🥇 BANNER REVOLUTIONARY WAR 9TH REGIMENT CARTRIDGE BOX PLATE!!!

[paleomaxx]

Yup, just sitting pretty wedged between some rocks in an old foundation:



Didn't even need the shovel, I just pulled two of the huge slate slabs apart and it fell out of the crack. Based on the signal I was expecting some iron sheet, and when I first picked it up I thought it was instead brass flashing, but then the light hit the engravings and I saw the 1775!



I don't have all the details on this yet as information seems to be tough to come by on these pieces and odds are this was custom made. The top says Captain and I presume the "ID" underneath are initials. 1775 may be the date of enlistment/commissioning and the Latin motto is partial but what's there reads "Vel Mors Vel Glo-" Vel Mors Vel Gloria was my first guess as to the whole motto which (while not proper Latin) could be translated to "death or glory." The wreath clearly shows "9th Reg" for 9th Regiment. Based on the motto and where this was recovered (Massachusetts) I'm leaning towards this being an American as opposed to British plate. I'm open to discussion though...



This is without a doubt a find of a lifetime for me! I've been hoping to find even a Rev War era military button this year, and I skipped right over that and then kept on skipping far past what my wildest expectations. Not just that, but being kept out of the dirt all these years it's in nearly immaculate condition and all of those detailed engravings are still as sharp as the day the were cut 245 years ago!

It seems almost silly to mention, but there were a handful of other associated finds around the foundation.



I'm positive I wasn't the first to detect this homestead as there were iron bits on rocks and around trees. Very few signals in the ground, but the tombacs and coppers at least confirm that this homesite was likely late 18th century and thus the plate was probably lost by the original owner or a close relative. The 1815 halfpenny token was a first for me and the 1857 flying eagle is in decent shape. The site being 18th century also means the missing piece may be around somewhere, but I didn't have any luck finding it today.

I'd be very interested to hear what people think on the plate, and if anyone can dig up roster information from the 9th regiment. There couldn't have been that many captains and if the initials really are "ID" it would be amazing to attribute this to a specific individual. There don't seem to be many examples of box plates from this time period out there so I'm not even sure if this is a typical layout and if having the motto in there is an unusual addition or a common practice.

Obviously time for more research, but talk about holding a piece of history in your hands...

UPDATE, CONCLUSIVELY ATTRIBUTED!!!

Well this took some serious research and some significant guidance in the right direction from some members of the facebook group suggested by Steve in PA, but I got it! The first break came from a small excerpt in the Twentieth Report of the National Society of the Daughters of the American Revolution (1916-1917). That had a little blurb:

Bowen, Jabesh. He was a corporal in Capt. Jonathan Danforth’s company, Col. Daniel Brewer’s Ninth regiment.

Captain Jonathan Danforth would match the initials and was in a 9th regiment so I dug a little deeper. The big break was in the book A History of the Town of Pittsfield in Berkshire County Mass (1844). That had an extensive biography of Colonel Joshua Danforth who had an incredible career during the revolutionary war starting as a clerk and was eventually made a colonel, but most importantly it mentioned that he served with his father's company starting in 1775:

Col. Joshua Danforth, to use the language of the Rev. Dr. Brinsmade, in the sermon preached at his funeral, “was born in Western, [now Warren,] Massachusetts, November 26th, 1759. He was the son of Jonathan Danforth, an officer in the Revolutionary War, who acted a conspicuous part as commander of a battalion in the Battle of Bennington. It was the intention of his father, in early life, to give this son a liberal education and he was qualifying himself to enter College when the Revolutionary struggle commenced. It was then, when the note of war was sounded and the veteran troops of England were pouring in upon our territories, that, at the age of fifteen years, he entered the army in the capacity of clerk in his father’s company. After having served several months in this office, at the same time discharging the duties of Surgeon’s mate, he received, at the age of sixteen, an Ensign’s commission. From this post he was promoted, and in 1778 raised to the rank of first Lieutenant, in which office he continued until 1781, when he was appointed Paymaster, with the rank of Captain.

His first active services were performed at Roxbury, in June, 1775, at the time the British were throwing bombs into that place. When General Washington had ordered the army to remove from that place, and the last regiment had left the encampment, it was ascertained that a part of the baggage had been left behind, and a detachment of men, under the command of Mr. Danforth, was ordered to go and secure it, which was done at great hazard. He remained in that vicinity until March 17, 1776, when, with the main body of the American army under Washington, he marched into Boston, as the rear of the British army left that town. He was in Boston until the following summer, and there in July heard for the first time the Declaration of Independence read to the army, which was called out for that purpose. Soon after this he went to Ticonderoga, and was at the surrender of Burgoyne in 1777. Immediately after this event, the Brigade to which he belonged was ordered to New Jersey, and thence to White Marsh; and on the 19th of December the army took up their winter quarters at Valley Forge, about twenty miles from Philadelphia, which was then in the possession of the British. It was on this march, the historian tell us that “through want of shoes and stockings, over the hard frozen ground, the army might be tracked from White Marsh to Valley Forge, by the blood from their feet.” Colonel Danforth has been heard to say that the suffering of the army from want of food and shelter that winter were incredible.

