IRON Brigade: SEATED HALF DOLLAR and a Complete MUSKET LOCK PLATE!!

[BuckleBoy]

Hello All!

Got up this morning and got a call from HB who was jonesin' for a hunt after his spur and eagle button on Wednesday. Took a look at the truck thermometer and figured it would be a nice day to dig a few holes. :P



So we set out for the site, bringing the probe so we could open up the privy too.

When we got there, we did some probing for the privy, and indeed hit glass. We opened up a hole and started finding busted up china and bits of glass. So the hole got wider....and deeper... (We'd already asked the owner if this was o.k. and gotten the go-ahead on the privy dig.) Here's a photo of DiggerGirl down in there:



We took turns digging, and picked up our detectors and swung when we weren't working the privy. Here's HB gettin' it dug.



We soon figured out that we were in a burn pit--we dug down to clay and found only charred items, a brass spoon, a harmonica reed plate, and broken china and stoneware. Few bottles, and not much worth reconstructing. So we covered 'er in and kept detecting.

My very first signal of the day was a good one. It was an overload--so I knew it was big, or shallow, or both...so I cut a big plug. Well let me say that we dig so few silver coins out here that it takes a second for it to sink in when we find one. What I wasn't prepared for was the SIZE of this one coming out of the ground. I was thinking "Nah--it can't be" when I bent over to get a closer look:



My first instinct was "Cut Spanish Silver!" as I looked at the find--and when HB asked what I found, I think I said something like just a CUT SPANISH COIN. As I looked at the coin more closely, I realized it said "Half Dollar" on it! It is an 1858-O Seated HALF!



Folks, it's been quite a few years since my last Seated Half find, and I am Thrilled.


We kept pounding the site, finding toe taps, organ reeds, harmonica parts, clock parts, and lantern tops. I dug a wierd, flattened/cut minieball closer to the cellar hole--all the while watching the Iron pile grow by the truck. (I know there's 40 lbs there from the hunt today.)

Then as darkness approaches, HB yells at me from across the site. I can see him holding up something in his hand--and I immediately knew what it was--a complete musket lock plate!



Folks, I have never seen one of these dug before. I've dug pieces before, but no dice on a complete lock plate. The best part of this one is the condition--with some Slow electrolysis and a little luck, we might be able to read some markings.

Incredible hunt today, but I am Beat to Death. At least I can feel my fingers now.

So here is a shot of my finds for the day, along with HB's lock plate. If anyone can identify the model of gun this piece is from, please let us know.



The finds cleaned, and close-ups of some of the goodies:







And a BIG CONGRATULATIONS to HB on this one. Good huntin' with you today, buddy.





And that's part of the reason we dig all the Iron.


Best Wishes and Happy Hunting,



Buckleboy

 

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[BuckleBoy]

All Liege made guns of the period have an ELG over a star in an oval stamped on them. I have been spending the evening checking every Civil War firearm catalog and book I can find, this is fun! I can still find nothing with the long hammer throw of this lock, which would indicate a nipple far forward of the lock, except the Gwyn and Campbell. Also all of the screw holes line up exactly. While the Belgian has a similar shaped plate, the hammer throw is much shorter, I will stick with my guess, but still just a guess. You may have to post on one of the Civil War gun forums for a definitive answer. Whatever it is it is a great find!

On the Gwyn and Campbell photo you shared, I count four screw holes--plus one up past the hammer at the larger end of the plate. On the dug one, I count only three screw holes on the tapered side of the plate.


I'd love to find a close up of the Belgian model. I don't see any markings on this plate. Where else might it be marked besides on the flat part of the plate?

 

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[johnreb1980]

Looks like a Spencer Repeating Rifle lock plate to me. Here is a website with about the Spencers and good closeup pic's,Jonathon.

http://images.google.com/imgres?img...+lock+plate&um=1&hl=en&safe=off&sa=N&ie=UTF-8

 

[X-Terra70_TreasureHunter]

Dang it if it had only been a complete coin BB the value would have been $100.00 for your Half!!!!!!

