Bejay
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- Joined
- Mar 10, 2014
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- Location
- Central Oregon Coast
- Detector(s) used
- Whites GMT
Garret fully underwater
- Primary Interest:
- Prospecting
A couple years ago I was enlightened by a presentation by Hal on the radio broadcast "Behind the Woodshed".
It was titled: "Public Land Layer Cake".
I transcribed it and posted the presentation on the old GPAA forum. I now post it here so that miners can realize what "Public Domain" is. I was clueless after mining for over 25 years and this one presentation led me down a path of knowledge that I believe every miner/prospector ought to have.
Here it is:
The understanding of the issue of Public Domain and Public Lands appears to be the base by which an understanding can begin. From this point I believe we can begin to comprehend all the different layers of authoritative mining/land issues. So this appears to be a must learning/understanding point.
WOODSHED PARAPHRASING:
KNOWING ABOUT THE SOIL/LAND THAT IS UNDER YOUR FEET AND WHO POSSESSES IT AND WHO CONTROLS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT.
NOTE! THERE IS ACTUALLY ONE GROUP OF PEOPLE THAT HAVE REMAINED FREE FOR A TALENT: THE MINER. THIS IS A RESULT OF THE MINERAL ESTATE GRANT AND PUBLIC DOMAIN PER THE 1872 MINING LAW ACT.
SO THIS BRINGS ON A CONDITION THAT NEEDS TO BE UNDERSTOOD: PUBLIC DOMAIN.
WOODSHED QUOTE:
"PUBLIC LAND IS THAT GENERAL UNAPPROPRIATED LAND THAT THE GENERAL MANAGEMENT LAWS APPLY"
"PUBLIC DOMAIN IS THAT WHICH IS EITHER DETERMINED BY OTHER CONGRSSIONAL ACTS AS SPECIFIC USE OR IS ACCEPTED FOR SPECIFIC USE; SUCH AS THE MINING LAW....THAT GRANTS EXCLUSIVE POSSESSION OVER THE SURFACE OF A VALUABLE MINERAL DEPOSIT CLAIM, OR AS IN THE 1866 ACT SECT 8: GRANTS THE CONSTRUCTION OF HIGHWAYS. NO OTHER EXPRESSED RESTRICTIONS APPL. A VERY FASCINATING OPEN GRANT."
PARAPHRASING:
IT IS IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND WHERE ADMINISTRATIVE AUTHORITY STARTS AND WHERE IT MUST STOP.....AND WHERE ADMINISTRATIVE AUTHORITY CAN BE CONDITIONED AND WHERE THE FULL AUTHORITY OF THE ADMIN MUST CEASE.
REMEMBER THERE IS A "PUBLIC LAND MANAGEMENT ACT" NOT A "PUBLIC DOMAIN MANAGEMENT ACT"
SO LET US UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENT LAYERS OF PUBLIC DOMAIN VS PUBLIC LANDS. WE WILL START AT THE VERY BOTTOM.....THE ROOT OF THE TREE IF YOU WILL:
PUBLIC DOMAIN IS DISPOSED TO PRIVATE USE.......ANYTHING DISPOSED IS PUBLIC DOMAIN
1ST..BOTTOM LAYER ....ALL DISPOSED LANDS WHICH IS PUBLIC DOMAIN.
2ND...LAYER ABOVE...... IS PUBLIC LANDS
IT IS IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND THE LAYER ABOVE CAN NOT TOUCH THE LAYER BELOW.
3RD LAYER....................PUBLIC LANDS CAN BE FURTHER DESIGNATED AS OTHER NAMES THAT BUILD ON TOP OF THESE PUBLIC LANDS THAT HAVE THEIR DISTINCT ADMINISTRATION DELEGATED TO THE SECRETARY OF THE INTEREIOR/BLM. HOWEVER THERE HAVE BEEN SOME RESERVATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN MADE THAT WE KNOW AS FOREST RESERVES OR NATIONAL FOREST LANDS; THE CURRENT VERNACULAR IS.
SO WE HAVE PUBLIC DOMAIN & PUBLIC LANDS & ANY OTHER LAYER THAT SUB-DIVIDES THE AUTHIOITY
& THEN EVEN
AQUIRED LANDS...WHERE THE U.S. GOV. GOES BACK AND ACUTALLY PURCHASES IT. THE MINARD CASE OF 2009 IS A PRIME EXAMPLE: WHERE THE GOV APPROPRIATED $$$ FOR THE USFS TO BUY SURFACE RIGTHS/MINERAL RIGHTS FROM THE ENTRYMAN MINERAL LANDOWNER. THIS IS A BACK EAST CASE. THIS IS A VERY FASCINATING CASE BECAUSE IT EXPLAINS THE LIMITED POWER OF GOVERNMENT; BEING ONLY WON EVEN WHERE THEY OWN THE TITLE, AND HAVING TO AQUIRE IT BY PURCHASE, TO THAT OF A NORMAL PROPERTY OWNER.
