Wheat bags. 5000 count.

[CincinnatiKid]

Hello all.
Stopped by my coin dealer today. Been dealing with them for a few years now. Good people.
I bought a bag of wheats, (5000), for $185 last month. Found some interesting coins, foreign silver, Indians, and many keepers.
They seem to have a hoard of wheats, cause I noticed a new coin counter. I asked if I buy more than one bag, can I get a deal. Yup. $170, if I buy 3 bags.
What do you think? Good deal?
Thanks
Peace ✌

 

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[G.I.B.]

Well, face value is $50. So paying more than three times face value would mean you need to find some spectacular pennies with high value to make your money back.

What is the value of the coins you found?

Do they exceed the price you paid?

Is your coin dealer NOT going through the coins first?

 

[CincinnatiKid]

Thanks G.I.B.,
Face is $50, but even one keeper can absorb the total cost.
I do trust that they've not been searched by my dealer. We had a talk concerning time spent searching individual coins vs bulk sales. They don't have time and want to keep a good reputation.
Just wondering what a normal price is for 5000 "unsearched" wheats.
Plus, I enjoy the search.
Peace ✌

 

[G.I.B.]

Well, you asked if you got a good deal.

That question can only be answered by determining the value of the coins now in your possession, compared to the price paid.

$500 would be a great deal, if you have a $10,000 coin in the bag.

$170 is a terrible deal if you have $65 worth of coins.

 

[baddbluff]

After fees, you could prob get around $150 for a bag if you sell it on eBay. So $65 is a little silly, to put it nicely. That's not a bad price. If u have fun searching and find a few decent coins, go for it.

 

[G.I.B.]

So $65 is a little silly, to put it nicely.

I'm so very sorry- I'll fix my theory for you with more realistic prices. It was just an example in economics and not intended to be taken literally.

Fixed statement: $170 is a terrible deal if you have $165 worth of coins.

 

[zach attack]

Better than most prices I see. If you have found valuable coins in the bags before I would give it another shot. I got bulk wheat cents on ebay a few times and my best find was a really beat up 1914d. Sold it for 70$. You don't get lucky every time but taking the risk could pay off. HH and have a great day, Zach.

 

[Iamrussell]

Thats a good price for that amount of a bag of wheats as long as they arent all 40's-50's

 

[el padron]

This is one of the reasons that I just don't fit in here.....
I can't read this thread without subliminally insulting someone.

OK, So please explain to me....

Under what circumstances in June of 2015, would a bag containing 5000 wheat penneys NOT have been carefully searched by someone in the past chain of possession?.
I mean, how could that be possible?
They are not typically in circulation any longer.
Their copper value stands at about two cents each as of yesterdays close.
Where do you suppose one gets a bag containing $50 worth of " wholesale wheat backs" to sell to treasurenet members in the first place?

 

[baddbluff]

This is one of the reasons that I just don't fit in here.....
I can't read this thread without subliminally insulting someone.

OK, So please explain to me....

Under what circumstances in June of 2015, would a bag containing 5000 wheat penneys NOT have been carefully searched by someone in the past chain of possession?.
I mean, how could that be possible?
They are not typically in circulation any longer.
Their copper value stands at about two cents each as of yesterdays close.
Where do you suppose one gets a bag containing $50 worth of " wholesale wheat backs" to sell to treasurenet members in the first place?

You might be surprised. Some wheat hoards out there are actually from the original accumulator, who may not have been a knowledgeable coin collector per se. I searched through a large bin of wheats at a pawn shop once (roughly 10,000 or so) and found a ton of pre-40 mintmarked coins and several better dates including 7 or 8 '09p VDBs, a couple 22d, and several early S-mints. I bought them for 4c each and sold them for $150+.

 

[CincinnatiKid]

I understand that most realize 1955dd were the last heavily "looked for" wheat cents and how many still seek 'em.
But, I have a good relationship with this dealer. He/they wouldn't steer me wrong.
Heck, the last bag I searched, most would be happy with after my cherry-picking.
These bags are the real deal. I just don't know where they came from?
I'm gonna buy more...
Thanks
Peace ✌

 

[G.I.B.]

