Project + Indians + GOLD!!!

[DigEmAll]

So, while out taking care of business today, I ran into a rancher who owns a spot that I had a hunch about due to some research last week.?

I read that a cargo train route (wagon train for cargo, not passengers) ran through a gap and by a spring where there was a watering hole and a station by 1880.? I also read that it ran from a certain canyon to another canyon that is about fifty miles away.? Well, after some deductive reasoning, I figured that it must be this certain spot.? So today, I asked the rancher if he happened to know where the route ran.? He turns and points to a falling in shack about thirty yards from where we were standing.? "That's the station right there and you're standing in the old road." he says.? I was dumbfounded!? So I start stammering and stuttering and finally ask if he'd mind if I came and hunted around the station.? He said that he didn't mind and then tells me where the old school was back then and the church cemetary and then gives me free range of his ranch.?

We start chatting about his ranch and I find out the vastness of the project.? About 25 sections of prime, history laden land!? For you city folk, there are 640 acres in a section.? That's 16,000 acres!!!!!!!!!!!? This land has been ridden through and ranched by the likes of: John Slaughter, Geronimo, the Earps, Ringo, Doc holiday, the Clanton gang, Curly Bill, and probably Pancho Villa!? Not to mention the Spanards in the 1540's!? I think I have just found one of the "Lost Gold Mines" of Arizona!? Wish me luck!

 

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[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

So.... the long awaited pics are here!!!!

Sorry it took so long!

ENJOY!



These are all about the size you would expect them to be.

 

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[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

This is a guy standing with his hands in the air, and his staff with the feathers that come straight out from the shaft.? Like the ones seen in movies.? The picture is a bit misleading. The colors blend into the rock in the pic. In person this really stands out.

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

This is probably my all around favorite. It's a guy doing a "rain dance" from the looks of it. You can see the guy, the lightning, the rain, and the ground. The ground is the line that runs across the picture just under the guys feet. It's a bit hard to see the ground line though.

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

Another one depicting rain.

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

This is the only one with any good "white" color left... as least that shows in pictures.

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

This is a tree, a sun, and a snowflake looking thing.

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

These I am not exactly sure what they are called, but they are a form of matates.? A "matate" is usually a dished out rock for grinding corn with a "mano" which is usually a rock shaped like a loaf of french bread.? These however are deep and perfectly round.? It looks like they used a log that was spun to do the grinding.? There are about thirty or forty of these in the area.? My guess is that the reason there is so many is that once they got so deep it is really hard to get the ground corn out of them.? I came to this conclusion because I tried to clean one out with my hands to see how deep it is.? The one with my hand stuck in it will show you.? That is with my fingers extended.

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

You know, I found this and just thought I would throw it in the pot and take a picture of it today.? When I saw this, I got all pissed off.? But then I got to thinking;? The Apaches covered the rocks with graffiti two hundred years ago, then this Pantlind House guy a hundred and twenty five years ago, then some kids about twenty years ago (a Miguel and 1984 in white that you can't see to the right), and just recently, some Mexicans.? People have been painting this rock for hundreds of years, but it still ticks me off when they "Say it with Krylon!"? At least the silver and white will be easier than say lime green for me to remove or cover up, as I intend to do. Maybe some grey and brown and black primers and a wire brush?



Luckily this isn't close to the others and they haven't found those...yet.? ?

 

[Nana40]

Re: Very large project!

Isn't it awesome that you get to touch that...see it in person....just be there!

Beautiful pictures Digem! Thank you for sharing those!

 

[stoney56]

Re: Very large project!

Great pics Digem! Looks like you have your hands full for a while. It's a shame about the grafitti defacing the grafitti though. Kinda makes ya wonder what archies will interpret the gang signs as in say 500 years from now.
Keep the pics comin' and HH!

 

[warsawdaddy]

Re: Very large project!

Great pics! Could those holes been for collecting water?

 

[AzSports]

Re: Very large project!

Dig -Are you sure the originals are Apache? I don't have any books on the petros but I don't see much at all on that group doodling much. Your area is one that could hold some of the many lootings back in the day.


Willie d said:
The guy mounted the coil on a long pole (probably pvc or wood) and attached it to the front of an old jeep. Hope the idea helps. If not a jeep then how about an atv?

: Where there any problems that came up? I have been planning on rigging a two box, or the Infinium, on my quad to search a fairly vast area for treasure sure to be there. It's a very open area so the width wouldn't be a problem.

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

Yeah Jonster, I am almost certain that they are Apache. That is the only band that I know of being in the area. You know... Geronimo's guys. His surrender sight is only about twenty miles from where the pics were taken. The holes in the rock I am not so certain about. I would think that that would be a lot of work just to store water. These are just up hill from a spring too. It hasn't rained here since November and there is still water in the pond. I think this is why the stagecoach station and corrals were built here. I just wish someone could tell me what they mean. I come from Cherokee blood myself and back in Georgia, there is nothing like these.

