✅ SOLVED NEED HELP ID'ING A MINIE BALL

[can_slaw]

I am relatively new to treasure hunting, so I do not have all of the necessary literature yet. I am hopeful someone will be able to pull out their trusted resource manual and help me figure out the most likely match for this little beauty.

Here are the facts that I know about it:

- no rings
- .525 wide is the most "common" measurement i was able to pull from around the face.
- There appears to be a wider portion at the bottom near the base. Because of deformity i cannot measure all of the way around. Best i can find for measurement is .542
- There also appears to be two markings inside the base, one of them looks to be a "5". Looks like possibly "75".
- It came from a Union military hospital site in Wisconsin. It was found by what was later described to me as a former "body parts pit" for the hospital. Apparently they buried the parts after amputations?

Here are the questions that i have:

- What caliber?
- Which side most likely used it?
- Does it look fired, chewed, or perhaps both? If fired I can only assume it was put there with whatever body part it was lodged in!

Any help will be greatly appreciated!!

 

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[Tony in SC]

I thought I could see lite rings in the top pic? If it is old there were several 52 cal bullets, Sharps was one. I've never found an old bullet with numbers.

 

[civil_war22]

Some of the civil war bullets have numbers in the base. If my memory isn’t too awfully bad I remember a 75 in the bottom of one but I don’t have my book here with me it’s at my mothers house. There were several different style bases but the ones I’ve seen with numbers had the conical base with numbers

 

[Rookster]

It looks to be 50 cal. But past that it's close. Sorry.

 

[can_slaw]

I thought I could see lite rings in the top pic? If it is old there were several 52 cal bullets, Sharps was one. I've never found an old bullet with numbers.

the lite rings you see in the top pic are slight rings in the patina where i have been trying to get a consistant reading with the calipers. It looks to be perfectly smooth under the patina.

 

[civil_war22]

Have you weighed it?

 

[can_slaw]

Have you weighed it?

I have not yet. Partly because the base looks to be incomplete, and partly because i do not posess a scale that weighs in grains. If you feel it would be pertinent info though, i will continue to look for one.

 

[Carolina Tom]

It looks similar to a .54 caliber modern muzzle loader round. I am by no means an expert at this.

Look at the Great Plains bullet in this pic. The tip looks similar to your first pic. Also the absence of a white patina makes me think that it's more modern.

 

[Yak1366]

In my experience, the only Civil War bullets with markings in the base are Enfields. Some Enfields with what's called a "Plug Base" would have letters, numbers or patterns molded in them by the insert. Some were blank.

If your bullet does indeed have numbers in the cavity, it will be the first piece I've ever seen like that.

The cavity on your bullet appears to be a shallow cup type. I believe I see 3 fine grooves. I've heard the term "pressed & turned" which I believe means a machine was used to form the grooves. I am unsure if your bullet & my middle pic qualifies as P&T, but I'm certain it will be clarified later on

Left: a '.55' based marked Enfield
Middle: a 58 Cal with grooves similar to yours, that I have not identified either!
Right: a typical 57 Cal Minie where the grooves were formed in the mold.

 

[Yak1366]

I have not yet. Partly because the base looks to be incomplete, and partly because i do not posess a scale that weighs in grains. If you feel it would be pertinent info though, i will continue to look for one.

If you have a scale that weighs in grams, then multiply that weight by 15.432 to get to grains.

 

[can_slaw]

It looks similar to a .54 caliber modern muzzle loader round. I am by no means an expert at this.

Look at the Great Plains bullet in this pic. The tip looks similar to your first pic. Also the absence of a white patina makes me think that it's more modern.

The site i found this on was a civil war hospital until 1865, and then a military base until it became an all girls catholic school in the 1880's, which it remained until the 1950's or 1960's. In the 1970's it was turned into a boys reformatory, complete with a chain link fence surrounding the property. While the possibility is there that this is more modern, i have to doubt it based on the history of the property. Plus, this is in a part of town that houses have been on since at least 1899. I am georeferencing this part of town currently with fire maps from 1899, and this was a busy area even back then. I have read quite a few accounts of really old lead coming from the ground without the typical white patina. This site also sits right behind our local military museum, and what was our local hospital until the 1960's when we built a new one more centered in town.

