Shotgun shell with no headstamp.

[stratos]

I found this shotgun shell at a lake today, I do not see any type of head stamp on this shell. Back in the 1800's there was a train station here and resort of some kind. The pic has a 10ga for comparison. I was wondering if this was a 4,6 or 8 ga. When they used to hunt duck for commercial reasons, with the guns strapped down to the front of the boat.


Thank you for looking at this.

 

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[Ant]

That has nothing to do with modern smokeless powder loads, you shoot those hot loads and the plastic will melt and bugle out causing the shell to stick in chamber. I have taken gobs factory loads apart and the powder isn't over the brass.

If what you say is correct all the brass would be the same height. You are referring to some hobby reloading specs that might have the shotgun blow up in your face.

 

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[Ant]

Yeah lets stick to the topic.

 

[NOLA_Ken]

Having been around ammunition my entire life, having reloaded my own shotshells and having taken more apart than I could count, this is exactly what I would expect the inside of the brass in an old paper shell to look like. The flash hole is likely just obscured. The brass on those shells was just to give it enough strength to stay together and because the shells could burn through when fired. The powder charge does go above the brass.... some times far above the brass....

Anyone who thinks the brass is there to contain the charge is wrong. By way of proof.... here are a couple shells made entirely of plastic


The difference between high and low brass on modern shells is pretty much cosmetic, and traces back to the paper shell days when heavier loads used a slower burning powder, the high brass was a little extra insurance that the paper hull wouldn't burn through with the longer burn time before the gasses pushed the load out of the shell

 

[Ant]

I never fooled with many paper shells, but have taken apart my share of factory shells. This is a subject that is widely debated:

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20121210114426AADpZVI

Now back to the question at hand.

 

[Crappies-n-Coins]

 

[Ant]

So Ken and Crappies-n-coins if this a shell similar to a shotgun shell there shouldn't be an opening for the primer ignition (white circle)? But it could be a primer strick dud and the powder is under whatever is plugging it up, or it could fired and and that is dirt plugging it up instead of a packing, , or perhaps....

 

[Ant]

Oh here's the pic:

 

[NOLA_Ken]

it looks to me like the cardboard has gotten mushy from exposure to moisture, poking around in the center should reveal the end of the primer or at least the flash hole.

 

[NOLA_Ken]

I have a few paper shells but I don't want to cut one up. Here's a cutaway photo of two side by side, on the left you can see that the powder charge goes above the brass, on the right you can see that the brass has a hard cardboard lining, notice that the primer sits low in it, and imagine if that lining had gotten soggy and smashed around until the primer was covered.

 

[Ant]

Thanks for your thoughts. Now lets see if he can probe for a hole or pull it out to see if in fact there is evidence of a primer underneath.

 

[stratos]

I was able to push the primer out and found no numbers on it. I was able to spin the paper around in the the brass and it popped out. Looking at it this is a paper shell.

 

[NOLA_Ken]

Looks like a standard 209 primer, still in use today, and the cardboard is exactly what I would expect from an old paper hull....

 

[NOLA_Ken]

Maybe one of these......


https://www.facebook.com/rodsnpistons/videos/1169383173105983/