SWASTIKA, Mark that off the bucket list.. ID help?

[JackalopeZL1]

Hey folks, Well today I went out to my friends property where I found the piece of Reale(at least I think) and about 4 million square nails and found a few goodies. I found a couple round balls, One .30 call and one .50 and few other odds and ends and a PIN I need help iDing. It says S M B S around a medical cross. It is a screw type pin like a military style or something.

The the neatest find for me was this Copper SWASTIKA square. It has 2 little hinge pieces on the back. But nothing else. My wife was thinking maybe it was some sort of belt buckle or strap buckle but let me know what you think. Someone posted a 2018 goal thread and asked what you wanted to dig this year and I almost put a Swastika. Obviously a super neat piece of history. Also kind of neat how it was used for thousands of years and a sign of good luck and what not by many cultures until Hitler came along.

Let me know what you think it could be.. thanks

the pin has been figured out, French Red Cross. No date yet though

La Croix-Rouge française a été créée en mai 1864, sous le nom de Société de secours aux blessés militaires (SSBM)

 

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[JackalopeZL1]

Thanks for finding those!! Right on. Now I need to date the pin. I Might email the French red cross and see if they can narrow it down?

 

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[ivan salis]

please note ...the Nazi symbol is not "straight up and down and across" bars like the one shown ...it is a pre Nazi era good luck symbol ..... the Nazi one is at a 45 degree angle ...the Nazi's twisted both the meaning of the swastika as well as it design

 

[WaterScoop]

Nice finds!

 

[against the wind]

Congrats on the Swastika. Not too many are found very often.

 

[JackalopeZL1]

Thanks Guys!!

 

[Kurios1]

Way cool buckle and pin. Love finding things to research.

 

[Bonzododa71]

Hi JZ,
I found two items (Pre Nazi Era) one is a brooch hall mark 1910 "Hitler was a (toddler) at that time, and the other was a "Token" from a shoe maker ...Then as you know it was no longer a sign of luck or peace ......Bonz token is 1920s

 

[NOLA_Ken]

please note ...the Nazi symbol is not "straight up and down and across" bars like the one shown ...it is a pre Nazi era good luck symbol ..... the Nazi one is at a 45 degree angle ...the Nazi's twisted both the meaning of the swastika as well as it design

Ivan, that's actually not true. Many Third Reich items had the swastika sitting flat. For example here is a Waffen SS belt buckle :

 

[treblehunter]

Very cool finds Ken, I've found one good luck token with a swastika on it about four years back. It was always one of my favorite finds.

 

[JackalopeZL1]

Thanks Brad!!

 

[ivan salis]

hum I guess the Nazi's used it both ways sadly --I had hoped that the Nazi crap would all be the 45 degree slant type to help sort one from the other ...now it seems you gotta check very very close to be sure--and the Waffen SS were the worst of the worst at killing innocent folks (they were the death camp guards and wet work types for mass killings of local people not even bothering to send them anywhere but just making them dig a big a hole in the ground and filling it with them afterwards) they died for basically just being alive and unwanted by the regime

purely from a history stand point as a historical relic ...its interesting .....but it history is a history of mans cruel nature when left unchecked by common decency

 

[Trezurehunter]

Congrats on your bucket list find. I just found a Good Luck token with the Swastika on it last Sunday.

 

[nhbenz]

... and the Waffen SS were the worst of the worst at killing innocent folks (they were the death camp guards and...

Actually that wasn’t the Waffen SS, it was the SS-Totenkopfverbände
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS-Totenkopfverbände

 

[Bum Luck]

Any decent perusal of the 'net will reveal a couple of things relating to the swastika item:

Nazi era quality was typical of the times, good metal work, not like this one. We now live in a different era.

This is very low quality for the era, called a "tinnie". This is now "high" quality, notice the pin itself.

The swastika was indeed commonly tilted or straight. There was an elaborate and purposeful design heirarchy with all Third Reich items; really the same with US or any military.

Since most Nazi items are counterfeit post-war cheapies, to see a real one is relatively rare.

I agree that that the item isn't Third Reich.

 

[JackalopeZL1]

I don't think anyone was claiming it was a German piece.

 

[NOLA_Ken]

the Waffen SS were the worst of the worst at killing innocent folks (they were the death camp guards and wet work types for mass killings of local people not even bothering to send them anywhere but just making them dig a big a hole in the ground and filling it with them afterwards) they died for basically just being alive and unwanted by the regime

You're thinking of the SS Einsatzgruppen They were the groups tasked with "antipartisan" activities, and were responsible for a whole lot of atrocities, mostly in the East. For the most part Waffen SS units were just soldiers in a war like any others, but some units did commit some horrific war crimes as well...