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  1. #16

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
    Explorer II, Compass 77b, Tesoro shadow X2
    6,165
    1819 times
    Banner Finds (3)
    post-script: Then you will have the admonitions about "arrests","confiscations", "tickets", "fines", "Jail", and so forth, whenever this comes up (as can be seen here in ticm and quartermaster's responses). Here's what you do: ask them to give any examples, that they may have, of someone having arrests and confiscations and criminal records, d/t metal detecting in a non-posted, innocous place (ie.: not a sensitive obvious monument). You will find the room to grow strangely silent! If any examples of "arrests" or whatever can be found, they will inevitably be for someone who was night-sneaking around obvious sensitive sites, or someone who couldn't take a warning, etc..... Not for hunting run-of-mill beaches, parks or campgrounds, out in the forest boondocks, etc....

    So go ahead, ask them for examples, and you'll see what I mean.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  2. #17

    Apr 2012
    Central connecticut
    133
    29 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA
    post-script: Then you will have the admonitions about "arrests","confiscations", "tickets", "fines", "Jail", and so forth, whenever this comes up (as can be seen here in ticm and quartermaster's responses). Here's what you do: ask them to give any examples, that they may have, of someone having arrests and confiscations and criminal records, d/t metal detecting in a non-posted, innocous place (ie.: not a sensitive obvious monument). You will find the room to grow strangely silent! If any examples of "arrests" or whatever can be found, they will inevitably be for someone who was night-sneaking around obvious sensitive sites, or someone who couldn't take a warning, etc..... Not for hunting run-of-mill beaches, parks or campgrounds, out in the forest boondocks, etc....

    So go ahead, ask them for examples, and you'll see what I mean.
    Thank you! That's why I laughed I think it's a blue law like you said, spitting on the sidewalk. I hear people talking about confiscations and getting arrested for detecting but it's always "this guy I know, his brothers best friends uncle was detecting and his friend got busted"

    Yeah I'm detecting in the middle of the woods where no one can see me on state property I'm not defacing anything and there are no monuments or anything like that.

  3. #18
    us
    Sep 2007
    New Jersey
    Whites V3i and DFX
    3,212
    790 times
    There are dirtbags that will shed bad light on our hobby. People such as any one who thinks they are above the law because they got away with hunting where they do not have permission or because other people are doing it.

  4. #19
    us
    Sep 2007
    New Jersey
    Whites V3i and DFX
    3,212
    790 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA
    post-script: Then you will have the admonitions about "arrests","confiscations", "tickets", "fines", "Jail", and so forth, whenever this comes up (as can be seen here in ticm and quartermaster's responses). Here's what you do: ask them to give any examples, that they may have, of someone having arrests and confiscations and criminal records, d/t metal detecting in a non-posted, innocous place (ie.: not a sensitive obvious monument). You will find the room to grow strangely silent! If any examples of "arrests" or whatever can be found, they will inevitably be for someone who was night-sneaking around obvious sensitive sites, or someone who couldn't take a warning, etc..... Not for hunting run-of-mill beaches, parks or campgrounds, out in the forest boondocks, etc....

    So go ahead, ask them for examples, and you'll see what I mean.

    I went to your profile and looked at your post history. It seems this is a touchy subject for you. Do tell.

  5. #20

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
    Explorer II, Compass 77b, Tesoro shadow X2
    6,165
    1819 times
    Banner Finds (3)

    reply

    Ok then ticm, then how do you answer this scenario:

    An example of why NOT to ask at innocuous public places (Long)

    If you lived here, do you stay at home, and really believe that all the other md'rs are somehow "giving the hobby a black-eye"? Or do you just go, because you see the beaches here are just routinely detected.

    Or for that matter, I can't understand WHERE you (ticm) detect, at all. Unless you stick to private property that is. Because if you can give me ANY public land where you hunt, I bet I can find some law you are breaking, on some level, somewhere, somehow. All I have to do is ask the right number of bureaucrats, with the right combination of buzzwords, and can find you a "no" at any place you are currently hunting. You may answer: "But I go all the time, and no one cares, even in broad daylight in front of the mayor!! " YES!! that's exactly the point ticm! Get it?



    Quote Originally Posted by ticm View Post
    I went to your profile and looked at your post history. It seems this is a touchy subject for you. Do tell.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  6. #21
    us
    Sep 2007
    New Jersey
    Whites V3i and DFX
    3,212
    790 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA
    Ok then ticm, then how do you answer this scenario:

    An example of why NOT to ask at innocuous public places (Long)

    If you lived here, do you stay at home, and really believe that all the other md'rs are somehow "giving the hobby a black-eye"? Or do you just go, because you see the beaches here are just routinely detected.

    Or for that matter, I can't understand WHERE you (ticm) detect, at all. Unless you stick to private property that is. Because if you can give me ANY public land where you hunt, I bet I can find some law you are breaking, on some level, somewhere, somehow. All I have to do is ask the right number of bureaucrats, with the right combination of buzzwords, and can find you a "no" at any place you are currently hunting. You may answer: "But I go all the time, and no one cares, even in broad daylight in front of the mayor!! " YES!! that's exactly the point ticm! Get it?


