Whats the difference between archaeology and grave robbing?

[Bejamble]

What's the difference between archaeology and grave robbing?

HowStuffWorks "What's the difference between archaeology and grave robbing?"

I thought this was rather interesting. To the point that some are allowed and some are not, meaning, why is it ok for "anyone" to excavate a grave. To me that is taboo for any reason other than for legal reasons or at the families request. For anyone to crack open a grave site just to see more about our history, should be not allowed. To me it doesn't matter what one could learn about a grave, you just don't do it.

On a side note, if a body is intentionally placed in a burial, it should not be touched. If it was due to accidental/intentional death or war and the body is left where they took their last breath, if it were my family member, i would without a doubt want to bring them back to me. The archaeologist locally told me that soldiers from the war should not be touched. To me that is completely backwards. Those that died in the war should be removed from the ground and returned to the family and given proper honors and that the "historical graves" should never be excavated. Defies logic if you ask me.

 

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[Davers]

IMO ,,Not to much , but every dig is different .

 

[G.I.B.]

If ancient cultures knew we would go to this much trouble to dig 'em up, they probably wouldn't have worked so hard to bury them so well.

Good question... what is the 'year mark' that determines archeology -vs- disrespect?

Generally it's nothing more than obtaining a permit from some governmental agency who's only interest is the fee for the permit should you have some institutional certificate of training or accreditation from people who collected money from you to give you a certificate in order to get a permit.

 

[Rawhide]

Cold Hard Facts G.I.B.

 

[Bejamble]

Just depends on who you ask. Archaeologist call us grave robbers and we feel the same. Too much stereotyping.


Cory

 

[pippinwhitepaws]

the big difference is that in one hundred years, or more, someone can look at the documentation the archeologist created, and see information the artifacts revealed...

notes, maps, photographs, detailed examination in a lab by professionals...all this will be recorded, and examined in the future by other extremely well educated persons.

nice try though...

 

[Bejamble]

By all means, I am not saying that the need for archaeologists is not there. I think that there should be more rigorous efforts to help metal detectorists work together. I do not feel that the detectorists should be stripped of their finds just because of an items age. There is a huge misconception between our local archaeologists that someone wielding a md is out to pillage grave sites and steal heritage. They went as far to tell me to my face that I cant dig on private land or public beaches without first contacting the historical society before I use a md. Keep in mind that there is no local law mentioning a single word about md's. As long as a person's integrity has been compromised, it doesn't matter if you are an archaeologist or any other Joe off the street. I would like to see more to help md'ers in the areas of resources and training. This is a 2 way street though, archaeologists need to be open to

 

[pippinwhitepaws]

We had all the Virginia State Archeologist and local historians back in the early 1970's digging and excavating for an old frontier fort called Fort Trial. I went to the County Clerk's office found a map 1928 with the fort's approximate location. Then I went to the County Surveyor and Map Office and found aerial photos in 1932 showing the outline of Fort Trial. All the historians ask where did I find the map I told them in the clerk's office. Then I contacted the State Archaeologist Office in Roanoke, Virginia---------I am sorry but the State of Virginia does not have the funds to do an excavation. But yet the Governor claims a $1 Billion Dollar rainy day fund surplus. Any metal detectorist or treasure hunter can out-class the archaeologist any day of the week and twice on Sunday. I also found the location of the frontier fort called Fort Mayo. No archaeologist ever found either one.

only due to no one being interested...what value is this fort in the cycle of history? does it change anything we know? is some secret to the construction of forts contained in the debrie field?

outclass? how strange to believe that....someone finds a fort...loots the site, dumps the recovered remains in a bucket in the garage...dies, and what happens...
who knows were the "junk" came from?
who knows how deep it was located?
what other objects were in association with the artifact?
what part of the fort were the objects found?
can the person who outclasses the educated , identify the object or place it's use among the troops?

really...outclass? only in disturbing the historical record...

 

[MickeyMaguire]

There is a notion that someone walking around with a metal detector and poking knives, screw-drivers, and little garden diggers into the turf might damage a rare artifact if one genuinely exists on a piece of land once used by an army, indian tribe, or someone else. A couple miles west of me lies a piece of land where George Washington surveyed during the French and Indian War. He returned to that same piece of land after the American Revolution and divided the parcel into plots for the Virginia Militia and appointed Col. Charles O'hara to divide it among his troops for their participation in the war. I can look out my master-bedroom window and see that parcel of land. It's a pretty good number of acres where Washington's encampment was. The locals do not know it. Washington drew up the original deeds and signed them. I have been all over that land. I have never shared that information until now.