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

Also, I haven't tried the pole and ATV trick. The way I look at it, as long as I am using a 12 inch coil, I am only covering 12 inches. If I hunt by swinging it for an hour, I still cover the same ammount of area as if I hunted with the ATV for an hour. The only difference I see is that I can be more precise and get better coverage by swinging it.

 

[AzSports]

Re: Very large project!

I'm sure a lot of ground can be reliably covered with a two box, since the width detected is much wider than swinging, and at just a purr down the road a mile would be very quick. I'll let you know when I try it out in Feb.

There where a couple tribes before Apaches in the same area. Hohokums and Anazazi did a lot of the petros in our area. I can't tell the difference on a lot of them.

They all had pots to store water, but especailly grains. The holes are most likely an area where some one has lived for many centuries.

Good job!

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

I agree with them having lived there for centuries, however, I still think that drilling an eight inch by 16 inch hole to store water of grain is still a bit more work than I think they would do. If they were just for storage, I would have to go with grain. Maybe put a large round rock over the hole? There again, if you look some of these are in the middle of the wash, which would be fine for grinding during the dry days, but storage of anything when it rains would be counterproductive I think.

Here's pictures of the ones in the wash... and road. They are what prompted me to do some looking around in this area. You can see four large holes in the large rock in the foreground.

 

[AzSports]

Re: Very large project!

I didn't mean to suggest anything was stored in the holes, just that the holes are the result of grinding grain over a long period of time. The grain was kept in those large two foot high pots and such.

I haven't found any of those matates or whatever thy're called in bedrock, but usually both pieces were mobile.

Some of that in the wash may be of another origin.

Have you ever popped in the Amerind foundation place in Texas Canyon? Worth the couple bucks to get in. Pretty good display, but we have a lot better examples of stuff from the ancients!

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

"Have you ever popped in the Amerind foundation place in Texas Canyon? Worth the couple bucks to get in. Pretty good display, but we have a lot better examples of stuff from the ancients!"

Is that the place with "THE THING!"? I agree worth the couple of bucks!

I agree now that I understand what you were saying a bit better. They were diffanantly there for a long time!

As for the wash, the rock may have not been in the wash a couple hundred years ago. This is down in the flats and the wash could have moved around a bit. You know in a lot of places the Mississippi River is a couple of miles from where it was a hundred years ago. Anyway, this is going to be a great spot. I also found out that there was an Army outpost about a quarter mile from the spring and got a general location! Gotta get out there again an find that!

Anymore ideas on the spot?

 

[AzSports]

Re: Very large project!

I have a bunch of maps from the period, inc the Army and scout maps. I'll take a look and see if there's anything that'll help. I'm pokin in an area with quite a few of the old 44-40 umc rounds used till 1890, they'll ring load if you use a detector.
You really should hit the Indian camps, they did trade for jewelry and stuff later on that would sound off. Plus, it looks like rain this weekend, go out right after. That's the best time to spot flint.

Th Amerind is a small Museum devoted to AMERican INDians on the road north thru Texas canyon. But THE THING is worth it too!
www.amerind.org

Does the rancher own the land, or is it just a grazing lease thing? Keep you eyes out for the old junk, there is a bunch of old equipment laying around that can be quite valuable.
Did you get by Pearce for the craft show? Sounds like a waste but many old timers to talk too, including a historian thats lived there ninety years. I got some books I haven't even cracked yet! There was a display of old engines a guy I know has restored, a couple found out that way, that are very, very rare.

You are in the thick of an area that really doesn't get all that much attention! Don't believe the folks that say there's no gold left!!!

 

[DigEmAll]

Re: Very large project!

Almost everthing the rancher works is privately owned land. His family was some of the early settlers to the area. I'll have to get up to the Amerind museum and check that out! Didn't even know it existed. Maybe the next "Rainy day"! LOL I went to the craft show they had in Pearce about this time last year. I picked up loads of info! I would love to have copies of the Army and Scout maps from that time! I have looked everywhere for those! Everyone wants an arm and leg for maps though. I am looking for any map that is pre 1900 for anything southeast of Tucson, but mostly the area southeast of Benson. Maps seem to be hard to come by at any rate. I refuse to pay someone in Utah ten bucks for a map that they say has what you want but won't show you the map. Sometimes shopping on-line sucks! Then again sometimes you just get lucky with your research and put 2 and 2 together like I did with the stage stop. I am also still waiting for Amazon to ship a book I ordered on January 2nd about the history of the Sulfur Springs Valley. By the way, what are some good indicators to look for out here, as far as indian things go? I know what to look for back east, but everything out here is different. I was assuming that I should look for good water, but due to the quake of 1887, what was good water then is dust now and visa versa. St. David wasn't anything but desert in 1887, but after the quake, it sprouted artesian springs all over the place.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Dig 'Em All