    You answered my question by asking another question.

    So your advice to this guy who started this thread is to go out where ever he wants, even when he knows it's wrong to do so. Great advice dude. LO.L.

    So why is this such a touch topic for you?

  7. #22

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
    Explorer II, Compass 77b, Tesoro shadow X2
    6,165
    1819 times
    Banner Finds (3)
    Yes, answered the question with question, because it's a fitting question to answer the question. Because it shows the issue is "never-ending". That anyone who hunts public property, simply hasn't asked enough questions, and dug deeply enough into the minutia. Or they (gasp) simply go where no one cares.

    "So why is this such a touch topic for you?"

    Because I saw first-hand, the whole evolution of this, having started in the mid 1970s, (when things were innocent and these things never dawned on anyone of us). And then slowly saw the introduction of these things, and the resulting people who heard of some far away bootings or laws or rules, (at the advent of the FMDAC which had the scary stories, and even more pronounced at the advent of internet forums). They promptly went down to city hall, wherever they lived, and "asked" (afterall, you can't be too safe now, can you?). And then presto, the vicious circle begins, and places get "no's" (by policy implementation or outright rules to address these "pressing questions"). See how that works? Then more and more places get put off limits by actual implementation. So you see that the ones doing "damage" to the hobby (getting places put off limits), are often time the ones going and seeking sanctions, approvals, neons signs welcoming them, etc..... Ironically it's not the other way around. I can tell you story after story of this exact scenario happening. For example, in my link, you can see how it might easily happen, if enough people went and "asked", or found this minutia, and thought "oh no, we can't detect". Imagine their surprise when they show up here, and beaches are routinely detected, and no one cares (so long as you're not being a nuisance in some other way). So what would you do here?

    Ok, to answer your question: "Am I promoting lawlessness?" Sure, let's go ahead and put it that way. And as I say, so too is the fellow who spits on the sidewalk in NY, and the fellow who pulls the tag off his mattress, etc... By all means, they "shouldn't be doing that" and are lawless miscreants I suppose. If someone is that concerned, then I truly think they've chosen the wrong hobby, or will need to stick to private property. Because as I say, gauranteed you too are breaking laws, on some level, unless you are not hunting any public property at all.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  8. #23

    Mar 2007
    Salinas, CA
    Explorer II, Compass 77b, Tesoro shadow X2
    6,165
    1819 times
    Banner Finds (3)
    And yes, by all means, none of us should hunt around obvious historic monuments, posted spots, etc...... I am not advocating "you can hunt anywhere, at any time".

    Also, have you ever given thought to this technicality ticm: Anytime any of us runs up against the "you can detect, but not dig" verbage, this keys in on the words like "dig", "alter" "deface", and so forth? Right? And as I say, this verbage is at any govt. level (I mean, afterall, what govt. entity "allows defacement" of their property? doh!). But think about it logically: ALL such verbage specifically implies an END result, does it not? So by logical deduction, you have not defaced or altered or vandalized anything, if you cover your tracks and leave no trace, now have you? Sure this is a semantics issue, and sure someone might take issue with the evil temporary extraction process (if you are parading yourself in front of lookie-lous). As I say, if this bothers someone, then they're going to need to hunt objects only on the top of the ground.
    Metal detecting is my one worldy vice!

  9. #24
    us
    Sep 2007
    New Jersey
    Whites V3i and DFX
    3,212
    790 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_in_CA
    And yes, by all means, none of us should hunt around obvious historic monuments, posted spots, etc...... I am not advocating "you can hunt anywhere, at any time".

    Also, have you ever given thought to this technicality ticm: Anytime any of us runs up against the "you can detect, but not dig" verbage, this keys in on the words like "dig", "alter" "deface", and so forth? Right? And as I say, this verbage is at any govt. level (I mean, afterall, what govt. entity "allows defacement" of their property? doh!). But think about it logically: ALL such verbage specifically implies an END result, does it not? So by logical deduction, you have not defaced or altered or vandalized anything, if you cover your tracks and leave no trace, now have you? Sure this is a semantics issue, and sure someone might take issue with the evil temporary extraction process (if you are parading yourself in front of lookie-lous). As I say, if this bothers someone, then they're going to need to hunt objects only on the top of the ground.


    You seem very passionate about this. Has it accrued to you to fight the fight in let's say your local government.

    It does no good to rant and rave here on some Internet forum.

  10. #25
    us
    Aug 2007
    Pittsburgh, PA, USA.
    White's Vision, White's 6000DI Pro
    1,924
    42 times
    My issue was with stating the activity on a public forum.

    I agree it's about as stupid a law as they come...but what you do outside the public forum is for you only...

    Al
    I think...therefore I am.

 

 
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