Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

[itmaiden]

Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Should a state set up a "protection area" under a misnomer for the purpose of "protecting" shipwrecks for future study ?

itmaiden

 

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[Salvor6]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

The state has already done that. The Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary is one of them. Problem is that they have no plans on studying the wrecks now or anytime in the future. Treasure hunters found wrecks at Amelia Island. Now its the Amelia Aquatic Preserve and thunters are forbidden. Tell the state you found a wreck somewhere and they will make the area a aquatic preserve.

 

[Alexandre]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Look at what they have done at Lake Champlain. I dove with Arthur Cohn, the director, in the Azores and, before our campaign was over, he had me head over wheels about their program.


http://www.lcmm.org/

 

[itmaiden]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Yes, I am aware. I suppose we should consider it a future underwater "bank account" ?


itmaiden

The state has already done that. The Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary is one of them. Problem is that they have no plans on studying the wrecks now or anytime in the future. Treasure hunters found wrecks at Amelia Island. Now its the Amelia Aquatic Preserve and thunters are forbidden. Tell the state you found a wreck somewhere and they will make the area a aquatic preserve.

 

[wwwtimmcp]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

I disagree,
1. the marine environment can destroy artifacts
2. you really can't see too much when it is buried under water that is dirty,under mud,sand,coral, etc.
3. if the wreck is considered historical, the state or fed should have an option of working with the salvor but nothing more.
4. I like what barry clifford has done with the whydah so far and mel fisher too with the atocha. I learned alot from them and burt kilbride too.
5. storms,shifting sands,ice breakup,divers,kids,anchors,fishing equipment all can destroy or shift pieces of wreckage, why wait until it is gone ? as joni mitchell said, "don't it always seem to go you don't know what you got till it's gone"

 

[itmaiden]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Artifacts and archaeological data are altered or destroyed with time and human activity, as well as the environmental factors. Most state "protected areas" are associated with Treasure Ships. I was reading that on the East coast of the US from Cape Hatteras (spelling?) down to the Keys there are an estimated 20,000-30,000 wrecks.

itmaiden

I disagree,
1. the marine environment can destroy artifacts
2. you really can't see too much when it is buried under water that is dirty,under mud,sand,coral, etc.
3. if the wreck is considered historical, the state or fed should have an option of working with the salvor but nothing more.
4. I like what barry clifford has done with the whydah so far and mel fisher too with the atocha. I learned alot from them and burt kilbride too.
5. storms,shifting sands,ice breakup,divers,kids,anchors,fishing equipment all can destroy or shift pieces of wreckage, why wait until it is gone ? as joni mitchell said, "don't it always seem to go you don't know what you got till it's gone"

 

[billinstuart]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

The state forgot to tell one person about the protection plan..Mother Nature. Unlike the great lakes, Floridas wrecks constantly undergo the ravages of storms, saltwater, critters. Good idea, but poorly thought out. Why am I NOT surprised

 

[PhipsFolly]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

I think maybe the true question should be, "Why do WE as citizens and tax payers allow the State governments (and Federal government) to put these no metal detecting laws into effect and make restricted areas out of every piece of land and body of water containing historical resources that they will never recover and preserve for us to see and experience? If we don't agree with them, we need to come together and at least make it known that we the people don't agree with their "tactics" and if they don't change their ways, they will no longer have their jobs and our support. Just a thought...

I am sure I will get "slammed" for this comment, but it's true. On a broader scale, I hear so many citizens complaining on a day to day basis in this country about what "the government does", yet we (whom THEY are supposed to be working for") don't work TOGETHER to make THEM change. We have gotten into this mind set of powerlessness... not good.

It was such a pleasure to attend that meeting in Ponte Vedra, Florida last year to meet with the State Historical reps in reference to the proposed rule changes that Tallahassee wanted to enact pertaining to treasure hunting and our historical resources here in Florida... there was a "show of force" and "the people" were heard... I definately think some changes were made for the better and the ruling was overall "corrected" (at least for the time being). But the point was that we took steps to show up, to voice our opinions, to "demand" change, and it worked well.

I don't have all the answers on how to handle the worlds problems, but I feel that if I am in disagreement with the "powers that be", it is my right and my duty to take steps to make my voice heard. I agree with everyone about how screwed up the government "land/water grabs" and the treasure hunting restrictions are... what can we do to come together and effect change?

 

[pcolaboy]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

I have heard Dr. Judy Bense, (former head of the Marine Archaeology Institute at U.W.F.) quoted as saying that she would rather take the chance of letting shipwrecks rot and the relics be lost forever, than relinquish recovery and preservation to private entities (treasure hunters). You might also remember her as the former chair of the Florida Historical Commission.

 

[wwwtimmcp]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

billinstuart, the great lakes have huge storms. the shallow water wrecks are ground to pieces, this is where the term "board pile comes from". ice breakup in the spring can carry wrecks and pieces hundreds of miles or destroy them on site.

phipsfolly, according to our local archaeologist the new shipwreck law is going to be repealed, it does not have the support. go figure since we were not allowed to vote on it.

