little help on identification

[ripper6xray]

I found these on a local Civil War site...im thinking the one the top is a bite bullet although flatter than a shot mini ball but as round as a normal mini ball ...im thinking the soldier may have carved it down to be flat. the one on the bottom is what ive heard to be a small shot put inside a mini ball... anyone have any ideas on what they may be....

 

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[Critical Recovery]

What you and other people often refer to as "bite bullets" are the source of a lot of discussion.
Most think that the "chewed bullets" found were chewed by pigs and other wild animals due to the lube and potential human remains attached.
Personally I have never seen any references to soldiers on either side "biting the bullet"

That being said, I think you MAY have a fired round ball. A "Minie Ball" refers to a conically shaped bullet. "ball" is just a common term for a projectile, round or otherwise.

And you may be referring to "buck and ball" loads (the bottom one.)

Can you get measurements or size comparisons?

 

[ripper6xray]

i can set a regular muskett ball beside it and a tape measure and try to take a pic would that be of any help

 

[ripper6xray]

I hope this image is helpful i dont have my micrometer in the house here its in the garage down the road or i would be able to give you a little better measurement ... thanks again

 

[civil_war22]

Actually they did bite the bullet in the civil war. I have about 4 round balls with perfect teeth marks in them that i had found on my property from a civil war field hospital that was there in December of 1862. along with bone saw and teeth puller

 

[ripper6xray]

that sounds like a great find bud... yea i have a few friends also that have a few with what appears to be bite marks as well... they were found on the side of the site where the battle took place as well as mine did... it was funny beacuse i didnt expect to find it there but we also found a few other artifacts as well....civil_war22 are you from around wv or one of the surrounding states..

 

[Critical Recovery]

Actually they did bite the bullet in the civil war. I have about 4 round balls with perfect teeth marks in them that i had found on my property

You mean bullets that were removed and discarded covered in material from a body and discarded, or bullets in an amputated limb that were discarded, both quite attractive to wild pigs.
Trey chewing on a Minie ball as someone is hacking off your leg and then tell me how many teeth you have left.

Do you have proven, credible accounts and official sources of this happening as a means of medical treatment?
because I can find you sources of a wooden dowel or a roll of leather being used as bullets were a good way to break teeth.

It is a MYTH.
http://civilwarscholars.com/2011/10/myth-no-2-biting-on-the-bullet-for-pain-george-wunderlich/

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/bite-the-bullet.html

 

[civil_war22]

Its not a myth. You show me what proof you have based on this finding. I have a buddy that is a dental practitioner and would be happy to send pics of the comparison in the teeth and molar marks to what he has next to it

 

[Critical Recovery]

Its not a myth. You show me what proof you have based on this finding. I have a buddy that is a dental practitioner and would be happy to send pics of the comparison in the teeth and molar marks to what he has next to it

Ever see a pig molar? I have.
As romantic as it sounds, if you bite a bullet while someone is hacking off your leg, not only will you have no leg, bbut probably a few less teeth. Did it HAPPEN? I'm sure from time to time it did. But I have NEVER found any information of it being as widespread as to be considered more than an occasional occurrence.
Any doctor with a MODICUM of common sense wouldn't try to put a bullet into the mouth of a gasping, screaming soldier, that may pass out.
That's just negligent, and good way to aspirate somebody.
It is a romantic notion, and has become so ingrained in our vernacular that the lines between truth and rumour have become blurred.
And yes, I think I know a little bit about Civil and Boer War medicine than your dentist friend.

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"Pain Bullet" | American Civil War Forums

 

[kuger]

...I have found chewed bullets as well,far from any battles or reason for anybody to be chewing on them!

 

[blindpig]

I've read about native americains chewing on bullets , maybe a pastime /habit picked up from troops ,. maybe chewing on bullets wasn't that uncommon in the 19 th cen ?
Anyway ,. can't remember where I read this ,.believe context : western forts and native camps ??
Well,. that said ,. Biting the bullet ,.. and chewing on one to past the time ,. two differant things there . Blindpig

Believe it was a bit of a "habit" forming past time ??

 

[Tnmountains]

I have heard this my whole life. Today while digging bullets on Lookout mountains we again discussed this. The poor shape of teeth and biting on a bullet during surgery is doubtful. Not saying it never ever happened but they hit chert and look like they were bitten or chewed. I have lots of bullets that looked chewed but when they hit that old chert it leaves them this way. Why not just bite on a durable soft cedar limb that grows everywhere while they saw off you limb. Even below hospitals while diving in the river we never found chewed bullets but we found them in smashed sawed bones they chunked to the turtles.
My suggestion is get a 58 caliber bullets and take a bite out of it and post it not one you found. Cause I have many chewed up bullets.

 

[Tnmountains]

...I have found chewed bullets as well,far from any battles or reason for anybody to be chewing on them!

Cody
I have some chewed bones beavers ate. Ancient.

 

[kuger]

Cody
I have some chewed bones beavers ate. Ancient.

I could beleive that!I had a jaw of a Cave Bear I found sticking out of a creek bank that was chewed on by something like a beaver,a long time ago.MSU has it now

....My "chewed",bullets were done by hogs

 

[Tnmountains]

Hey. How cool is that cave bear. I have an eye tooth from one cave bear and the university got the Saber tooth tigers skulls. I wish I would have kept them.I would have to repel 286' to go back.

We used to call those bullets medicine bullets that looked chewed.

 

[GatorBoy]

Just to toss this out there... going all the way back to native tribes in dessert settings there was a practice of putting lead shot and before that..small stones in ones mouth when extremely thirsty to cause the mouth to salivate and giving some relief even if mostly mental..since the mouth was no longer dry.

 

[MOBoy]

You might find my article "Just a Piece of Melted lead" to further the discussion.
It can be found along with other of my writings at: Articles on Metal Detecting Interest

MoBoy

 

[GatorBoy]

That's a good looking list of subjects.
I just bookmarked it.. thanks for posting.