The bag that is the subject of this thread...

What was the total value of the coins you got from it?

Did you find coins valued at more than what you purchased the bag for?

Was it a good deal?

 

[FormerTeller]

If you bought a bag of 5,000 wheats for $185, and it included foreign silver, indians, and many keepers, I'd say you did all right. My LCS pays $0.03 per wheat, regardless of year, so a realistic value of the bag for me would be $150. With respect to your question of is it a good deal, I'd say if you enjoy searching coins, then paying a $20 to $35 premium with the chance to hit it big (or at least break even) is probably a pretty good deal, especially if you have someplace to unload them after searching. Plenty of coin stores in Ohio that shouldn't hesitate to pay $0.03 each.

 

[FormerTeller]

This is one of the reasons that I just don't fit in here.....
I can't read this thread without subliminally insulting someone.

OK, So please explain to me....

Under what circumstances in June of 2015, would a bag containing 5000 wheat penneys NOT have been carefully searched by someone in the past chain of possession?.
I mean, how could that be possible?
They are not typically in circulation any longer.
Their copper value stands at about two cents each as of yesterdays close.
Where do you suppose one gets a bag containing $50 worth of " wholesale wheat backs" to sell to treasurenet members in the first place?

Under what circumstances would a bag containing 5000 wheat pennies NOT have been carefully searched by someone in the past chain of possession? If the bag was intact through many chains of possession, then I would assume the chances of them being unsearched would be very low. However, as the OP noted, this was at a coin store. The coin store apparently has a new coin counter. The OP clearly stated that he found foreign silver and Indian cents in the bag. I think it is reasonable to assume that the coin store owner has been throwing wheat cents into the bag as he accumulated them.

My LCS sells junk silver, right now going at 14x face. More than once I have found a key or semi key date in the junk silver bowl. The owner told me that if the coins aren't in Fine or better condition, he doesn't even look at the dates. With wheat cents, I suspect it's the same.

 

[MIhunter]

I agree with Former teller, 5000 wheats if they are all 1940-1958 circulated is worth $150, thus the question. Is will you find enough better stuff to make back the rest of your money and then some. Not a terrible risk from my perspective.

 

[huntsman53]

Most Coin Dealers around here sell rolls of Wheat Cents on an average of $2.50 to $5.00 for mixed dates/mints each in average circulated condition (usually Good to mostly VG with possibly a few Fines) and bags of 5,000 for $250 or more. The pricing is generally dependent upon the dates/mints that they know are in the rolls (i.e. 1930's to 1950's at $2.50 a roll and mixed dates/mints of Teens to 1940's at $5.00 a roll). If a roll contains mostly 1950's coins, they may give you a break but if the rolls contain all Teens or Teens and 1920's coins, the price will go up to as high as $10.00 a roll or more. Seeing that Bags of 5,000 average circulated Wheat Cents with mixed dates/mints from the 1940's through the 1950's usually sell for $170 to $180 before shipping in eBay, bags containing 1930's through the 1950's are a little higher and bags containing a good assortment of Teens through the 1950's can sell for $200 to $280, I would say that the O.P. is getting a fair deal at $170 a bag. After searching the bags and removing the keepers, the O.P. could roll the remainder of the coins and fairly easily sell them at Flea Markets for $2.00 to $2.50 a roll or even bag them in Zip-Lock bags and sell them. I have sold many bags containing 100 Wheat Cents for $5.00 each, 250 Wheat Cents for $11.00 to $12.50 each and 500 Wheat Cents for $25.00 each at Flea Markets but discount them when the customer buys more than one bag. The least I have gotten for them even on large mass purchases was $0.035 Cents each. The bags are fairly easy to fill and have ready to offer for sale as once you count out the coins for 100 count, 250 count and 500 count bags, you can weigh them and use their' weights for filling other similar bags. I always make sure that there is a little more in each bag weight-wise to ensure that the customer gets no less than what is stated in the bag they purchase. By the way, it generally takes 141 average circulated (Good to VG with possibly a few Fines) Wheat Cents to make a pound if the O.P. wants to sell them by the pound versus count but when weighing, I always make sure that the count goes a little bit above one pound, so in reality, the customer is likely getting 142 Wheat Cents and sometimes 143.


