Phoenix Area Clovis

[leadnugget]

this broken point, just under 3" long, was found feb 2018 at 33.97700215683875, -112.50805647543922
my friend that found it took it to ASU. they told him it was Clovis and about 10,000 years old.
recently i was reading that there are only 3 known Clovis points from the phoenix area.

A Newly Discovered Clovis Point from the Phoenix Basin and an Update on Arizona Clovis Point ttributes

A Newly Discovered Clovis Point from the Phoenix Basin and an Update on Arizona Clovis Point ttributes

www.academia.edu

posting this information here as it might help someone who is interested in these.
maybe there are more in that area?

note, if you go to this area it is extremely remote and unforgiving.
this should be a winter time exploration. 4x4 recommended.
bring lots of water.

 

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[traveller777]

Thanks for your post.

Just curious, anything noticeable about the features of the land that would draw a Paleo people there? I am aware that land features change over thousands of years, but some things remain similar. Shelter? Possibly a ravine that water may have flowed through?

Have a great day.

 

[leadnugget]

Trilby wash likely would have had water running back then.
if you look at google earth you can see a trail, it goes between 2 volcanic bottle bottlenecks
red picacho and white picacho. its a natural funnel that animals going to or from water
would have to take. good ambush point.

also Trilby wash is the best way to access the area.
best parking spot to get to the trail. 33.97801491920993, -112.51330877943633

off topic, but right in this area
there is a spring 33.977594090532584, -112.51247425923154
i read someplace, that during prohibition there was a moonshine still
setup at this spring.

 

[traveller777]

Trilby wash likely would have had water running back then.
if you look at google earth you can see a trail, it goes between 2 volcanic bottle bottlenecks
red picacho and white picacho. its a natural funnel that animals going to or from water
would have to take. good ambush point.

also Trilby wash is the best way to access the area.
best parking spot to get to the trail. 33.97801491920993, -112.51330877943633

off topic, but right in this area
there is a spring 33.977594090532584, -112.51247425923154
i read someplace, that during prohibition there was a moonshine still
setup at this spring.

Thanks for very detailed and informative reply.

 

[dirstscratcher]

Hmm, could be paleo, but nothing indicates Clovis to me.

 

[newnan man]

Not Clovis. Too narrow, not the flaking style used on Clovis type points, no flute channel. Clovis is much older than 10k years. More like 12,500.

 

[southfork]

I would like to see more photos different angles. What makes it Clovis?

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Sorry, not seeing a Clovis at all.

 

[11KBP]

A 10,000 year old Clovis?

I think the finder was misled by “ASU”.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

A 10,000 year old Clovis?

I think the finder was misled by “ASU”.

Either the original finder was not truthful about ASU comment, or someone at ASU doesn't know what they are talking about.

 

[joshuaream]

It's a neat piece, it looks old like a couple of people have mentioned, but I see nothing that stands out as Clovis.

There are a lot of archaeologists whose knowledge of broad areas of archaeology is limited to what they saw in introductory classes during undergrad, 20+ years ago. (Paleo, European, Asian, Central American, etc.) They could be world renowned experts in their field.

Or they could be a eager undergrad, grad student, or even volunteer at a museum who becomes an Archaeologist when the history is retold.

 

[leadnugget]

when i first saw it, i was
thinking this is the middle part, the tip and back end looked to be broke off clean.
was the back end like that on purpose, i don't know, i was thinking it was more of a dagger.
the metal that you may see in the picture just under the point is one of my mining picks.
i would post more pictures of it but these are the only 2 i have and were taken just after it was found
and i was not thinking i would post them at the time.
the guy that found it now lives out of state
and was 83 years old back then and may not even still be living. i remember thinking that day. it might be a bad idea bringing an old man way out into the desert to hike in this area.
heart attack waiting to happen and i don't think i could drag him out of there.
i am a nugget hunter, not an arrowhead hunter and really don't have much interest in them.
if i did, i would not have posted gps coordinates. i was in the area looking for other things. the guy that found it, also not a arrowhead hunter was tagging along just to get out of the house.
he was told by someone at ASU that it was a Clovis point and that it was 10,000 years old.
i was not there, that is what he told me ASU told him.
its hard to say, there are a lot of people in this world that claim to be an authority on something that don't know sh*t.
i was just trying to pass along location/information that may be useful to people who like to find points.

so if its not Clovis, i really don't know. but that is where and when it was found. i have not been back there since that day. i would think there would be more in the area.
good luck on the hunt.

 

[boogeyman]

A 10,000 year old Clovis?

I think the finder was misled by “ASU”.

Wouldn't be the first time....

 

[Tnmountains]

I have met and talked to and even hunted with Archeologist. As they said to me it is a very broad field of study. I have only met one and now retired that actually was an expert in Paleo in Tn. Most archeologist will take their career in a specific direction of study and hopefully excel. I guess my point is that many members here who specifically study artifacts are more knowledgeable than most archeologist. Because the archeological community does not always go hand in hand with these collectors or those who study lithics it is often a bridge to far when sharing information.
As the old saying goes we are always mostly out of context.

 

[Point#Hunter]

when i first saw it, i was
thinking this is the middle part, the tip and back end looked to be broke off clean.
was the back end like that on purpose, i don't know, i was thinking it was more of a dagger.
the metal that you may see in the picture just under the point is one of my mining picks.
i would post more pictures of it but these are the only 2 i have and were taken just after it was found
and i was not thinking i would post them at the time.
the guy that found it now lives out of state
and was 83 years old back then and may not even still be living. i remember thinking that day. it might be a bad idea bringing an old man way out into the desert to hike in this area.
heart attack waiting to happen and i don't think i could drag him out of there.
i am a nugget hunter, not an arrowhead hunter and really don't have much interest in them.
if i did, i would not have posted gps coordinates. i was in the area looking for other things. the guy that found it, also not a arrowhead hunter was tagging along just to get out of the house.
he was told by someone at ASU that it was a Clovis point and that it was 10,000 years old.
i was not there, that is what he told me ASU told him.
its hard to say, there are a lot of people in this world that claim to be an authority on something that don't know sh*t.
i was just trying to pass along location/information that may be useful to people who like to find points.

so if its not Clovis, i really don't know. but that is where and when it was found. i have not been back there since that day. i would think there would be more in the area.
good luck on the hunt.

I'm right outside of Boone North Carolina could you possibly give me the location where this was found Thank you for your time!!!

 

[Charl]

Any, that’s any, American archaeologist working in American prehistory, will know what fluted points are, and will know that is not a fragment of any variety of fluted point, including Clovis. Their specialty may be Woodland Era ceramics, or Early Archaic settlement patterns, or you name the subject from American prehistory, they will still know what a Clovis looks like.