Media at Spain are saying that the apelation of OME has been rejected. The Apelation Court orders OME to send to Spain all the coins and stuff recovered from the Black Swan site. Does anybody know the last details of all this issue?
You have to kidding, High moral standards, specifically Greg Stemm If he was allowed he would dredge every shipwreck.Panfilo said:Trinidad, surely by now you must know that one can not trust the Spanish press in matters pertaining to the Mercedes as the degree of disinformation is absolutely amazing, beyond belief. Sometimes they inadvertently publish the truth. The Spanish press has been the judge, prosecutor, bailiff, stenographer and jury of this process and Odyssey has been unjustly accused and convicted since day one. If Odyssey were the pirates they are painted to be, nobody would of known that the Mercedes was ever found, no Admiralty courts would have heard the case and the coins would all have been sold four years ago. The fact that the case is in the hands of the American judicial system says a great deal about the integrity and high moral standards of its directors and specifically of Greg Stemm.
The ruling of today is of minimal consequence and the case will surely follow its natural course and be heard by the Supreme Court due to the seriousness of the issues involved, sovereign immunity, claims by two sovereigns, descendants claims plus more importantly of all one would think that if a court decides not to hear a case because it does not have jurisdiction, how can it assume jurisdiction and order Odyssey to hand over to Spain the coins? It either has or it doesn't have jurisdiction, one doesn't have to be a judicial scholar to figure this out. I was talking with a very distinguished law professor about this case today and he said this case has the makings of a typical Supreme Court case, he said "it has all the sex appeal!" and I think he's right, that it does. The odds are in favor of Odyssey, it's a home game for them and justice will prevailā¦at the end, like all good stories do. This case will set an important judicial precedent and the Supreme Court will see the light.
I will have a read Panfilo, But the way I see it , It will be rejected by the High Court. There is more behind the scenes with the US governmentPanfilo said:Ossy, how about we make a bet? Hereās the way things will happen in my crystal ball view of the future for these coins: the Supreme Court will hear the case as it is a classical case that interests the High court and the Court will rule that though the Mercedes was indeed a state owned and operated ship, It was not in a military mission but in a commercial one and therefore Spain can not claim sovereign Immunity. The court will award Odyssey 60% of the coins, the descendants 30% and the King 10%. This will create chaos in Spain, that is for certain, as everybody and their brother there believe the coins are being packed in boxes ready to be shipped to the Ministry of Culture next Monday.
Regarding Mr. Stemm, he has entered an area where few companies have gone, deep ocean recoveries with very professional archaeological methods following the strictest guidelines. That is why he has been able to contract with one of the most prominent maritime governments of all time, the UK.
You have perhaps not had the opportunity to read and study the first two volumes of Oceans Odyssey, I suggest you do so Ossy with an open mind and you will be most pleasantly surprised with the high level of professionalism these publications offer, second to none.
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/arts-entertainment/book-review-oceans-odyssey-151745.html
Panfilo
The book review does not mention the Black swan? or has any photos! Why?Panfilo said:Ossy, how about we make a bet? Hereās the way things will happen in my crystal ball view of the future for these coins: the Supreme Court will hear the case as it is a classical case that interests the High court and the Court will rule that though the Mercedes was indeed a state owned and operated ship, It was not in a military mission but in a commercial one and therefore Spain can not claim sovereign Immunity. The court will award Odyssey 60% of the coins, the descendants 30% and the King 10%. This will create chaos in Spain, that is for certain, as everybody and their brother there believe the coins are being packed in boxes ready to be shipped to the Ministry of Culture next Monday.
Regarding Mr. Stemm, he has entered an area where few companies have gone, deep ocean recoveries with very professional archaeological methods following the strictest guidelines. That is why he has been able to contract with one of the most prominent maritime governments of all time, the UK.
You have perhaps not had the opportunity to read and study the first two volumes of Oceans Odyssey, I suggest you do so Ossy with an open mind and you will be most pleasantly surprised with the high level of professionalism these publications offer, second to none.
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/arts-entertainment/book-review-oceans-odyssey-151745.html
Panfilo
They looted the Mercedes in 2008 !trinidad said:What sounds as a sarcasm itĀ“s to request publications from OME almost in months, and there is never such a hurry for publicactions from an academic excavation.
Oops 2007 Panfilo as a Colombian what's your interest Did Claudio announce to world of his discoveryPanfilo said:Two corrections Ossy, the year was 2007 when Odyssey successfully recovered the 594,000 coins in an impressive textbook case operation from international waters in what was by mortal standards, a commercial mission of a Spanish frigate in times of peace. Iām sure that a very educated and cultured person as you Ossy believes that a person (in this case a company) is innocent until proven guilty or are you also, as is all the Spanish press, of the conviction itās the other way around? The trial is not over Ossy, keep repeating that please.
Two questions Ossy, if the Mercedes is such an important wreck as the Spanish lawyers have made it to be in the courts, the lost grail of Spainās cultural patrimony, why the hell did they not try to recover it after Claudio announced to the world 20 years ago he had found it? One logical answer will suffice. One gets the impression that this is an opportunistic strategy, let the free enterprise companies and their investors go out, research and recover the important wrecks (with lots of gold and silver)and then weāll beat them in court claiming all commerce between the Indies and was done on sovereign immune ships, piece of cake.
Some of us believe and have great faith in the American justice system and that right will prevail, where black is black and white is white and a military mission is when governments send soldiers and guns on a ship to war and a commercial mission is where you transport women and children who pay a fare and you transport private cargo, alpaca wool copper and tin ingots. So Ossy my friend, please donāt open that champagne bottle youāve been saving for the celebration just yet, it aināt over.
Panfilo