Frank

 

[Owassokie]

The bag that is the subject of this thread...

What was the total value of the coins you got from it?

Did you find coins valued at more than what you purchased the bag for?

Was it a good deal?

GIB, I hear you with the economics but I don't get the impression the OP is looking for an economics lesson. And besides, one bag isn't really a big enough sample to tell him if the next bag is "economically" worth it anyway. He seems plenty capable to do the math and figure out his cost per coin. This is a hobby/treasure website. "Is it worth it" doesn't always mean "Will I make/lose money". There's entertainment value. There's the thrill of the hunt. We sometimes pose questions to get a feel for how most people would react to deals that are presented to us.

My advice to OP - You're getting coins at a price that is very close to the resale value. Do you enjoy the hunt? You found a diverse mix of coins, some of which were worth well more than 1 cent. My guess is the first bag was either seeded or hadn't been searched recently. It's conceivable that a LCS has more pressing matters than to look through all the individual wheat cents (even if that sounds crazy to us CRHers). I'd take that deal. Go for it!

OO

 

[el padron]

You might be surprised. Some wheat hoards out there are actually from the original accumulator, who may not have been a knowledgeable coin collector per se. I searched through a large bin of wheats at a pawn shop once (roughly 10,000 or so) and found a ton of pre-40 mintmarked coins and several better dates including 7 or 8 '09p VDBs, a couple 22d, and several early S-mints. I bought them for 4c each and sold them for $150+.

That pawn shop may have well been your day in the sun.
I know a guy who hit the Ca Lotto for 27,000 in 1995. Now he buys 20 tickets a week and has been losing money ever since.
I am an optimist by nature, but when buying $50 worth of wheat backs for $150 one would have to yield an additional $100 dollars worth of numismatic value.
The vast majority Wheat backs are generally not worth much more then face value. To accept that "your" bag has not been searched and researched many times is absolutely ridiculous. They were at least sorted, weren't they?
They told you that your bag came from the original accumulator?
Good luck with that.
If you enjoy being the 5th person to endlessly search the same 5000 pennies, thats one thing.
The guy selling the bags is consistently creating value , over and over.
When your done sorting, him, or someone like him will get the dumped wheatbacks back and restart the cycle.
You might trip over a bag of hundreds walking into Wallmart, It's just highly unlikely.
The consequences of considering such transactions is a lifetime of scouring the internet and other places for "originally accumulated" and "unsearched" bags of wheat backs and dreaming about the unbelievable week you spent buying pennies for 4 cents and selling them for $2. for a grand total of a once in a lifetime $150.

 

[MIhunter]

I am an optimist by nature, but when buying $50 worth of wheat backs for $150 one would have to yield an additional $100 dollars worth of numismatic value.
The vast majority Wheat backs are generally not worth much more then face value.

You bring up an important point, what is the value of 1940-58 wheat pennies in G4-F12 cond?
Before you buy a bag of 5000 wheats or 3 bags you need to know, that even if there is a lot of great coins in there, 95+% of them will be 1940-58.
So you have to know beforehand, where are I going to dump the common wheats? and how much am I going to get for them?

El pardon says face value
Myself, I could bring 15,000 wheats cents tomorrow to my LCS and get 3 cents each.

 

[Avago]

El pardon says face value
Myself, I could bring 15,000 wheats cents tomorrow to my LCS and get 3 cents each.

Not much of a cent searcher myself, but I can't help but think that if your LCS is buying them at 3 cents each then surely he has a buyer at 5 or 6 cents each? I know the OP can get them for 3.4 cents each if he buys the three bags which sure seems like a slim margin to me, but still the fact remains that there has to be a buyer out there who is going to pay more for them than your LCS.

I don't think I would ever sell to them, cents or silver just because they're a middle man and I know I could get more elsewhere.