Platinum Treasure!!! One Troy Once!!! Unique!!!

UnderMiner

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Final Edit 1/30/2015 : The test results are in: http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/general-discussion/448872-platinum-fork-test-results.html

I found this fork a few days ago along with some other less expensive treasures (mostly various grades of silver). Completed my research today and have come to the stunning conclusion that this is in fact... a 95% pure Platinum fork - solid Platinum with a gold plating - made by Cartier. This very well may be one of the most expensive pieces of cutlery in existence. Considering it weights 30.9 grams (1/5th of a gram shy of 1 Troy Ounce) I think it may very well be the single largest piece of platinum ever posted to this website. It's certainly the biggest piece of platinum I've ever found! I'm still shaking from the rush!! :headbang:

DSC08636.JPG DSC08638.JPG

Here's the story. Over the past week I've been pounding that old site by the shore again and again but this time using the new ExCal-II. It was a bit of a learning curve as I'd only used my new ExCal-II once before this. What a difference. The sandy/salty soil was no problem for the ExCal-II and the deep signals were coming in loud and clear. Ended up finding a ton more artifacts (silver, copper, iron, more globs of lead) - all much deeper finds than my other detector was able to handle. No more 18th century pepper pots unfortunately (I was hoping for a trifecta). I did however find, among other things, a sterling silver mechanical pencil (Victorian-age from the looks of it), an 80% silver olive fork, three hand-carved sterling spoons, a pewter dish, some broken pieces of porcelain, glass, and even what looks like to be a piece of an old shoe. I will post all these finds and more later in one massive post once I'm sure I've unearthed everything.

Anyway, this post is about the crowning jewel of the finds so far - the Platinum fork. I dug it up shortly after finding the sterling mechanical pencil. When I first saw the platinum fork it was all black just like all the silver in that area. I rubbed the dirt off (I know, I'm still kicking myself for doing such a stupid thing) and it revealed a golden luster - I assumed it to be a gold plated fork of either silver or some other cheaper metal. Into the bag it went and the hunt continued. At the end of each day I would clean and photograph my finds. I noticed the "950" hallmark during this time a few days ago.

The "950" is stamped in an "upside-down shield". I first saw this mark when I examined the fork the day I found it. I assumed it to be a sterling mark for 95% silver. I checked online a few times but really I had pretty much concluded it just had to be a type of silver. Today I did some in depth research and discovered that there is absolutely no sterling mark that resembles this hallmark. I did further research of other precious metal hallmarks besides silver and was stunned - the mark was listed as one of 4 types of platinum hallmarks. According to my research this platinum hallmark represents the second highest purity of platinum - 95%!! There is a crown above the "950", a little symbol that looks like an "R" directly above the "950", and a little "M" to the right of the "950". On the right side of the fork it says "Made in France" and on the left side it says "Cartier". There is also what appears to be some kind of etched serial number, possibly "1040". The piece weights 30.9 grams - almost exactly one troy ounce making it worth just about $1,200 in melt value.

The unknown: How old is this piece? I've had trouble dating this piece as hallmark charts by Cartier don't appear online in detail.

One thing is for certain Cartier is not known for cranking out platinum cutlery. I have a feeling this may have been a custom made piece. If so it may be unimaginably rare and expensive. My feeling is that it is worth way over its melt value of $1.2K - perhaps its worth $5k+ who knows? I will have to get it professionally appraised. Until then the hunt continues!!! :D Arg! Now with all this new swag I feel like a true pirate! :skullflag: :blackbeard: :laughing7:

Edit: Okay, it's officially confirmed. What I initially thought was an "R" stamp is in fact a "PT" stamp, "PT" means Platinum! "PT 950 M" is a high-strength Platinum alloy. The M stands for the 5% other metal added with the Platinum most likely Ruthenium! I'm on cloud 9 right now! :D

Platinum stamp along with hallmark chart:
Fork Hallmark.jpg appendix2_1.jpg

Cartier markings along the sides:
DSC08643.JPG DSC08646.JPG

Fork on my scale, note 30.9 gram weight:
DSC08647.JPG
 

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Upvote 53

MrMikeJackie

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Well I for one live on Long Island, 10 min from the Gold Coast. Underminer, I will gladly follow you to your spot and verify for all the naysayers the authenticity of the location, and the items I find there, I mean you find there. Wouldn't surprise me if you found gold leafed TP at that site. People who once lived on the Gold Coast were the richest in all of America. Oil, Railroads, Cinema, etc. In all honesty a platinum fork really doesn't surprise me coming from that area. What surprises me is how the hell did you get on a piece of property like that? Did you kayak in, at night, wearing a ninja outfit? Wtg bud! That's an amazing find and you will find more! GL HH Mike
 

Plumbata

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The M stands for the 5% other metal added with the Platinum most likely Ruthenium!