& THEN WE STILL HAVE:
THERE IS ANOTHER PUBLIC LAND THAT IS DESCRIBED AS FED LANDS BUT IS SPLIT ESTATE LANDS WHERE THE FEDS HAVE GRANTED PART OF THE FED LAND AWAY. TYPICALLY THIS IS THE HOMESTEAD ACT WHERE THEY GOT ONLY THE SURFACE FOR STOCK GRAZING AND SUCH. WHERE YOU GET THE SURFACE BUT NOT THE MINERALS. THE MINERALS WERE ALWAYS RESERVED FOREVER AND SO THESE ARE "SPLIT ESTATE LANDS" AND THESE ARE UNDER YET A DIFFERENT MANAGEMENT AUTHORITY.
THEN YOU HAVE LANDS THAT ARE TO BE DISPOSED OF CONTINUALLY, THAT ARE MINERAL IN CHARACTER, BUT ARE TO BE DISPOSABLE LANDS....THOSE LANDS ARE UNDER A DIFFERENT PROVISION OF THE LAW FOR MANAGEMENT. THOSE ARE MINERAL LANDS BUT THEY ARE NOT "GRANTED" LANDS.
AND SO YOU FIND THESE DIFFERENT TYPES OF LANDS; THEY ARE DIFFERENT AND DISTINCT AND YOU HAVE TO KEEP TRACK OF THEM; AND WHEN THE MINERS COME IN THEY COME IN ON THE VERY BOTTOM: THE "PUBLIC DOMAIN". THE HWYS ARE EVEN ON THE PUBLIC DOMAIN. NOT EVEN THE AGENCIES CAN STEP DOWN TO STEP ON IT OR CONTROL IT.
BUT YET WE HAVE ALLOWED THEM TO DO SO......BECAUSE WE REMAIN SILENT!
END OF PARAPHRASE BEHIND THE WOODSHED.
=============================================================
ALSO!
WHEN THINKING OF THE MINERAL ESTATE GRANT....HOW IS THE WORD "GRANT" CLEAR AND UNDERSTOOD? PER MY OWN PHRASE: THE GRANT IS THE RESULT OF A CONGRESSIONAL ACT FOR A SPECIFIC USE THAT CONVEYS PUBLIC LAND INTO PUBLIC DOMAIN FOR THAT USE AND POSSESSION.
I believe this will afford people the ability to begin to go down the path of understanding.
Bejay
Proud of my generation and never to old to learn
It was titled: "Public Land Layer Cake".
I transcribed it and posted the presentation on the old GPAA forum. I now post it here so that miners can realize what "Public Domain" is. I was clueless after mining for over 25 years and this one presentation led me down a path of knowledge that I believe every miner/prospector ought to have.
Here it is:
The understanding of the issue of Public Domain and Public Lands appears to be the base by which an understanding can begin. From this point I believe we can begin to comprehend all the different layers of authoritative mining/land issues. So this appears to be a must learning/understanding point.
WOODSHED PARAPHRASING:
KNOWING ABOUT THE SOIL/LAND THAT IS UNDER YOUR FEET AND WHO POSSESSES IT AND WHO CONTROLS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT.
NOTE! THERE IS ACTUALLY ONE GROUP OF PEOPLE THAT HAVE REMAINED FREE FOR A TALENT: THE MINER. THIS IS A RESULT OF THE MINERAL ESTATE GRANT AND PUBLIC DOMAIN PER THE 1872 MINING LAW ACT.
SO THIS BRINGS ON A CONDITION THAT NEEDS TO BE UNDERSTOOD: PUBLIC DOMAIN.
WOODSHED QUOTE:
"PUBLIC LAND IS THAT GENERAL UNAPPROPRIATED LAND THAT THE GENERAL MANAGEMENT LAWS APPLY"
"PUBLIC DOMAIN IS THAT WHICH IS EITHER DETERMINED BY OTHER CONGRSSIONAL ACTS AS SPECIFIC USE OR IS ACCEPTED FOR SPECIFIC USE; SUCH AS THE MINING LAW....THAT GRANTS EXCLUSIVE POSSESSION OVER THE SURFACE OF A VALUABLE MINERAL DEPOSIT CLAIM, OR AS IN THE 1866 ACT SECT 8: GRANTS THE CONSTRUCTION OF HIGHWAYS. NO OTHER EXPRESSED RESTRICTIONS APPL. A VERY FASCINATING OPEN GRANT."
PARAPHRASING:
IT IS IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND WHERE ADMINISTRATIVE AUTHORITY STARTS AND WHERE IT MUST STOP.....AND WHERE ADMINISTRATIVE AUTHORITY CAN BE CONDITIONED AND WHERE THE FULL AUTHORITY OF THE ADMIN MUST CEASE.
