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ECS

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... Also keep in mind those early slave trade routes I mentioned in some of my previous post, these involving Santa Fe & Saint Louis...
During the Beale Papers time period, the larger slave trade routes were concentrated of the Atlantic coast, and to a smaller extent, in New Orleans.
Would you please expound on your reasoning concerning Santa Fe and St Louis in this context, beyond of course, both being mentioned in Ward's copyrighted 1885 Beale Papers.
 

releventchair

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"Swarthy" in context...of the age it was written relating to Beale ..does it mean black skinned?

B. Franklin called Germans swarthy. Then went on to call all "nonAmericans" similarly.
Black hair and dark eyes was enough it seems.

Complexion/connexion.

["Which leads me to one remark: That the number of purely white people in the world is proportionably very small. All Africa is black or tawny. Asia chiefly tawney. And in Europe the Spaniards, Italians, French, Russians and Swedes are generally of what we call a swarthy complexion; as are the Germans also, the Saxons only being excepted, who with the English make up the principal body of white people on the face of the earth. I could wish their numbers increased. While we are scouring our planet by clearing America of woods, and so making our side of the planet reflect a brighter light to the inhabitants of Mars or Venus, why should we in the sight of superior beings darken its people? Why increase the sons of Africa by planting them in America, where we have an opportunity, by excluding all blacks and tawneys, of increasing the lovely white and red.”]

Benjamin Franklin

- See more at: The Black Germans and the Black Dutch ? African Genes in Germania | Rasta Livewire
 

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TN_Guest1523

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Question,

Who was the first poster on this beale board at the beginning of it all in 2005-6 or so ?
 

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franklin

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John Yeats Beall was from Western Virginia, was with Booth during Brown's hanging, and had urgent business in Richmond in 1863. Not sure if he was "swarthy".

John Yeats Beale was from near Charles Town, West Virginia around Harper's Ferry.
 

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It's amazing that you have a man of color with the exact name, the only man who fits the exact description, in the exact city where the important business affairs were taking place, and yet so many still refuse to even entertain that he is directly connected to the narration or that "TJB" was a man of color even after the author has told us so. :laughing7:
 

ECS

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It's amazing that you have a man of color with the exact name, the only man who fits the exact description, in the exact city where the important business affairs were taking place, and yet so many still refuse to even entertain that he is directly connected to the narration or that "TJB" was a man of color even after the author has told us so. :laughing7:
Do you have solid evidence that directly connects "swarthy" Alderman Thomas J Beale , Jackson Ward, Richmond to either Robert Morriss in 1863 or to James Beverly Ward in 1884?
A simple yes or no will suffice.
 

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bigscoop

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Do you have solid evidence that directly connects "swarthy" Alderman Thomas J Beale , Jackson Ward, Richmond to either Robert Morriss in 1863 or to James Beverly Ward in 1884?
A simple yes or no will suffice.

But you have already been directed to this, and more. You have even posted that evidence yourself. Of course, in order to recognize it you must have open mind to these possibilities, which you very obviously don't. :laughing7: But to answer your question....."I have seen it!" (And so have you.) :thumbsup:
 

ECS

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If one were to"cherry pick" "western Virginia", "1863", "urgent business in Richmond" from the Beale story, a theory could be developed around John Yeats Beale that could lead to John Wilkes Booth's assassination of President Lincoln, as the hidden secret story behind the Beale Papers.
This "cherry picking" research has been applied to several theories that have been presented on these threads, which only supplies a superficial validity for these theories.
 

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bigscoop

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If one were to"cherry pick" "western Virginia", "1863", "urgent business in Richmond" from the Beale story, a theory could be developed around John Yeats Beale that could lead to John Wilkes Booth's assassination of President Lincoln, as the hidden secret story behind the Beale Papers.
This "cherry picking" research has been applied to several theories that have been presented on these threads, which only supplies a superficial validity for these theories.

This is true, if one were cherry picking.
 

ECS

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It's amazing that you have a man of color with the exact name, the only man who fits the exact description, in the exact city where the important business affairs were taking place, and yet so many still refuse to even entertain that he is directly connected to the narration or that "TJB" was a man of color even after the author has told us so. :laughing7:
Well, lets examine what the author told us:
"in person he was about six feet in height, with jet black eyes and hair the same color...but his distinguishing feature was a dark and swarthy complexion, as if much exposure to the sun a weather had discolored him...he was the model of manly beauty favored by the ladies and envied by men"...(to the ladies)" he was reverentially tender and kind".
And : (Beale was)"extremely popular with everyone, particularly the ladies, and a friendly intercourse was quickly established between them".
Customs and morals in 1820 Virginia were very different than today, as Virginia had very strong anti-miscegenation laws forbidding the mixing of different races. No where does the author refer to Beale as a man of color, and would the ladies of 1820 Bedford swoon over a man of color?
The author clearly states that his complexion was caused by "exposure to the sun and weather", not the Beale was a man of color.
 

