CIRCA 1900 FRAMED BASEBALL PICTURE

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

"Play Ball"

I went to a swap meet recently and purchased an old, framed baseball player photo that I paid $10.00 for. I have already done quite a bit of research on it that can best be summed up with the following which is how I came up with a date of circa 1900 ... (Also see pictures).

1. The seller said he found it in a box of other junk and didn't know anything about it.
2. The frame is made of tin ~ Appears Victorian ~ Hand painted floral ~ Fold-out standee on back.
3. The frame is oval and measures 3 1/2" x 2 1/2"
4. The photo is sepa colored (brownish) and was developed in an oval shape then cut to fit.

5. Regarding the uniform ...

Uniform Parts:
National Baseball Hall of Fame - Dressed to the Nines - Parts of the Uniform

Caps - 1888 - Spalding:
National Baseball Hall of Fame - Dressed to the Nines - Parts of the Uniform

Shoes - 1883 - Spalding: National Baseball Hall of Fame - Dressed to the Nines - Parts of the Uniform

Uniform/Collar - Last Used 1906
National Baseball Hall of Fame - Dressed to the Nines - Parts of the Uniform

Uniform/Beltless - First Used circa 1910
National Baseball Hall of Fame - Dressed to the Nines - Parts of the Uniform

Earliest Numbering of Jerseys - 1907-09
National Baseball Hall of Fame - Dressed to the Nines - Parts of the Uniform

Baseball History - First Major Leagues 1871 thru 1875
History of baseball in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Grain Elevators: Grain Elevators -- History

Pictures, etc ...


1. Framed Photo.

2. Photo Only.

3. Frame and Back. (Glass Not Shown).

4. Cropped Photo. I cannot read the words on the grain elevator.

Shoes from above link ~ He appears to be wearing #1 ~ Solid black high top. Ad is from 1883 Spalding catalog.

Cap ~ Appears to be either #11 or #19 ~ Mulit-sectioned top part. Ad is from 1888 Spalding catalog. I can't tell in my photo if the player is wearing a short or a long bill cap.

Uniform Pants/Beltless ~ Player in my photo is wearing a belt. Belts were last used on uniforms around 1910. This picture is the earliest known example that shows a beltless player and is dated 1913. It is said that prior to 1913 most players wore belts until they were discouraged and possibly even banned because defensive players would sometimes grab hold of the belt to stop an advancing runner.


Footnotes:

1. The Major Leagues were first introduced around 1871 to 1875.
2. Uniform numbering was first introduced in Major Leagues around 1907-1909. (My player has no visible number on his jersey.
3. Uniform "Collars" were last used around 1906. My player's jersey appears to have a collar.

Bottom Line Questions ...

1. Can you think of anything I missed?
2. do you agree with the circa 1900 date?
3. Do you think the player is ... Hometown Team ~ Farm/Minor League ~ Major League?
4. Can you think of any way to identify the location?
5. And what about the grain elevetor? Any clues there? Midwest?

6. And most important of all, do you happen to recognize The Player?

Thanks in advance for your time and interest. I realize I am asking some tough questions that may be impossible to answer, but I thought it would be fun anyway because Baseball season is upon us and I know there are a lot of fans out there like myself.

Sodabottlebob

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

A Handbook of Civil War Bullets and Cartridges - Grab it through Amazon!

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

Highly possible ... except the bridge would be longer and not come to a point like my paint job suggest.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

A History of Mining on the Kenai Peninsula, Alaska - Grab it through Amazon!

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

I'm pretty sure where the arrow is pointing is also water, but for some unknown reason is reflecting the light differently. But this doesn't mean it's a river. It could be a stream, canal, pond or lake.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

RR tracks are often along a river.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

PS ~

My "best guess" is that we are looking at a covered bridge over a stream or canal, and that the stream/canal runs "between" the foreground building and the grain elevator.

I seriously doubt there were many (if any) covered bridges over major rivers.

Streams? Yes! Canals? Yes!

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

PS ~ PS

Streams or canals with "covered" bridges typically indicate ... snow.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

One example of "hundreds."

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

White Dots? ...

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

Food for thought ... (Not this exact one, but something like it).

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

Just foolin' around. I'm calling it quits with this for the day. I'm leaving soon to go to a BBQ

Have a great Memorial Day.

Bob


Morris Grain Company Ruins

This was the seed mill of the Morris Grain Company,founded in 1902 on the north side of the Rock Island Railroad tracks, completely cut off from the canal,which shows how the I&M Canal was surpassed by the railroads for transportation. This was part of a complex that included the grain elevator,an engine house,and a warehouse-storage building. The elevator and engine house are gone,and the warehouse exists in modified form. This building,now walled off by overgrowth,dates from the early 1920's,and has a wood frame covered with tin siding. Morris,Illinois.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

I'm just walking out the door, but before leaving I wanted to summerize today's clues that might lead to other clues. The key words for the day are ...

