Target numeric ID values question...

[Possum]

My question is, does the Target numeric ID values remain the same no matter what mode I'm hunting in? In other words if I hunt Park 1 / 2, Field 1 / 2, Beach 1 / 2 etc... do the Target ID values stay constant or do they change based on the specific mode your hunting in? Sorry if this horse has been kicked before... "D"

 

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[Ammoman]

From what i am seeing, don't rely on the numbers....listen to the sounds. If that is not an option then take a dime and do an air test on that same dime in different modes. That should give you the answer pretty quick.

PS...i hope this don't sound rude. Its not meant to be. just tried to make it short and to the point.

 

[Happa54]

This is a good question. I haven't checked out all the modes against the tones yet but I'm looking at TID numbers simultaneously with the tones. I'm finding that when in 50 tones, and say, listening to high conduct signals, many sound alike irrespective of actual target. In other words, coppers, silvers and clad can sound identical (to me) depending on several factors so I look at the TID's to come up with an idea of what the target may be. On my Safari or an Etrac/Explorer, you can absolutely hunt by tones only and ignore many of the TID's. Just my take on how things are working out for me on my Nox.

 

[Possum]

From what i am seeing, don't rely on the numbers....listen to the sounds. If that is not an option then take a dime and do an air test on that same dime in different modes. That should give you the answer pretty quick.

PS...i hope this don't sound rude. Its not meant to be. just tried to make it short and to the point.

In no way did I take your post as rude. I appreciate you taking time out of your day to help me by giving sound (no pun intended) advice. Thanks Ammoman... "D"

 

[CharlesUpstateNY]

My question is, does the Target numeric ID values remain the same no matter what mode I'm hunting in? In other words if I hunt Park 1 / 2, Field 1 / 2, Beach 1 / 2 etc... do the Target ID values stay constant or do they change based on the specific mode your hunting in? Sorry if this horse has been kicked before... "D"

Yes and a complicated no. Yes if say a silver dime is within just a few inches of the coil, the TID of a silver dime is consistent across the modes. Beyond that distance or depth where you get that textbook TID, then the TID can change mode to mode, and recovery speed can make TID even more unstable.

Park 1 and Field 1 produce less stable TID. The TID bounces quite a bit over several TID points with occasional wild bounces even further out.

Park 2 and Field 2 are much more stable on TID. Instead of the TID bouncing around across a range of numbers, its steady, and only seems to change based on depth. A silver dime that reads 25 at 10 inches, drops to 24 at 12 inches, and 23 further out but each TID at that depth is pretty stable swing to swing.

Faster recovery speeds make matters worse in both pairs of modes. Pairs because with respect to TID stability for the most part Park 1 and Field 1 seem to behave the same, and Park 2 and Field 2 seem to behave the same.

 

[SultansOfSwing]

I noticed the numbers change slightly when using a single frequency, with bottle caps being the most drastic. In multi they ring up about an 11, dull and gruntu, and on 5kHz they ring up 25+ with the nice high tone.

 

[CharlesUpstateNY]

Sultans makes a good point, some targets may be more prone to TID's bouncing around than others.

 

[vferrari]

Especially in single frequency. That's why single frequency is often used to ferret out bottle caps.

 

[Possum]

Especially in single frequency. That's why single frequency is often used to ferret out bottle caps.

VF, Did you read my reply regarding the "Life Straw" in my other thread? "D"

 

[Possum]

So, if I'm reading this correctly I should try using Park and Field 2 for a more stable TID, am I understanding this correctly? "D"

 

[Tpmetal]

Especially in single frequency. That's why single frequency is often used to ferret out bottle caps.

True story. I have been having good luck switching over to 10kh when i get a questionable small signal. If the tid jump up to higher numbers its been some sort of iron content in the target. seems to work correctly most of the time when combined with signal size and depth while raising the coil over the target.

 

[vferrari]

So, if I'm reading this correctly I should try using Park and Field 2 for a more stable TID, am I understanding this correctly? "D"

Even though Charles AIR tests seem to indicate that, I would not take that all the way to the bank. First, it runs counter to how Minelab says the modes should behave with high conductive coins, ground effects were not taken into account (air test), and the IB filter was not set to 0 when Park 1 was tested. I do not doubt Charles test results but I think he still needs to (and is planning to) run some additional tests for confirmation that high conductor TIDs are more stable at depth in the "2" modes. Also, as has been mentioned earlier, TID number and stability are secondary indicators on a dig decision, audio "quality" to me is most important including the presence or absence of an accompanying ferrous tone and then you throw variables like the possibility of adjacent targets and you adjacent, dissimilar metal targets and 100% certainty goes out the window until you have laid eyes on the target(s).

 

[CharlesUpstateNY]

Even though Charles AIR tests seem to indicate that, I would not take that all the way to the bank. First, it runs counter to how Minelab says the modes should behave with high conductive coins, ground effects were not taken into account (air test), and the IB filter was not set to 0 when Park 1 was tested. I do not doubt Charles test results but I think he still needs to (and is planning to) run some additional tests for confirmation that high conductor TIDs are more stable at depth in the "2" modes. Also, as has been mentioned earlier, TID number and stability are secondary indicators on a dig decision, audio "quality" to me is most important including the presence or absence of an accompanying ferrous tone and then you throw variables like the possibility of adjacent targets and you adjacent, dissimilar metal targets and 100% certainty goes out the window until you have laid eyes on the target(s).

Yes, and no. Target size matters and if you look at the air tests I conducted most were cent sized or smaller. Park 1 with its weighted frequencies in multi towards the lower frequencies could very well be deeper on larger targets like silver quarters or half dollars vs Park 2. Park 2 with its frequencies weighted towards the higher frequencies would perform better on smaller coins which is what I saw happening. In theory Park 1 should go deeper in soil vs Park 2 due to its lower frequencies vs Park 2's higher frequencies, depending on how mineralized the soil is. In low mineralization probably soil doesn't even matter. The higher the mineralization the more difficult it is for higher frequencies to penetrate.

Finally lets remember when Minelab says Park 1 is best for "modern coins" they are not just talking about USA minted coins, look at all those weird Euro coins and alloys.

 

[vferrari]

Yes, and no. Target size matters and if you look at the air tests I conducted most were cent sized or smaller. Park 1 with its weighted frequencies in multi towards the lower frequencies could very well be deeper on larger targets like silver quarters or half dollars vs Park 2. Park 2 with its frequencies weighted towards the higher frequencies would perform better on smaller coins which is what I saw happening. In theory Park 1 should go deeper in soil vs Park 2 due to its lower frequencies vs Park 2's higher frequencies, depending on how mineralized the soil is. In low mineralization probably soil doesn't even matter. The higher the mineralization the more difficult it is for higher frequencies to penetrate.

Finally lets remember when Minelab says Park 1 is best for "modern coins" they are not just talking about USA minted coins, look at all those weird Euro coins and alloys.

Those are all good points and also explains why Park 1 may not be so great on edge-on coins vs. the higher-frequency weighted "2" modes.

 

[Possum]

VF, Did you read my reply regarding the "Life Straw" in my other thread? "D"

Sorry VF, this question was meant for Davers... "D"