Manila galleons

has anyone hearign of manila galleons that sunk off catalina island

  • san sebastian

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wreckdiver1715

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Justin, Your last post has been DELETED. Don is absolutely correct with his assessment. Now that you have publicly stated that you are willing to conduct an illegal activity, which makes any one of us who continues to provide you with information an accessory.
Because you are new to this forum, I want you to consider this a shot across the bow. As moderator of this forum, I must caution you that I will delete any further post of that nature, and if necessary ban you from the forum.

Enough said.

Q
 
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justintaylor

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Sep 10, 2005
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If a shipwreck book has a reported position of a shipwreck does it mean some one aleady salvaged it? Or does it mean they thinnk it might be the wreck.
 
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justintaylor

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old trader can you give me information n the manial galloens santa marta, san sebastian, and the nuestra senora de ayuda which all sunk off catalina island withvery valuable cargo aboard thanks
 

old_trader

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Mar 29, 2005
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Justin

I really can't I just found the history interesting and did a google search coming up with the trade routes map link I posted! Good luck in your quest!
 

Capt Tom

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Cablava in 2005, at the head of this thread, gives a good summary of Manila galleons lost throughout the Pacific. Just to add that the other Manila Galleon lost in the Philippines in 1639 was named San Raimundo, a 300 ton Almiranta which left Acapulco on 30 March 1639 and was lost at Nueva Sergovia, Cagayan, 5 August 1639.

Reference Tom Bennett's ebook SHIPWRECK OF THE PHILIPPINES see website Shipwrecks of the Philippines
 

bobinsd

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What was the name of the T-netter that was diving a wreck(s) off the beach in N. CA. He was also managing a piece of property which was yielding gold nuggets in quartz. He left T-net a few years ago, but had some great posts.
 

cuzcosquirrel

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I heard a story from a retired navy guy about how the global explorer sucked up most of a wreck in the channel islands that somebody else was trying to get a permit for. This was back in the 70's I think. I heard the story in 1983 while on a camping trip.

They are currently not collecting anything at Point Reyes, though they still let me look for pottery which I am grateful for.

My family has a lot of history connected to George Anson taking the Cavogonda, so Manilla galleons are my hobby and I have a lot of knowledge about them. I think I have helped place a few of them in history and broadened people's understanding of Spanish Pacific trade.
 

cuzcosquirrel

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Justintaylor has a good thought there, seven years ago. Chances are, most of the ones that were pinpointed well were found unless they sank deep or in hard currents. There were a couple that stated things like, "lost in open sea," but when you read some other people's correspondence, they get pretty well narrowed down and they talk about how it was in a certain channel, or thirty leagues out from such a point.

You would probably have to go through every book similar to what Robert Marx wrote to see what ones had been pinpointed and worked over, and I know he worked on a few they found. Then you could tally them up. Don't think anyone has approached it quite like this yet.

One of the things they said about the Channel Island wrecks were that some seemed to be in very active surf and tide zones near small, rocky islands.

The San Pedro has a clue that seems to indicate it wrecked in the Channel Islands.
 
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cuzcosquirrel

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I

From what the guy said about the wreck off Catalina Island. He said they collected two large boxes of items and took them away. They surmised it was used to fund clandestine operations in Central America.
 
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Klems

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One of the things they said about the Channel Island wrecks were that some seemed to be in very active surf and tide zones near small, rocky islands.

The San Pedro has a clue that seems to indicate it wrecked in the Channel Islands.

Would you happen to know where the source of the clue for the San Pedro came from? I'm quite convinced from everything I've read that a Manila galleon did go down somewhere along the northern portion of Catalina Island.

I think some of you may have seen it, but if not check out this survey request for the San Pedro from 1979.
 

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Capt Tom

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I am pretty new to reading these threads, but have been impressed at the information given here on the Manila Galleon trade and their losses. There are at least 20 Manila Galleons lost within Philippine waters if anyone wants to know their names, dates of loss and possible locations, they can purchase my ebook entitled "Shipwrecks of the Philippines", see my website for the book at www.Shipwrecks-Philippines.com

It is an excellent source of information which puts more than 1400 shipwrecks in date order.
 

cuzcosquirrel

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It's the story that the expedition of 1603 that Vizcaino made up the coast of California. He stated they stopped in the Channel Islands and were approached by indians who had silk from a nearby wreck. He tried to follow a canoe to it but was pushed back out to sea.


The San Pedro disappeared about this time. It was on the sub-route back from the Phillipines area. The sub route was supposed to carry no silk, but I bet it did, and it was supposed to be a very rich ship. I think it was 1597.
 

Klems

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Hmm, yeah that is the story I keep running across too. I'm just wondering where to find the primary source to find some more descriptions.

I also found Kenworthy's original search request with the coordinates. In it, he gives two different search areas. The first one on the leeward side of the island, which was probably scoured by the Glomar Explorer and Jim and Lani Muche in 1979 (Mysterisous Island: Catalina, Page 60).

Now I haven't heard of anything on the other search box on the windward side, so either there isn't anything there...or nobody wants to talk about it. Either way I haven't heard of anything. I'll need to go back into the newspapers some more.
 

bronzecannons

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Justintaylor:

Tell me I'm wrong, but it sounds like you wish to do an illegal activity. If so, I'm not the person to ask for information. If you're still serious about your intentions, I hope you first contact the USCG and ask about their regular patrols in that area with their boats, cutters and aircraft; then inquire about the fines and possible jail time that can be 'awarded' for stealing galleon artifacts from those waters.
Don.....

Talk about jumping to conclusions. Where did he write anywhere there that he's planning to so such illegal activities??? :icon_scratch:
TW
 

mariner

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It's the story that the expedition of 1603 that Vizcaino made up the coast of California. He stated they stopped in the Channel Islands and were approached by indians who had silk from a nearby wreck. He tried to follow a canoe to it but was pushed back out to sea.


The San Pedro disappeared about this time. It was on the sub-route back from the Phillipines area. The sub route was supposed to carry no silk, but I bet it did, and it was supposed to be a very rich ship. I think it was 1597.

I do not recall that Vizcaino had any such experience when he visited the area. Earlier, in 1542, Cabrillo had been told about a wreck on Catalina Island, but again, I do not recall the story of Indians showing him silks.

If I am wrong, I would appreciate references to the appropriate accounts.
 

cuzcosquirrel

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I think it was in one of the Wagner books or citations. I don't see it right now on my shelf, but I think You can probably find it on line pretty easy.
 

Capt Tom

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As far as I can ascertain, all the Manila Galleons likely to off California would be carrying silks at that time.
 

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