REMEMBER THERE IS A "PUBLIC LAND MANAGEMENT ACT" NOT A "PUBLIC DOMAIN MANAGEMENT ACT"
SO LET US UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENT LAYERS OF PUBLIC DOMAIN VS PUBLIC LANDS. WE WILL START AT THE VERY BOTTOM.....THE ROOT OF THE TREE IF YOU WILL:
PUBLIC DOMAIN IS DISPOSED TO PRIVATE USE.......ANYTHING DISPOSED IS PUBLIC DOMAIN
1ST..BOTTOM LAYER ....ALL DISPOSED LANDS WHICH IS PUBLIC DOMAIN.
2ND...LAYER ABOVE...... IS PUBLIC LANDS
IT IS IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND THE LAYER ABOVE CAN NOT TOUCH THE LAYER BELOW.
3RD LAYER....................PUBLIC LANDS CAN BE FURTHER DESIGNATED AS OTHER NAMES THAT BUILD ON TOP OF THESE PUBLIC LANDS THAT HAVE THEIR DISTINCT ADMINISTRATION DELEGATED TO THE SECRETARY OF THE INTEREIOR/BLM. HOWEVER THERE HAVE BEEN SOME RESERVATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN MADE THAT WE KNOW AS FOREST RESERVES OR NATIONAL FOREST LANDS; THE CURRENT VERNACULAR IS.
SO WE HAVE PUBLIC DOMAIN & PUBLIC LANDS & ANY OTHER LAYER THAT SUB-DIVIDES THE AUTHIOITY
& THEN EVEN
AQUIRED LANDS...WHERE THE U.S. GOV. GOES BACK AND ACUTALLY PURCHASES IT. THE MINARD CASE OF 2009 IS A PRIME EXAMPLE: WHERE THE GOV APPROPRIATED $$$ FOR THE USFS TO BUY SURFACE RIGTHS/MINERAL RIGHTS FROM THE ENTRYMAN MINERAL LANDOWNER. THIS IS A BACK EAST CASE. THIS IS A VERY FASCINATING CASE BECAUSE IT EXPLAINS THE LIMITED POWER OF GOVERNMENT; BEING ONLY WON EVEN WHERE THEY OWN THE TITLE, AND HAVING TO AQUIRE IT BY PURCHASE, TO THAT OF A NORMAL PROPERTY OWNER.
& THEN WE STILL HAVE:
THERE IS ANOTHER PUBLIC LAND THAT IS DESCRIBED AS FED LANDS BUT IS SPLIT ESTATE LANDS WHERE THE FEDS HAVE GRANTED PART OF THE FED LAND AWAY. TYPICALLY THIS IS THE HOMESTEAD ACT WHERE THEY GOT ONLY THE SURFACE FOR STOCK GRAZING AND SUCH. WHERE YOU GET THE SURFACE BUT NOT THE MINERALS. THE MINERALS WERE ALWAYS RESERVED FOREVER AND SO THESE ARE "SPLIT ESTATE LANDS" AND THESE ARE UNDER YET A DIFFERENT MANAGEMENT AUTHORITY.
THEN YOU HAVE LANDS THAT ARE TO BE DISPOSED OF CONTINUALLY, THAT ARE MINERAL IN CHARACTER, BUT ARE TO BE DISPOSABLE LANDS....THOSE LANDS ARE UNDER A DIFFERENT PROVISION OF THE LAW FOR MANAGEMENT. THOSE ARE MINERAL LANDS BUT THEY ARE NOT "GRANTED" LANDS.
AND SO YOU FIND THESE DIFFERENT TYPES OF LANDS; THEY ARE DIFFERENT AND DISTINCT AND YOU HAVE TO KEEP TRACK OF THEM; AND WHEN THE MINERS COME IN THEY COME IN ON THE VERY BOTTOM: THE "PUBLIC DOMAIN". THE HWYS ARE EVEN ON THE PUBLIC DOMAIN. NOT EVEN THE AGENCIES CAN STEP DOWN TO STEP ON IT OR CONTROL IT.
BUT YET WE HAVE ALLOWED THEM TO DO SO......BECAUSE WE REMAIN SILENT!
END OF PARAPHRASE BEHIND THE WOODSHED.
=============================================================
ALSO!
WHEN THINKING OF THE MINERAL ESTATE GRANT....HOW IS THE WORD "GRANT" CLEAR AND UNDERSTOOD? PER MY OWN PHRASE: THE GRANT IS THE RESULT OF A CONGRESSIONAL ACT FOR A SPECIFIC USE THAT CONVEYS PUBLIC LAND INTO PUBLIC DOMAIN FOR THAT USE AND POSSESSION.
I believe this will afford people the ability to begin to go down the path of understanding.
Bejay
Proud of my generation and never to old to learn
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