State archaeologists don't know exactly where it sits. The farmland between me and the lots given to Colonel O'Hara was home to Washington's survey party on two separate occasions. Still, the local archaeologists from the state u. do not know where it is.

 

[pippinwhitepaws]

yhank you for making my point micky...
you, though what ever means...found a site no one knows about...especially the archys...
rather than write up a dissertation, or contacting someone with the knowledge and skill to survey the area...
you gloat only you know of the site.
that is the difference in an archeologist and a treasure hunter.

 

[The Dig Dig]

yhank you for making my point micky...
you, though what ever means...found a site no one knows about...especially the archys...
rather than write up a dissertation, or contacting someone with the knowledge and skill to survey the area...
you gloat only you know of the site.
that is the difference in an archeologist and a treasure hunter.

Just because you may not log, GPS & keep notes of your finds why do you assume no one does. I know exactly where everything I've ever found came from, it's depth, location & the date I found it, right down to my silver coins. I've never found a history changing relic but if I did I would treat it more than likely better than any archeologist. Because most of us have a passion for the hunt & find, they seem to be more interested in the publicity & government backing they'd receive for finding such a location or item.

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[pippinwhitepaws]

Archaeological Methods

Archaeological Methods

The Society for Georgia Archaeology » archaeological methods

 

[MickeyMaguire]

yhank you for making my point micky...
you, though what ever means...found a site no one knows about...especially the archys...
rather than write up a dissertation, or contacting someone with the knowledge and skill to survey the area...
you gloat only you know of the site.
that is the difference in an archeologist and a treasure hunter.

A couple of things...

First, I said that I've been all over that land... but, did I say I have been there with a metal detector? No, I did not. I have found lots of great arrowheads in the area and used to hunt them with the land owner. We were friends in high school.

Second, how do you know that I am not an archaeologist? I said that "state archaeologists" don't know where it is. The state university archaeologists don't know it either was my next comment.

At any rate, I gave a large quantity of Indian relics to the university as a gift for their museum. I am a writer and publisher and a big history buff. My interest is Colonial America, pirates, and buccaneers. My wife and I do a ton of research. I've logged a great amount of time in the state archives. I studied archaeology in school and if not for that being a strictly academic pursuit, I might have kept with it. I prefer historical research and travel writing.

 

[Bejamble]

Archaeological Methods

Archaeological Methods

The Society for Georgia Archaeology » archaeological methods

Great info!


Cory

 

[Bejamble]

Pippin may be the one to answer this. Bluntly, what is a coin. By law is it a relic, is it to be turned over to the local archaeologists? I have seen and read so many different answers for this, there just isn't a clear definition. If a 300 year old spanish coin is found on someone's private property in Midwest, USA, who gets to claim ownership? ARPA says artifacts over 100 years. Is a coin an artifact? NHPA deal with government land, what if the coin was found on a public beach. The whole legality of ownership is really a pain. I also spoke with our local historical society and the told me I can't dig anywhere, private or public. No laws state this. Any insight?


Cory

 

[Overvoltage]

So Archeologists would prefer to leave a site untouched. Leaving any and all artifacts in the ground unless there is a question about the society that can not be answered unless the site is excavated. I have a problem with this. First, how would one know something is different about a site if it is not excavated.
Second, if artifacts are left in the ground they definitely are not preserved. Anyone who has studied electro chemistry knows that any metal left in the ground will eventually corrode until there is nothing left. This can be proven simply by looking at the condition of the modern coins in my fins pouch. Also, if one waits long enough it will be impossible to excavate most sites as there will most likely be a road, parking lot or building placed over the site. In the construction of these, bulldozers tend to destroy/disturb anything that may be left.

 

[joeystafford1]

Archeologists have a degree, giving them permission to grave Rob.

 

[pippinwhitepaws]

finding coins in a sidewalk or yard is not the issue....going to an archeological site, prehistory, battlefield..ect, digging with abandon, throwing bones aside to recover buttons and bullets....is grave robbing.
an archeologist spends years, to earn the privilege, not a right, to excavate to further the knowledge base of anthropologists.

some people spend a few hundred dollars on a metal detector, and think they are better qualified to remove artifacts than the professional educator...

 

[The Dig Dig]

I've spent a lot more than a few hundred on my machines and I've spent years learning of our countries history Not getting drunk for 4 years on my parents dime so I can have a degree that says I can do things someone else can't.

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[pippinwhitepaws]

omg...of course...that's the rub...ALL professors , students and especially archaeologists, are drunks living of you and your labors...