Yak1366 has a photo attached to his response that looks to be almost identical to mine.

So in short, i really appreciate your insight and i really hope my findings do not show you to be correct. I would be really sad to learn this prized possession of mine turns out to be something i did not want it to be

 

[civil_war22]

It’s hard to rule anything out with being in a incorporated town. I’ve found civil war bullets in fort smith were old homes used to stand but also in the same instance I’ve found .45 cal bullets, and pre 60’s rifle bullets that were shot in the area less than 4 blocks away from
the civil war bullets. Gotta remember back in the day those were different times and discharging a firearm in city limits wasn’t a huge deal especially since there wasn’t as many houses and some homes were the only ones there for a few blocks

 

[Carolina Tom]

The site i found this on was a civil war hospital until 1865, and then a military base until it became an all girls catholic school in the 1880's, which it remained until the 1950's or 1960's. In the 1970's it was turned into a boys reformatory, complete with a chain link fence surrounding the property. While the possibility is there that this is more modern, i have to doubt it based on the history of the property. Plus, this is in a part of town that houses have been on since at least 1899. I am georeferencing this part of town currently with fire maps from 1899, and this was a busy area even back then. I have read quite a few accounts of really old lead coming from the ground without the typical white patina. This site also sits right behind our local military museum, and what was our local hospital until the 1960's when we built a new one more centered in town.

Yak1366 has a photo attached to his response that looks to be almost identical to mine.

So in short, i really appreciate your insight and i really hope my findings do not show you to be correct. I would be really sad to learn this prized possession of mine turns out to be something i did not want it to be

I hope I am not right too!

 

[can_slaw]

I will also say that this had a much better patina when i first pulled it from the ground. Me constantly touching it has rubbed a lot of the original "look" from it. Being a typical "noob" to this, i cannot stop picking up my finds to study and measure them. I also do not have this in any sort of protective cover, but maybe i should? At least to protect any further damage. If you look on the attached photo, just below the huge ding in the end towards my pointer finger, you will see a small sample of the color of the bullet when i removed it from the ground back in July of 2017. I have since inadvertently removed a large portion of the rest of the good patina.

 

[civil_war22]

The funny part is seeing it has impact marks on the back instead of the front. Usually the other way around. If it was a conical bass I could see where the damaged base would make it appear to be a flat base

 

[can_slaw]

i was able to weigh the bullet. It weighs 27.2155 grams = 419.9896 grains.

Hope that makes sense with the other measurements provided to be either more modern, or the good stuff.

 

[can_slaw]

The funny part is seeing it has impact marks on the back instead of the front. Usually the other way around. If it was a conical bass I could see where the damaged base would make it appear to be a flat base

Where i found it was right off of what is now a small parking lot. I wonder if the back damage isn't from digging it initially in the 1970's for the boys reformatory. Above that, i have no idea how it got there.

 

[civil_war22]

It’s possible. Here in the area I detect they dug up a field hospital by the new Sparks hospital where they were fixing to lay new asphalt. I know this story to be true because my uncle worked for the company doing the dirt work and his buddy has a saw they found while there. After the university left the area with the remains they detected the outskirts and found the saw

 

[can_slaw]

It’s possible. Here in the area I detect they dug up a field hospital by the new Sparks hospital where they were fixing to lay new asphalt. I know this story to be true because my uncle worked for the company doing the dirt work and his buddy has a saw they found while there. After the university left the area with the remains they detected the outskirts and found the saw

Now THAT would be a find of a lifetime for me! What a sobering feeling that must be to hold it.

 

[BosnMate]

If it is in fact a Civil War bullet, which I have no idea if it is, my SWAG on the damage to the base of the bullet, is when it hit, what ever it hit, the bullet was at terminal velocity, and was tumbling, and impacted base first.