Don't forget people, the other 5% of this unique Platinum fork is composed of Ruthenium. 5,000.00 is certainly a low-ball estimate for such a singular rarity. Why isn't this on the banner yet?
 

Doubter in MD

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Well I for one live on Long Island, 10 min from the Gold Coast. Underminer, I will gladly follow you to your spot and verify for all the naysayers the authenticity of the location, and the items I find there, I mean you find there. Wouldn't surprise me if you found gold leafed TP at that site. People who once lived on the Gold Coast were the richest in all of America. Oil, Railroads, Cinema, etc. In all honesty a platinum fork really doesn't surprise me coming from that area. What surprises me is how the hell did you get on a piece of property like that? Did you kayak in, at night, wearing a ninja outfit? Wtg bud! That's an amazing find and you will find more! GL HH Mike
What do you mean by this? Is it public land that is off limits? Is it private land that Underminer could have obtained permission for? Please explain.
 

MrMikeJackie

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What do you mean by this? Is it public land that is off limits? Is it private land that Underminer could have obtained permission for? Please explain.
The north shore of Long Island is VERY exclusive. Most places are private and off limits. Most "public" places are posted stating "residents only". Police enforcement is mostly a private entity and are knuckleheads. Of course water hunting is different. If one can enter the water through public access you pretty much have all the shoreline below the high tide mark to yourself. I'm assuming these were water finds. But again, he could have gotten permission for all I know.
 

OP
OP
UnderMiner

UnderMiner

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Wow this thread has grown exponentially since last time I saw it. Anyway, I went to a specialist and had the fork tested by a pro. He said it was indeed a platinum hallmark... the "950 in an Upside-Down Shield" is an English hallmark representing 95% platinum... but this is not a platinum fork. By sheer coincidence the French produced a hallmark called the "Obus" or "cannon shell" which looks identical to the English "House" or "Upside-down" shield. This "cannon shell" mark was placed only on exported French silver and the silver purity number (e.g 800, 925, 950, 999) could be stamped anywhere near it. In a horrible coincidence Cartier thought it a good idea to stamp the silver purity number inside the "cannon shell" instead of next to it - resulting in their 95% Silver having a near identical hallmark to English 95% Platinum. So this is, as many have suggested, just a gold plated 95% silver fork. I would not have posted this as "platinum" if I hadn't been so certain, it was a one in a million fluke. I hope you can all forgive me... :unhappysmiley:

Furthermore the "PT" before the 950 is in fact an "R" as I initially thought, and the "M" apparently represents the 5% copper within the silver. The guy said it is worth $40-$50. No $2500 dinner for me anytime soon oh well ^^ ...but I guess a gold and silver fork is still just a bit more fun to eat with than a plastic one.

Cannon shell hallmark.jpg Hallmark plat silver.jpg
The result of the confusion was from the English Hallmark for Platinum being nearly the exact same thing:
English Platinum.jpg
 

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sjvalleyhunter

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I'm sorry for you that it's not platinum. At least it's a nice piece of silver though. And it's admirable of you to post an update with the unfortunate results of the test. Not everyone would have done so.
 

TheInspector

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Thanks for the update and the hallmark information. When the odds are against you, you are likely wrong, but lightning does strike someone everyday.
$40 - $50 isn't bad.
 

CRUSADER

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Wow this thread has grown exponentially since last time I saw it. Anyway, I went to a specialist and had the fork tested by a pro. He said it was indeed a platinum hallmark... the "950 in an Upside-Down Shield" is an English hallmark representing 95% platinum... but this is not a platinum fork. By sheer coincidence the French produced a hallmark called the "Obus" or "cannon shell" which looks identical to the English "House" or "Upside-down" shield. This "cannon shell" mark was placed only on exported French silver and the silver purity number (e.g 800, 925, 950, 999) could be stamped anywhere near it. In a horrible coincidence Cartier thought it a good idea to stamp the silver purity number inside the "cannon shell" instead of next to it - resulting in their 95% Silver having a near identical hallmark to English 95% Platinum. So this is, as many have suggested, just a gold plated 95% silver fork. I would not have posted this as "platinum" if I hadn't been so certain, it was a one in a million fluke. I hope you can all forgive me... :unhappysmiley:

Furthermore the "PT" before the 950 is in fact an "R" as I initially thought, and the "M" apparently represents the 5% copper within the silver. The guy said it is worth $40-$50. No $2500 dinner for me anytime soon oh well ^^ ...but I guess a gold and silver fork is still just a bit more fun to eat with than a plastic one.

