor of Columbus's flag ship, the Santa Maria. Is there any confirmation or further investigation?

 

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[traveller777]

Sorry, new to this world of detecting. A while back there was some discussion that maybe the anchor of Columbus's flag ship, the Santa Maria. Is there any confirmation or further investigation?

Welcome to Tnet. Lots of great folks here.
Please look at your question again. You left off the end of your question.

 

[MiddenMonster]

Please look at your question again. You left off the end of your question.

I think he meant to say, "the anchor of Columbus's flag ship has been found", then asked about if it had been confirmed or if there is any new information. I thought Haiti had the anchor. Or is at least claiming to have the anchor.

 

[traveller777]

I think he meant to say, "the anchor of Columbus's flag ship has been found", then asked about if it had been confirmed or if there is any new information. I thought Haiti had the anchor. Or is at least claiming to have the anchor.

You sure? I think a Nigerian Prince has it for sale.

 

[MiddenMonster]

You sure? I think a Nigerian Prince has it for sale.

Yeah, that's why it's good to be skeptical. Haiti claims to have the anchor, but of all the artifact and treasure finds Spain has laid claim to, you'd think the anchor to Columbus' flag ship would be the Holy Grail for them. Especially since Haiti was basically usurped from Spain by France. So if the claim is true, why hasn't Spain forced the issue?

 

[Red_desert]

NH 2163 Anchor of Columbus' Flagship

Anchor of Columbus' Flagship SANTA MARIA, now in the general barracks of the Haitian National Guard. Photo received from Pan American Union (Their Acc. No. 24216).

www.history.navy.mil

 

[gunsil]

Yeah, that's why it's good to be skeptical. Haiti claims to have the anchor, but of all the artifact and treasure finds Spain has laid claim to, you'd think the anchor to Columbus' flag ship would be the Holy Grail for them. Especially since Haiti was basically usurped from Spain by France. So if the claim is true, why hasn't Spain forced the issue?

Better read the history of Santo Domingo Island. The French did not usurp Haiti, it was discovered and claimed simultaneously by France and Spain and they divided the Island from the get go. If Chops is referring to the discovery of Barry Clifford who claimed to find the Santa Maria, he was proven mistaken.

 

[MiddenMonster]

Better read the history of Santo Domingo Island. The French did not usurp Haiti, it was discovered and claimed simultaneously by France and Spain and they divided the Island from the get go.

Here's this from the never been wrong Wikipedia:

Haiti - Spanish rule (1492 - 1625)
"As the Spanish re-focused their colonization efforts on the greater riches of mainland Central and South America, Hispaniola became reduced largely to a trading and refueling post. As a result piracy became widespread, encouraged by European powers hostile to Spain such as France (based on Île de la Tortue) and England. The Spanish largely abandoned the western third of the island, focusing their colonization effort on the eastern two-thirds. The western part of the island was thus gradually settled by French buccaneers; among them was Bertrand d'Ogeron, who succeeded in growing tobacco and recruited many French colonial families from Martinique and Guadeloupe. In 1697 France and Spain settled their hostilities on the island by way of the Treaty of Ryswick of 1697, which divided Hispaniola between them."

That sounds like "usurped" to me...

 

[Chops]

Thank you. That photo, I was expecting something a little more blocky; not so slender and delicate. But what do I know about 16th century anchors, but with the miracle of the internet, other images appear similar. Do we know anything about how the Haitians determined the provenance? It would seem likely that before long all kinds of European vessels were around Haiti, and a vessel from the 17th or 18th century might very well have appropriated an old anchor, and it would seem logical that losing an anchor here and there was the cost of doing business.

Was a ballast pile found with this alleged Columbian anchor?

 

[MiddenMonster]

Do we know anything about how the Haitians determined the provenance? It would seem likely that before long all kinds of European vessels were around Haiti, and a vessel from the 17th or 18th century might very well have appropriated an old anchor, and it would seem logical that losing an anchor here and there was the cost of doing business.

Was a ballast pile found with this alleged Columbian anchor?

Here's a Miami Herald article from about 8 years ago. It's mostly about the supposed finding of the Santa Maria itself, but provides some information about the anchor in question. It was found on a plantation in the late 18th century. There was a ballast pile found, but at the site where the Santa Maria wreckage supposedly is, along with a cannon from the late 15th century. It should be noted that the Dominican Republic also claims to have one of the Santa Maria's anchors, of which there were supposedly 6 in total.

Before presumed discovery of Columbus’ Santa Maria off Haiti, there was an anchor

 

[Chops]

A useful article, which essentially sums it up as, "maybe, maybe not." It does point out that scads of wrecks surround the region, some older than others, which translates into that there are a lot of anchors out there.