It grades in extra fine condition

Dave

 

[l.cutler]

I think that forth screwhole is the stud that the mainspring rests against, you can see it on the inside of the found lockplate in the same location. I posted on the NSSA forum, those folks really know there Civil War firearms. There has been only one response so far, I was waiting to see if there were any more. The one response said it looks like a Gwyn and Campbell #1 which is also called a Cosmopolitan #3 by Edwards. It looks like #1 G&C's were marked on the breech not the lock, but I may be wrong on that.

 

[nova treasure]

Looks like a Spencer Repeating Rifle lock plate to me. Here is a website with about the Spencers and good closeup pic's,Jonathon.

http://images.google.com/imgres?img...+lock+plate&um=1&hl=en&safe=off&sa=N&ie=UTF-8

It looks similar,but i think maybe alittle different shape and the screws holes are alittle different,It is very close though.
Oh well,we may never get and exact match,but it's interesting researching everything trying to find it.
Nova Treasure

 

[l.cutler]

You're right Nova, even if we don't figure it out, look how much we have learned!

 

[BuckleBoy]

Yes, you're right--it has been a lot of fun trying to track this weapon down. I have looked at the plate a lot, and I see no markings--so it likely came from a gun that was marked on the breech. Spencers were, but I don't know if the screw hole placement is dead-on or not... Belgian .61cal's were marked on the lock plate... so that leaves G & C...

Anybody know what the issuing/dispersal of G & C's was during the war? Who had them, whether they were more widespread or not...


That might help me as well in narrowing it down.



But I look forward to seeing what folks say on the other forum. Feel free to post a link here when some replys get accumulated.



Best Wishes,



Buckles

 

[Ohio Jerry]

Sweet pieces of history back in to the light of day thanks to the Iron Brigade. Awesome job guys!!!
Jerry

 

[johnreb1980]

I did find this on the Gwen and Campbell.


Gwyn and Campbell Carbine. .52 caliber, Type II. One of about 4000 made. Cavalry units that these were issued to include: the 2nd and 3rd Arkansas, the 5th 6th and 16th Illinois, the 2nd and 3rd Iowa, the 2nd 6th and 14th Kansas, the 10th 12th and 14th Kentucky, the 4th and 8th Missouri, the 5th and 8th Ohio, the 7th Tennessee, and the 3rd Wisconsin.

http://reunion.omnica.com/firearms.htm

 

[daytondigger]

Congrats, those are some mighty nice finds. I dig privies too, but always avoided country privies. Never seemed to find much in them, they always seemed to dig shallow pits and dump their glass elsewhere. Cincinnatti has provided me with lots of nice glass. Have you ever checked out privydigger.com? I dig with those guys sometimes. Do you have any luck in those country pits? A seated half sure beats a Franklin half. The cut is just another piece of history as far as I'm concerned.
Thanks, Steve

Steve, we haven't hunted enough country privies to make any evaluation of them. Although we try to make every find we can at a site (metal...glass...pottery), most of the housesites from this fall have been in plowed fields. But as we dig more of them, we'll find out more information. If country privies aren't working out, then we'll direct our time elsewhere. We already use several different sets criteria to select which housesites are the most promising and narrow our focus from the hundreds of possible sites.

Regards,


Buckleboy

I think you've got a good plan there. Dig everything and don't pass up on a good opportunuty. I seem to remember a very valuable fruit jar coming out of a country privy. The only seated half I've ever found came out of a privy as well as the only cannon ball I've found. You just never know what you'll dig. Also, keep your eyes out for flat top and cone top beer cans. If they're solid and show some paint, they'll often clean up with an oxcylic acid bath and can be quite collectable. Check out therustybunch.com Keep on diggin!

 

[BuckleBoy]

I think you've got a good plan there. Dig everything and don't pass up on a good opportunuty. I seem to remember a very valuable fruit jar coming out of a country privy. The only seated half I've ever found came out of a privy as well as the only cannon ball I've found. You just never know what you'll dig. Also, keep your eyes out for flat top and cone top beer cans. If they're solid and show some paint, they'll often clean up with an oxcylic acid bath and can be quite collectable. Check out therustybunch.com Keep on diggin!

