Springfield you have written one of the most lucid, well thought out and cogent posts as I have ever seen on the internet, and I must say that I agree with almost everything you say. It is hard for me to refute anything that you have said, because many times I have looked at other peoples signs on the internet and felt exactly what you have so succinctly expressed. So I feel that I should answer your post point by point so as to better explain why I continue to chase this dream.
I spend a lot of time traveling, mostly in the west, it’s a hobby of mine. In my travels I tend to stay away from cities and spend most of my time in the woods and the deserts, those are the places I feel most at home. And speaking of home, I live in the woods, in Colorado, in the mountains surrounded by pine and Aspens trees and lots and lots of rocks . So from that you can tell that I come in contact with a lot of rocks of different kinds and shapes on a daily basis .
Another hobby of mine is Prospecting ,I’m not very good at it but I have been doing it for a long time. Since I enjoy being out in the woods and deserts’ Prospecting just seemed like a good thing to do while I was there. I haven’t made much money at it , but I do have Mining Claims in four states, and I do enjoy the hunt. So yes I have erected, and helped others erect dozens and dozens of claim markers, Mostly metal pipe but every once in a while I have to build one out of rock just like the old days.
As for all the different people that put up rock markers that you mentioned, I am familiar with most of them. I am a hunter [Deer and Elk], I am a hiker, yes I have hiked in Southern Az. And New Mexico [ I have mining claims in both places ]and I’ve hiked in Sedona in Oak Creek Canyon. I’m sort of a miner,[ mostly placer], I have friends that are Ranchers, and I know a Surveyor pretty well ,I’ve even held his Rod for him. [get your mind out of the gutter, that’s what they call it]
Although I must admit that I’ve never waded across the Rio Grand, I have walked over some of the bridges. So I guess it would be fair to say that I’ve seen a lot of man made rock piles and cairns.
I’m not sure which Turtle your referring to that may or may not be one, but which ever one it is I have to agree with you, it may not be one, and the same for the hearts, I also see heart shapes in the field that look perfectly natural to me. But that’s why I’m here, trying to find information about which ones if any may be real.
In your last paragraph you mention people who believe something just because they want to believe it, again I have to agree with you. I see this all the time on the internet and in person, some body saying they know exactly where the treasure is, exactly what it is, why its there, and what its worth, some even say they have touched it,------but they never go get it, they will give you all kinds of reasons why they don’t go get it, but the reasons make since only to them. The really sad part is that these people will die some day and leave their fanciful stories of gold beyond your wildest dreams for there gullible relatives to waste there lives and money searching for. As a business man who has bought mining properties before, I have seen this first hand,
So taking all that information about me into consideration, here’s why I think that the little turtle rocks stand a chance of being real. [1] there are local Mexican ranchers that I’ve talked to , who believe that their past relatives worked for the Spanish miners hundreds of years ago, and settled there when the Spanish were defeated in the Mexican revolution . [2] the site is located within an old Spanish land Grant. [3]There is a small amount of actual historic data that suggests that the Spanish mined in the area. [4] the site is located in a mining district, meaning that gold has been mined there in the past. [5]The location of the little turtles makes it highly unlikely that any of the usual suspects, ranchers, hikers, hunters, etc , would climb up on top of a 50 foot tall rock, that has no easy way to scale it just to stack up some rocks. Mining claim marker, no way , me and everybody I know look for the easiest place possible to put a corner marker. [6] The size of the rocks. I know that in these pictures I show that its almost impossible to tell the size of anything, but take it from me these signs I show everyone are huge. And the little turtles are the same. I cant get up on the rock to measure them [way to high for me] but one time I accidentally took a picture of the little turtles while a Crow was perched on them and I was shocked to see how big they really were. Relative to the crow I figured that the small turtle on top was about four feet long and the one he sits on maybe five ft long . So even the small one must weigh a couple of hundred pounds, and to me it would make no since for a normal person to be up that high messing with a rock that big [7] their carved to look like two turtles, what are the odds of two rocks both looking like turtles without help from somebody? And what hiker would do that? And what hunter carries a hammer and chisel around with him. [8] their sitting on a skylight.
I could have put several more but this post is getting way to long, and I’ve got some things I need to get done . But I want to thank you again Springfield for giving me some things to think about, and I'm not saying that your wrong ,you may well be correct , but I just believe that in the case of the little turtles there is at least some supporting evidence. I also believe that we all need to feel a cold wet slap of reality every once in a while .
Twisted Fork and Azstomper ,I didn’t forget about you, I’ll write soon as I can.
TLH are you there man? I am dying here. This is worse than the acorn thingy in the "What is it" forum. hope he's ok...