I still say there is a way to work together and both sides will be happy, you just have to want to. I report to the state of ohio's archaeologist and I think we get along just fine. if the law was repealed today I still would report to him if for no other reason than to get his opinion. we both love history, I think that is the key. I plan on writing a book about all of this, and I am looking forward to another great year.

 

[FISHEYE]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

This country is headed for a total economy crash.I dont think you have to worry about any state making any more preserves as they are all about out of money.After the revolution im sure things here will be much better.

 

[itmaiden]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Revolution ? Too much population will be "killed off", made diseased, or kept ignorant. Remember, people believe what they hear in the news and as long as they are pacified by shows like Lou Dobbs, Glen Beck etc where their anger is appeased by feeling someone "understands", or of the belief still that "others" and government are going to police government then nothing will come to protect American rights.

The powers that be know how to manipulate every area of society. I believe in bible prophecy that there will be a one world government, and a one world economic system. That is why I am all for everyone finding as much treasure as possible as soon as possible, and not spending it on "stupid things" but providing for their future survival. I am very disturbed by satellite photos that show every house that exists, even 360 degree photos ! Talking about a lack of privacy ! Keep your boats in good shape. may need them for something other than treasure.

itmaiden

This country is headed for a total economy crash.I dont think you have to worry about any state making any more preserves as they are all about out of money.After the revolution im sure things here will be much better.

 

[Sapper23]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

I wonder when the State of Florida Historical Resources, Had a chance to get FL. out of a red with the State budget.. When, All they had to do is issue out more: Permits to Recover lost treasure and Recover True Florida history!!!!
The Shipwreck's just off east coast would get FL. out of the red with the budget. " Common Sense " would say: Issueing more permit's would Boost the local, and state economy, create jobs, and save history, AND maybe Both sides can work together!!
But the word: " Common Sense " is not in the Division of Historical Resources minds right now.

 

[itmaiden]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Florida in the red ? Nah. Florida keeps opening their mouth to the Feds for more money, while the money they have slides into pockets unaccounted for.

Florida probably doesn't want to use their untapped resources. As long as they can get Fed money, then they can "save their own" for a rainy day. Either that or Historical Resources believe they are balancing and managing resources for the good.

I wonder when the State of Florida Historical Resources, Had a chance to get FL. out of a red with the State budget.. When, All they had to do is issue out more: Permits to Recover lost treasure and Recover True Florida history!!!!
The Shipwreck's just off east coast would get FL. out of the red with the budget. " Common Sense " would say: Issueing more permit's would Boost the local, and state economy, create jobs, and save history, AND maybe Both sides can work together!!
But the word: " Common Sense " is not in the Division of Historical Resources minds right now.

 

[4theMoney]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Right now NOAA is trying to grab public opinion and expand the Monitor Marine Sanctuary into one of the largest on the East coast. From what I understand, it is to preserve wrecks mostly from WW2. I'm not exactly sure what there is to preserve. Go figure,,,,,The govt is broke as hell and they are still trying to spend our money.

 

[FISHEYE]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

NOAA doesnt want any of those vw bugs size groupers to end up on someones dinner plate.

 

[architecad]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Tell the state you found a wreck somewhere and they will make the area a aquatic preserve.

don't worry, Obama is working with that issue, just wait

 

[Bum Luck]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Tell the state you found a wreck somewhere and they will make the area a aquatic preserve.

don't worry, Obama is working with that issue, just wait

Obma doesn't care - this sort of thinking gets you nowhere.

I don't think that the state should set up a "protection area" under a misnomer for the purpose of "protecting" shipwrecks for future study.

I was at the Danish museum at Roskilde many years ago to see the gorgeous reconstructions of three Viking ships excavated in the harbor.

Think of all the kids that have passed through the doors since then to see them, and exactly how would that have been good if they hadn't been excavated until, say 2210?

We all have an interest in seeing history as best we can, and the simple fact of the matter is much of the information is lost over time, for lots of reasons.

We have an old army installation near here that hasn't done anything since the 1970s except drag their feet in 'cleanup'. It is interesting to study the 'institutional' mindset of the salaried bureaucrats behind a federal fence.

They are exempt from local everything, and the contempt they hold the very taxpayers that pay their paychecks in is disgusting.

 

[fortunate]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

This country is headed for a total economy crash.I dont think you have to worry about any state making any more preserves as they are all about out of money.After the revolution im sure things here will be much better.
..................what revolution?...we live in a police state..totally controlled by the powers that be....at the drop of a hat, revolution would be crushed...as long as we live within 'their' guidelines, (screwedup laws), they leave you alone..otherwise the hammer falls hard and fast and you are branded a crazed loony by all the brain-washed sheoples, gov, and media...have a nice life in prison

 

[Bum Luck]

Re: Should the State "Preserve" Shipwrecks for future study?

Off topic.