In 1778 he was in the battle of Monmouth, and the August of the following he went to Rhode Island. He spent the principle part of the year 1780 at West Point and its vicinity. In 1781 he had command, for some months, of a post a few miles from the Hudson near Tappan’s Bay, and was engaged in several skirmishes with the enemy. The army was disbanded in 1783, but Colonel Danforth was continued in the service as Paymaster, to assist in the settlement of the accounts with the soldiers, and was not discharged until the year following.

Pretty amazing, and the mentions of his father's service gave me enough to go on that I finally found a short biography of Jonathan Danforth:

Jonathan Danforth (1736-1802) was a minute man at Bunker Hill and with him were his two sons, Joshua and Jonathan, Jr. He commanded a battalion at the battle of Bennington.

And there you have it! This piece belonged to Captain Jonathan Danforth who was not only at the Battle of Bunker Hill, but had a significant role in the Battle of Bennington and this may very well have been with him at both! Talk about a one-of-a-kind piece of history folks!!!

 

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[Blak bart]

I'll vote BANNER

Me too....what a killer find !! Congrats paleomax !!

 

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[smokeythecat]

Great banner find. The initials "ID" may easily be for "JD" as "I" was commonly used in the past to mean "J".

 

[DaveSmith]

Wonderful find!
This may be a long shot, but I think this is a list of persons that applied for pensions from the revolutionary war.
https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/e...ds_and_Bounty_Land_Warrants#1813_Pension_Roll
This one below is from the southern campaign. I have never used the northern so and it is different from the southern so am not sure on how easy it will be to use finding someone by initials.
https://revwarapps.org/ GOOD LUCK!

 

[xcopperstax]

What a special, unique and historical find! Congrats. You definitely went right to the top of the list of rev war stuff you could find! I'm still hoping for a button someday! Enjoy your find! Thanks for sharing a great story and great post. I'll vote banner!

 

[PetesPockets55]

A superb piece of history and a great presentation as well.

Congratulations.

 

[DaveSmith]

Yall finding all this stuff with a detector....I'm gonna have to get one.....
Ferguson and the over the mountain men both camped in Rutherford county. That area has been looked over many times and is on private land, but the county is old and I have a few old home sites close by I can detect. I'll take any and all recommendations yall have for a detector set-up!

 

[Toecutter]

Just awesome.... got my vote!!

 

[NZ49er]

Sweet find! Let us know what you can dig up! Officers usually came from money. You might even be able to find a portrait of the owner. Banner.

 

[Steve in PA]

Incedible find. Definitely Banner. You should post it on the Revolutionary War Buttons, Plates, and Accoutrements Facebook forum. Some very knowledgeable folks on that forum.

 

[paleomaxx]

That's extraordinary (and banner!). Remember in your research, not to rule out that the "I" might actually represent a "J", a common practice at that time, such as the "IP" on this GIV-1 Masonic-Eagle flask standing for Justus Perry of the Keene-Marlboro-Street Glassworks. Best of luck in your research. What a great find!

Thank you and that's a great tip! I had forgotten about the substitution. I found two lists of Captains for the unit.

The first is from valleyforgemusterroll.org and is of the 9th Massachusetts Regiment, but probably after it reformed in 1777:

Captain Samuel Bartlett
Captain John Blanchard
Captain Samuel Carr
Captain Abraham Childs
Captain Amos Cogswell
Captain Nathan Dix
Captain Joseph Pettingill
Captain Nahum Ward

The second is off Wikipedia and concerns the 26th Continental Regiment which was formed from the 9th Regiment at the end of 1775, so the below names might include some of the original Captains in Gerrish's unit:

Thomas Mighill
Thomas Cogswell
Isaac Sherman
Richard Dodge
John Wood
Barnabas Dodge
Ezra Badlam
Joseph Pettingill

There's some overlap which is a good sign, but no slam-dunk names with ID or JD initials. Based on my research most of the above Captains and their children stayed on the Eastern side of Massachusetts after the war.

 

[paleomaxx]

Wonderful find!
This may be a long shot, but I think this is a list of persons that applied for pensions from the revolutionary war.
https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en...3_Pension_Roll
This one below is from the southern campaign. I have never used the northern so and it is different from the southern so am not sure on how easy it will be to use finding someone by initials.
https://revwarapps.org/ GOOD LUCK!

Thank you, I just visited both and those are great resources! I combed through the pension rolls for captains in Massachusetts and no luck yet, but I'll keep looking. It's very possible that he was promoted after the plate was made so he may be under Major or Colonel on the pension application.

 

[smokeythecat]

Here's a brief history lesson: 1775 was of course the beginning of the Revolution. The siege of Boston in 1775 after Lexington and Concord, was the first major campaign of the war. The British 9th regiment was not at Boston. The 9th came later and surrendered at Saratoga in 1777. I doubt this was a British piece.

The 9th Continental Regiment (out of the first 26 continental regiments was not raised in Massachusetts). It may take awhile to figure out who owned this. I'd first take a look at the land records as to where it was found. It could have been lost by the person who lived there. There were numerous reorganizations to both state troops and the Continental line throughout the war. Should be a challenge.