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bigscoop

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Well, lets examine what the author told us:
"in person he was about six feet in height, with jet black eyes and hair the same color...but his distinguishing feature was a dark and swarthy complexion, as if much exposure to the sun a weather had discolored him...he was the model of manly beauty favored by the ladies and envied by men"...(to the ladies)" he was reverentially tender and kind".
And : (Beale was)"extremely popular with everyone, particularly the ladies, and a friendly intercourse was quickly established between them".
Customs and morals in 1820 Virginia were very different than today, as Virginia had very strong anti-miscegenation laws forbidding the mixing of different races. No where does the author refer to Beale as a man of color, and would the ladies of 1820 Bedford swoon over a man of color?
The author clearly states that his complexion was caused by "exposure to the sun and weather", not the Beale was a man of color.

So-so glad you went there! I was actually hoping that you eventually would. First, the author details the man's "complexion" which is defined as being a person's "natural skin tone." Your author is only elaborating on that natural skin tone when he references the sun and weather in detailing the depth of his "natural discoloring" which is why he says, "as if" instead of "was".

Second, and once again, "you're assuming" that the author was referring to white women! The fact that he was envied by men could just as easily be in reference to those slaves who envied this free man of color. "Dark and swarthy natural skin tone, jet black eyes, hair of the same color."

"Complexion" as it is defined in just about every dictionary means, "natural skin tone." Look it up yourself or simply stick to your own definition. Your choice. :laughing7:

But I am curious as to why you remain so steadfast that TJB had to be a white man when the only man of record with that exact name and description during the period was a free man of color? Is it because it has to remain a white thing? I mean, if you stop and think about it, all the more reason for the author to have remained anonymous. So your post above, on all points, simply expresses extreme bias without any evidence whatsoever, and actually quite to the contrary, for maintaining that extreme bias. Very, very curious, indeed.
 

Rebel - KGC

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So-so glad you went there! I was actually hoping that you eventually would. First, the author details the man's "complexion" which is defined as being a person's "natural skin tone." Your author is only elaborating on that natural skin tone when he references the sun and weather in detailing the depth of his "natural discoloring" which is why he says, "as if" instead of "was".

Second, and once again, "you're assuming" that the author was referring to white women! The fact that he was envied by men could just as easily be in reference to those slaves who envied this free man of color. "Dark and swarthy natural skin tone, jet black eyes, hair of the same color."

"Complexion" as it is defined in just about every dictionary means, "natural skin tone." Look it up yourself or simply stick to your own definition. Your choice. :laughing7:

But I am curious as to why you remain so steadfast that TJB had to be a white man when the only man of record with that exact name and description during the period was a free man of color? Is it because it has to remain a white thing? I mean, if you stop and think about it, all the more reason for the author to have remained anonymous. So your post above, on all points, simply expresses extreme bias without any evidence whatsoever, and actually quite to the contrary, for maintaining that extreme bias. Very, very curious, indeed.
Dunno, IF... TJB was 1/2 "Black", doubt if he could stay in a "White" Establishment; Lynchburg, Va. was VERY "Racist" in both 1817-1822 & the CONFEDERATE WAR. Even, 1885 "period" is "questionable"...
 

TN_Guest1523

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Question,

Who was the first poster on this beale board at the beginning of it all in 2005-6 or so ?

Just looking at what some of the first topics were . I do not see anything about a woman author of the Beale Papers . Am I the first to say that ?
 

Rebel - KGC

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Just looking at what some of the first topics were . I do not see anything about a woman author of the Beale Papers . Am I the first to say that ?
NOPE! Mrs. Margaret Anthony Cabel was mentioned as a writer, whose story on Robert & Sarah MORRISS, was utilized for the Beale PAPERS Pamphlet; Many PAPERS were utilized... of ppl, REAL events, TRUE adventures, CONFEDERATE WAR history, 1880's Lynchburg, Va. HISTORY... ya just gotta look at it ALL!
 

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