(Possible/Inconclusive)

1. Covered bridge.
2. River ~ Canal ~ Stream ~ Lake ~ Pond.
3. Railroad.
4. Snow.
5. 80 feet tall.
6. Seperate structures with the possibility of a body of water between them.

Good luck.

Bob

 

[DeerStalker]

I'd check Troy, Ohio. There's a covered bridge close to the grain elevator. Been trying to find a good picture.

 

[JasShapiro]

I'm thinking the white lights are from a caboose. This would probably place the two grain elevators on opposing sides of the tracks. I've now seen numerous examples of this. Also, this would give a new avenue for research. I did a quick check of images and there aren't many cabooses that have this particular pattern of windows, but here's one:

While they're probably out there, I don't remembered covered bridges having windows and think with the sun's angle that glare from windows would make sense. This could also give you a very good perspective on the location of the tracks (looks like more of the same window pattern below the player's right elbow, but not as much glare).
Can't quit now Bob, you've got too many people hooked
Jason
PS A couple of days ago I tried calculating the height of the one GE under construction and came up with about 80 to 90 feet. Here's how I came to that conclusion/guesstimate:

 

[zendog64]

I'm not convinced that we're looking at a covered bridge. I'm pretty sure that the white dots are a reflection, rather than light shining through some sort of opening. If you look at the player's shadow, you'll notice that the sun is somewhere to the left and front of the player. For light to reflect through an opening, the sun would have to be to the right of the player.

By the way, Bob, since you've gotten the loupe, have you been able to make out any more detail on the marking on the player's shoe/sock?

Also...do my eyes deceive me, or in your close-up pic of the white dots am I seeing a second ballplayer, to the very right of the last white dot?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Raise your left hand. If you are sitting close behind your PC like I am, your left hand raised is the postion of the Sun I think. I have no idea if this will cause a reflection. I keep thinking they are lights of some kind as it may be close to dusk.

Did early ball parks have lights? It seems like a long shadow and the wrong time to start a ball game without lights.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I think its dusk as opposed to dawn. That would mean the Sun is setting West behind the players back. . The second grain elevator looks smaller thus further away. The RR tracks may be angling away in a East/West direction as well. I still think those are lights showing thru open windows but its just a guess...

 

[zendog64]

Great analogy with the left hand, that's exactly the direction I was trying to describe. Here's another theory about the white spots.... clothes hanging from a clothes line. There is definitely a human being standing to the right of the white dots, and the location and size of the dots in relation to the person would make it a possibility. For all we know, there could be houses either behind the trees or to the right of the photo.

Also, in the close-up of the dots, look a little bit to the left of the first dot...I swear I think I can see a black pair of pants also hanging on the line!

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

You won't believe your eyes!

I took the photo and loupe with me today and it was my son-in-law who made this startling discovery. I had just barely briefed him on the white dots and a few other things, when he said, "Hey, Bob, that's not a covered bridge. It's a river or something behind the trees."

It took me a minute to figure out what he was talking about, but before long I could see it for myself. And upon further inspection we realized there were even some bushes reflected in the water along the far right bank. What I thought was a covered bridge with light reflecting between the post is actually light reflecting off the water between the trunks of several trees.

I did the color enhancement myself, which resulted from a sketch I did beforehand that my son-in-law confirmed was correct. However, I messed up a little on the left side when I did the paint-in. That little jog to the left is actually not as long and pronounced. But because it took me several attempts to get the rest of it right, and not wanting to mess it it further, I just left the little jog there. The rest of it is as accurate as my son-in-law and several other adults who looked at it could come up with and agree upon.

However, none of us were able to determine with certainty whether the water is a bend in a river or the banks of a lake. We only know that its definitely water. The white dots are apparently a section of water where the sun's reflection is the most intensified.

My son-in-law looked it over real good, but did not see anything that we don't already know or suspect. He agreed that the foreground building and the tower are two seperate structures. He also studied what looks like a person in the background on the right side, but, like me, couldn't make it out clearly other than its a blur.

I'm not sure this new discovery will assist in identifying the location, but hopefully it will lead to something. I just wish my eyes (and brain) were more in tune to such things, and apologize for not "seeing the light" sooner. If I come up with anything else, I will be sure to let you know as soon as possible. But I truly think this is just about as good as it's going get.

Bob


Reminder ... The coloring is obviously exaggerated. It was done in this manner to emphasize exactly what portions of the photo contain water. No bridge. Just trees. However, there is a sharp angle that I thought earlier was the roof of the bridge. We are still not sure what that is but it might be a barn roof on the opposite side of the water.

My paint-in is not perfect, but should give you the general idea. You should be able to see on the left side where I tried to fix my boo-boo.

Click and enlarge the original and look at the far right portion of water. See the brush reflecting in the water? Under the loupe it stands out well.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

PS ~

No, we weren't drinking margaritas while we examined the photo. The margaritas came later.

Bob

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Did you know you can take a picture through the loupe.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

Did you know you can take a picture through the loupe.

Nope. Didn't know that. I'll try it tomorrow.