Pequot Brass Kettle Point, Largies, Spanish Silver, and More

[Keith123]

I've been detecting this location for a while now. Finds are usually far and few between. My first ever largie came from here. Its an 1848, and to date, it's in better condition than any of my other large cents. Of course I started a grid immediately. Found an 1816 largie, some strange shaped pieces of metal (one turned out to be a kettle point), a small item that said "watch makers and jewelers", and a beautiful 1903 Barber dime.

The next day I came back and found an interesting spill with two 1800 bust largies, a 1788 1/2 reale, and some lead pieces, one of which appears to be a hand carved lead sinker. This location is near a river so I assume the individual was trying to catch lunch, but ended up loosing a months worth of pay!

When I got home as trashed the "junk", recycled the scrap metal and cleaned the good finds. Browsing Tnet I come across a banner find with the some thing called a Narragansett brass kettle point. Guess what I just got done putting in the recycling
bin?!?! That strange shaped piece
of metal (aka brass kettle point)! I was at work, but luckily my fiancé was home and after some digging through the bin was able to find it before the bin was emptied by the city. Lesson learned - never throw any finds away unless you are 1000% certain it's trash.

Turns out the location I've been hunting was home to the Pequot Indians. There you have it, a Pequot
brass kettle point. Thanks for looking.

 

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[Keith123]

Very educational. Thanks for sharing!

 

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[Ia.FurTrade]

It is an excellent find for sure. Just bear in mind they are not terribly rare in New England and New York, anyway. On some NY sites, they are actually quite common. But when they are 17th century, as yours is, to me they are very special because all the famous names from our history were likely alive when that point was made and used: Uncas, Roger Williams, King Philip of the Wampanoag, etc. Very cool if you ask me. Also, a somewhat rarer style then average. Fashioned from brass and copper kettles. One might think the men would let the women have nice new cooking utensils, but nope, not so. Not to disagree, but I'm not sure how often these would be made from colonial coins here in New England. They were usually made from kettles. I've been mistaken in the past, and often enough, but I've never seen any made from coins, and suspect that would have been unusual per the norm. Colonists usually did not trade actual money to the natives here. For a few decades, shell wampum was the medium of exchange for both cultures here. Despite the illustration below, most points were in fact made from the thinner sheet metal stock. But in the photo below, you can see that two different stocks were used for the two point profiles shown; one is a good deal thicker then the other, the only 2 I've ever found, and both were surface finds as I am a surface hunter of Native American artifacts.

I agree completely, Charl..........no expert either, but have seen nothing to indicate coins being re-purposed this way......also wonder why they would put a copper or brass liner in a pipe? I think if either of these things occured, it would not be a common practice. Also I have quite a few brass kettle points & they are fairly thin, not thick like a kettle lug.........JMHO!

Iowa Dale

 

[johnnyblaze]

Nice digs man

After seeing a couple of those points i think i dug one like 7 years ago in the woods..Im gonna have to check my mounds of odd relic boxes i thought it was just a cut piece of metal..

~Blaze~

 

[CASPER-2]

It is an excellent find for sure. Just bear in mind they are not terribly rare in New England and New York, anyway. On some NY sites, they are actually quite common. But when they are 17th century, as yours is, to me they are very special because all the famous names from our history were likely alive when that point was made and used: Uncas, Roger Williams, King Philip of the Wampanoag, etc. Very cool if you ask me. Also, a somewhat rarer style then average. Fashioned from brass and copper kettles. One might think the men would let the women have nice new cooking utensils, but nope, not so. Not to disagree, but I'm not sure how often these would be made from colonial coins here in New England. They were usually made from kettles. I've been mistaken in the past, and often enough, but I've never seen any made from coins, and suspect that would have been unusual per the norm. Colonists usually did not trade actual money to the natives here. For a few decades, shell wampum was the medium of exchange for both cultures here. Despite the illustration below, most points were in fact made from the thinner sheet metal stock. But in the photo below, you can see that two different stocks were used for the two point profiles shown; one is a good deal thicker then the other, the only 2 I've ever found, and both were surface finds as I am a surface hunter of Native American artifacts.

Don't know where you get your information - coins were traded often between natives - at least up here in Ma. with natives along the Ct river
I had an old timer (since passed) that hunted old farm fields for indian relics and found arrow heads that were flatten coins and you could see a letter here and there though flattend and on one I could see the outlines of KG still on it - I have read historical journals from the 1600s where they state they paid Indians for meat or produce or other items in coinage
so they did trade coins with the natives - I have read that the Indians thought coins were "cool" so to speak because they had a persons image on them

 

[CASPER-2]

just a quick passage from journal on King Phillips war
"After several moves with the Indians, Mary was finally ransomed for £20 at Redemption Rock on 2 May 1676."
seems money was transferred here? could be in wampum - but wampum was paid in fathoms supposedly and have read colonial
passages where they said this parcel of land was paid for in so many fathoms and not in pounds
maybe they meant pounds of goods ?
but this passage
"The Indian deed for an eight mile tract of land that became the town of Mendon was signed by Moses Payne and Peter Brackett of Braintree and Weymouth in 1662. It was purchased for 24 pounds of silver from the Nipmuck Indians"

since only silver in America back then was silverware or coin - I assume it was coin
have read historical diaries and journals from Hatfield,Northfield, Deerfield as well as other towns
where the say they started to pay Indians instead of barter in late 1600s early 1700s
and that wampum was not being accepted much after 1670
they would pay friendly Indians for chopping wood and other labors so that the Indians in turn could more easily buy goods
in a historical recount - and indian paid 8 pence for a whitemans shirt - another account an indian paid like 8 shillings to have a flintlock he found repaired