View attachment 1112901 View attachment 1112902
The result of the confusion was from the English Hallmark for Platinum being nearly the exact same thing:
View attachment 1112903

Oh well, like I said earlier, we live & learn on here, its not a big deal & no sorry is needed. It was not deliberate, & anyone on here should feel free to make the odd mistake.
What you explained is where the knowledge bit is important, because clearly Cartier (World known company!!!) broken one of the golden rules, so in fact they made the first mistake, by coping a 'unique' hallmark. So your mistake is tiny compared to that blunder!
 

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ARC

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No worries... this has happened many times to all of us that have been dealing with "old stuff"...
I believe the "appraisal" of $50 is low...
Word of advice...
DO NOT SELL FOR THIS AMOUNT.
 

Treasure_Hunter

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Nothing to forgive.....

Posted From My $50 Tablet....
 

Sod Buster

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UnderMiner, good on you for coming back with this update. After all of the negativity, I was afraid we would never know the true outcome.

It takes some character to come back and say that it wasn't what you thought it was :thumbsup:
 

Ahab8

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Hey man glad you came on and cleared that up. Don't sweat it bro we've all been wrong. There's no shame in that. And I realize it's easy to let our minds race and get caught up in things. But it's a good lesson learned. Perhaps in the future leaving out the "100% confirmed", "Royal artifact", and "priceless" comments until you have a positive id. Usually if I'm unsure about a find or even if I believe that I am fairly sure I will post and ask for help. I use this forum as a great resource because I know there's so many extremely knowledgeable people on here. I've found that if we post an item and ask for help most folks are extreme helpful and will do everything they can to help. When people post something and declare it to be something and others disagree the feedback isn't always as helpful and positive. It just turns into a huge debate instead of a cohesive group working toward a common goal. We live and learn bud. So anyway thank you for coming back on and clearing things up. And I'm not trying to lecture you here. These are simply my observations. Trust me I've learned the most from my millions of mistakes :-)
 

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ironhorse

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Time to "stick a fork in" the debate...it's done. Questions asked and answered
Seems more than likely silver was the outcome, most of the other good finds were silver.
Only thing left to do now is go get some more
 

DFW_THer

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That thing is a Cartier, right? That ain't no $40 shrimp fork. It's probably exceedingly unique and to the right collector could very well fetch 5-6X that. Thanks for the update.
 

danimal03

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nice follow up. no worries on making a mistake. everyone makes mistakes. it is being human. we can't know everything. I have been collecting over 20 years and have made mistakes. the people who made these items are long dead so we can only make educated guesses based on previous knowledge. but sometimes this previous knowledge is incorrect as well. my hat is off to you for posting the follow up. it is important to share information as best as possible so others can learn.

still a nice find. I would put it in my silverware drawer and use it. you will get a nice story out of it every time you use it. nice find.
 

Pinball

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This has been a great thread, so for that I thank you...The ground looks like it will stay frozen here for the next month or so...so now I just have to live off of what everyone else is digging. Once again Thank You for posting this.
 

bill from lachine

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Underminer,

I agree with other posters....no big deal the makers marks were unclear regardless it's still a great find and should warrant a fairly high premium to melt value due to the Cartier stamp.

Regards + HH

Bill
 

WolfmoonX

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Dec 4, 2004
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UnderMiner,

I find that the information you provided in your update is just as valuable as your fork. It will definitely help anyone in the future who happens to find one of these.
So I add my thanks to you for the update.
 

Texas Kid

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Well Heck Underminer,that's kind of a bummer,but not really ! It's a great find anyway!!! There is no apology to this web site needed for gettin' wound up over a great find! Hell don't feel bad! Ive foamed at the mouth over a three dollar watch! You just keep diggin' that site and share your excitement with the rest of us ! Thanks for your research into what you found! That heals things up real quick!! The KId:icon_thumright:
 

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