 

[Castineman1779]

If I may reply with some opinions to your super rare Rev War relic. First without a doubt u my friend have found true history and congrats. Now as to is it a cartridge box plate may be in question. It indeed is oval as are box plates and most shoulder belt plates of that period. However if I can guess size by your pics looks to be about 5 inches if was complete. Very large for one. 2nd assuming of brass looks very thin with one hook remaining. Box plates were usually thick and heavy to hold down the flap during inclemate weather. This one looks thin and light. My best guess is this is an officer's trunk plate. The "I looks like the
letter "I"" with a bar top and bottom so doubt is a "J" for John. Yes. In the 18th century. Many silver cartouches had the letter "I" without the bar across it and meant John. On Rev War butons the one was straight up or a "j" footed one. As for American or Brit it is hard to say since the Brits had trunk plates as well. If u could find the owner of that land may shed light on who once owned it. Trunks often survived the war and brought back to the homestead. Regardless of it's. Purpose a fantastic find and an Banner I will nominate. Gary

 

[paleomaxx]

Here's a brief history lesson: 1775 was of course the beginning of the Revolution. The siege of Boston in 1775 after Lexington and Concord, was the first major campaign of the war. The British 9th regiment was not at Boston. The 9th came later and surrendered at Saratoga in 1777. I doubt this was a British piece.

The 9th Continental Regiment (out of the first 26 continental regiments was not raised in Massachusetts). It may take awhile to figure out who owned this. I'd first take a look at the land records as to where it was found. It could have been lost by the person who lived there. There were numerous reorganizations to both state troops and the Continental line throughout the war. Should be a challenge.

Yeah, this is definitely going to be a challenge. Various sources refer to Colonel Samuel Gerrish's regiment which was authorized on April 23rd as the 9th Massachusetts Regiment, but the question is did they self-identify as the 9th regiment at the time or is was that label attached retroactively since after various reorganizations it was made into the 9th Regiment in 1777.

Land records are going to be tough on this one since the foundation was abandoned prior to the 1850's maps so I don't even have a starting name to work my way back on with deeds. This may very well require some archive diving with the town historical society.

If I may reply with some opinions to your super rare Rev War relic. First without a doubt u my friend have found true history and congrats. Now as to is it a cartridge box plate may be in question. It indeed is oval as are box plates and most shoulder belt plates of that period. However if I can guess size by your pics looks to be about 5 inches if was complete. Very large for one. 2nd assuming of brass looks very thin with one hook remaining. Box plates were usually thick and heavy to hold down the flap during inclemate weather. This one looks thin and light. My best guess is this is an officer's trunk plate. The "I looks like the
letter "I"" with a bar top and bottom so doubt is a "J" for John. Yes. In the 18th century. Many silver cartouches had the letter "I" without the bar across it and meant John. On Rev War butons the one was straight up or a "j" footed one. As for American or Brit it is hard to say since the Brits had trunk plates as well. Of the 29 guys and gals none gave any opinions so am giving u mine and again just an opinion. Fantastic find and an Banner I will nominate. Gary

Any and all opinions are welcome! Having never found or even held a Rev War era cartridge box plate before today, I could certainly be wrong. It is fairly thin brass compared to the clipped corner plates that I've found a few of, but thick enough that the whole piece is still a few ounces. The one remaining fastener looks like it was perpendicular to the plate originally and has a small square hole going through it. Not very long though so it wouldn't have passed through much material.

 

[gunsil]

SPECTACULAR FIND!! BANNER vote in!! I tend to agree that it looks large and thin for a box plate but certainly could have been intended for that purpose. I agree with Castineman that it could have been an ID plate for a trunk or other luggage item. One of the coolest finds from the US in a while.

 

[grasshopper]

WOW!! That's so cool. Amazing find. Were you scanning the foundation walls or did something just catch your eye?

 

[Castineman1779]

Am hoping others may chime in here for an opinion. Again size wise and being thin. What U just wrote tells me probably not be used on as a box plate . Often the trunks were covered in clothe or leather. The new small attachment could have been easily bent over to attach it. Cartridge box plates are rare on American boxes and again heavy for the purpose of holding brown the leather flap. Often on cartridge boxes just used designs or tacks on them. The "I" could indeed be Icibod or something common back then but just a guess. Gary

 

[paleomaxx]

WOW!! That's so cool. Amazing find. Were you scanning the foundation walls or did something just catch your eye?

Definitely a detector find. I found an almost pristine KGII half penny on the edge of a cellar hole a few months back and ever since I've made a point to scan around them at least a few times with the XP on fast mode. Mostly you get large iron blasts from flashing, but occasionally they mask smaller, better stuff so I pull those out and go around again. This was on the first pass and I thought it was going to be iron with the overload signal. I'm just glad I pulled the rocks apart with my hands and didn't go in there with the shovel!

 

[OhioTrevor]

Terrific finds. Thanks for sharing!

 

[Mr. Digger]

Incredible Mass find. Looking forward to seeing it up on the banner!