 

[timekiller]

Not sure how rare these type points are,as I've not found one myself.May just be local on that,I have found the pendants like the point above that are cut out from scrap copper.Even they don't show often here.But to make a point like that don't take a lot of work to cut out in my book.So I could see them being able to make quite a few even with the crudest of tools.But what speaks more to what I was saying above is making one from raw copper nuggets & having to hammer such out.Now that would take more time & work & would think would be older & rarer.Much like this pendant below I found in a shell midden.Only others like it were dug by archaeologist in Virginia tide water region.They were in graves & only three that I know of.So makes it the type find that you just aren't going to come across everyday or may not ever again.

 

[Charl]

Don't know where you get your information - coins were traded often between natives - at least up here in Ma. with natives along the Ct river
I had an old timer (since passed) that hunted old farm fields for indian relics and found arrow heads that were flatten coins and you could see a letter here and there though flattend and on one I could see the outlines of KG still on it - I have read historical journals from the 1600s where they state they paid Indians for meat or produce or other items in coinage
so they did trade coins with the natives - I have read that the Indians thought coins were "cool" so to speak because they had a persons image on them

CASPER-2, ike I said, I've been wrong before, so thanks for the education. That said, the overwhelming majority of brass points were made from kettles. I just ran your thought by an archaeologist with the Massachusetts Archaeological Society, and they indicated if that were the case(coins), it would be the exception, and not the norm. The kettles were much preferred for brass/copper points, if only because the metal was nice and thin, certainly not always the case with coins at all. If a native wished to make a triangle point and had a choice between kettle and coin, the kettle would be far easier to work with, being so thin and much easier to scour and cut. I believe you have seen them, but they are most certainly the exception. Yeah, for a handful of decades, wampum was the medium of exchange for natives and English alike. And most of the wampum was manufactured by the Narragansett, somewhat less by the Pequot. In the fur trade, it was traded for furs. I'm sure the Dutch, etc found that to be a much better deal then handing them actual hard earned cash for the furs.

Once King Philip's War put an end to free roaming natives in southern New England(the Eastern Niantics of Charlestown, RI had remained neutral and a reservation was established there, where they continued to live a traditional lifestyle for some time into the early 18th century), and wampum ceased as a medium of exchange, then yes, of course remaining natives simply utilized the same economics as everyone else, as you indicate in your other comment after the one I'm quoting. Even during the 17th century, before their way of life was eradicated by King Philip's War, there were so-called praying Indian villages in Ma. Bay colony, where the natives would have been tied into local economics and been paid for jobs with coin. But to make points, to an overwhelming degree, it was brass kettles that were utilized to make metal projectiles. Your exceptions are duly noted, but they would be the exception by far.

 

[HEAVYMETALNUT]

very cool point and glad you were able to rescue it a 2nd time.i believe that was my banner post you saw to ID it.this is why some non shiny and non big dollar items should be placed on the banner...for detectorists that almost toss away a historical piece like we found.instead of being part of someones new brass kitchen faucet..it's now a saved and cherished relic.
awesome job man! here's mine that made the banner.happy new year to you!

 

[Charl]

Not sure how rare these type points are,as I've not found one myself.May just be local on that,I have found the pendants like the point above that are cut out from scrap copper.Even they don't show often here.But to make a point like that don't take a lot of work to cut out in my book.So I could see them being able to make quite a few even with the crudest of tools.But what speaks more to what I was saying above is making one from raw copper nuggets & having to hammer such out.Now that would take more time & work & would think would be older & rarer.Much like this pendant below I found in a shell midden.Only others like it were dug by archaeologist in Virginia tide water region.They were in graves & only three that I know of.So makes it the type find that you just aren't going to come across everyday or may not ever again.

The Old Copper Culture of the Great Lakes region fashioned points and many other tool forms out of native copper beginning some 7000 years ago.


moreartifacts

 

[timekiller]

The Old Copper Culture of the Great Lakes region fashioned points and many other tool forms out of native copper beginning some 7000 years ago.


moreartifacts

The story behind it.Also they mined copper right here in N.C. as well.
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/t...ct-period-native-american-copper-pendant.html

 

[timekiller]

NativeTech: Introduction to Contact and Precontact Period Copper & Brass Metalwork

 

[Silver Tree Chaser]

I'm glad that you recovered it before it went out with the trash. I'm still look for my first brass point, although I did find a brass fish hook two years ago. Great finds and great save X2!!!

 

[Keith123]

Yep, those are the pictures that saved my point from the trash man!

 

[doninbrewster]

Way to go on the copper and silver. Would make my day anytime. Draped bust largies are nice, especially in a dump with Spanish silver. Sitting here a little jealous. Nice finds!