 

[crashbandicoot]

A useful article, which essentially sums it up as, "maybe, maybe not." It does point out that scads of wrecks surround the region, some older than others, which translates into that there are a lot of anchors out there.

Don,t know nothing about no anchor,but my Marine Drill Instructor stated that the only stupid question is the one you don,t ask. You gonna argue with him?

 

[Red-Coat]

 

[crashbandicoot]

View attachment 2022713

Good one Red-Coat!

 

[Chops]

Don,t know nothing about no anchor,but my Marine Drill Instructor stated that the only stupid question is the one you don,t ask. You gonna argue with him?

Thank you. My Army Drill told me that I looked like I could suck start a Harley. I feel better now!

 

[crashbandicoot]

Thank you. My Army Drill told me that I looked like I could suck start a Harley. I feel better now!

We aim to please!

 

[Chops]

"Once the pin is pulled,Mr.Hand Grenade is not your friend!!??!! Blessed is he who expects little,for he is seldom disappointed! Tony Hillerman"

Fabulous byline.

Another quote I like is, "Be careful searching for adventure. It is ridiculously easy to find," William Least Heat Moon, "Blue Highways."

This wonderful author also wrote a travel book about his adventures sailing from East to West, across the continental United States. With minimal portaging, it can actually be done with a shallow draft craft.

I am finding myself reading these Forum pages more and more and more. The finding of these lost artifacts, buttons, bullets, bling is wonderful. While I am staunch about not disturbing bonafide archeological sites (why do we need another Titanic tea cup? We already know what pottery from 1912 looks like), this site is about salvaging archeological treasure that would be lost for all time if not for dectorists.

The contributions of UK dectorists is invaluable. All those amazing relics would have been lost to the sands of time if not for them.

 

[crashbandicoot]

"Once the pin is pulled,Mr.Hand Grenade is not your friend!!??!! Blessed is he who expects little,for he is seldom disappointed! Tony Hillerman"

Fabulous byline.

Another quote I like is, "Be careful searching for adventure. It is ridiculously easy to find," William Least Heat Moon, "Blue Highways."

This wonderful author also wrote a travel book about his adventures sailing from East to West, across the continental United States. With minimal portaging, it can actually be done with a shallow draft craft.

I am finding myself reading these Forum pages more and more and more. The finding of these lost artifacts, buttons, bullets, bling is wonderful. While I am staunch about not disturbing bonafide archeological sites (why do we need another Titanic tea cup? We already know what pottery from 1912 looks like), this site is about salvaging archeological treasure that would be lost for all time if not for dectorists.

The contributions of UK dectorists is invaluable. All those amazing relics would have been lost to the sands of time if not for them.

Thanks! Hillerman,as you may know,sets his wonderful books among the Navajo.Along with some fantastic fiction you get a subtle history lesson. "Adventure is someone else,in deep doodoo,far away"! I too enjoy the reading about many topics,I enjoy reading about the American Southwest,a place I,ve never been and likely will never visit.Thanks to all who write of their knowledge and adventures I can learn about that.Agree about the UK detectorists.

 

[Chops]

Thanks! Hillerman,as you may know,sets his wonderful books among the Navajo.Along with some fantastic fiction you get a subtle history lesson. "Adventure is someone else,in deep doodoo,far away"! I too enjoy the reading about many topics,I enjoy reading about the American Southwest,a place I,ve never been and likely will never visit.Thanks to all who write of their knowledge and adventures I can learn about that.Agree about the UK detectorists.

Well, Sir, thirty years ago I arrived in El Paso, smack in the middle of the Great Southwest, where I landed in search of adventure. I cannot recommend this place, seriously. For the Southwestern adventure I'd rather suggest Moab, Tuscon- maybe- Jerome, yes. Denver, definitely. New Mexico, Santa Fe and environs pretty nice. Albuquerque is Meth City. To be avoided at all cost. Not El Paso. When General Sherman, I think it was, was stationed here, he remarked that if he owned both Hell and El Paso, he would live in Hell and rent out El Paso.

Hillerman definitely a good read. The function of a novel is for us to get inside the shoes of another, and Hillerman excelled at this. Also a good read, in that same sort of mystery series, is the Rabbi series by Kemmelman. Get to get an appreciation for Judaic tradition. Also, the alphabet series with antiheroine, Kinsey Mahone, by Sue Grafton a good read at the beach.

 

[Boatlode]

Keep an eye on Ebay. Columbus' anchor will eventually turn up.