The crock that I found and reconstructed--even though it was broken--sold at auction for the price range indicated in the link below. It came from the country.

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,159914.0.html


-Buckles

 

[Newt]

Get back out there and find the butt plate to that musket.
Nice finds
Newt

 

[daytondigger]

I think you've got a good plan there. Dig everything and don't pass up on a good opportunuty. I seem to remember a very valuable fruit jar coming out of a country privy. The only seated half I've ever found came out of a privy as well as the only cannon ball I've found. You just never know what you'll dig. Also, keep your eyes out for flat top and cone top beer cans. If they're solid and show some paint, they'll often clean up with an oxcylic acid bath and can be quite collectable. Check out therustybunch.com Keep on diggin!

The crock that I found and reconstructed--even though it was broken--sold at auction for the price range indicated in the link below. It came from the country.

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,159914.0.html
Oh yeah, I forgot about that one. That was a nice one.


-Buckles

 

[Kiros32]

All I can say is, what a year brother...what a year!

 

[The Seeker]

I would have been thinking the same thing..........Cut SPANISH 8 Reale! Then again, you don't find cut Seated halfs everyday! Great job finding some nice Relics......................

 

[trish76642]

One of these days BB, your gonna hit the mother load!
I hope im still around to see it!
Its gonna happen!

 

[mpostma]

Hats off to the Iron Brigade!

Nice seated! Cut or not.

That lockplate is great!

And hunting in 24 degrees, you may consider yourselves honorary Michiganders!
If we could lose the snow I'd be out all winter!

Best of Luck and Congrats!

Mark

 

[JerV3]

Awesome finds man,

That cut half is something to be proud of. I'm still looking for a seated half here. I gun plate is a really cool relic also. Some electrolosis will make that look great. Good thing you do dig the iron.

HH Jer

 

[BuckleBoy]

Get back out there and find the butt plate to that musket.
Nice finds
Newt

Better call your buddy HB--he made some First Rate finds today!

All I can say is, what a year brother...what a year!

You ain't kiddin. But I don't think it's over yet. We've got a few more weeks of hunting left.

I would have been thinking the same thing..........Cut SPANISH 8 Reale! Then again, you don't find cut Seated halfs everyday! Great job finding some nice Relics......................

Any Seated Half is a good Seated Half.

Thanks for the kind reply.

One of these days BB, your gonna hit the mother load!
I hope im still around to see it!
Its gonna happen!

I hope I'm around to see it too! It'd be fun to see the look on my face.

Best wishes to you, Trish.

Hats off to the Iron Brigade!

Nice seated! Cut or not.

That lockplate is great!

And hunting in 24 degrees, you may consider yourselves honorary Michiganders!
If we could lose the snow I'd be out all winter!

Best of Luck and Congrats!

Mark

It ain't that bad, is it? As long as ya dig enough holes to sweat a bit. I'd imagine Michiganders have to hunt in the snow, since otherwise the fall window would be two weeks long.

Awesome finds man,

That cut half is something to be proud of. I'm still looking for a seated half here. I gun plate is a really cool relic also. Some electrolosis will make that look great. Good thing you do dig the iron.

HH Jer

JerDfx, if you look hard enough, and you will find it--No matter what it is you're looking for. You just have to look in the best places you can.


Starting another all-day Electrolysis Marathon tomorrow.










And to any folks whose replies I didn't respond to yet--thank you all! Now get out there and Get Hunting.




-Buckles

 

[mpostma]

Ahh, Buckles, we now have over 18 inches on the ground. Hard to walk in, let alone md! My problem is that my snowshoes are aluminum and magnesium, sets off the old minelab like a video game.
Further South they are getting some good hunting in 4 inches of snow or so. Up here, and in the upper peninsula, it is pretty tough to find a coil big enough to get through all that snow!

Cold doesn't bother me. If we get a thaw that gets the snow down a bit, without the ground having over a foot frozen I will be back out!

Good Luck.
Mark