The Counsel’s mission is; 1: Bring together all the groups and organizations that are
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2cmorau
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Clay, LOL Thanks no need to get frustrated, when i checked ICL that post was not there at the time when i did my search, thats just too funny
be nice if links were attached to comments
so the following, trout/ducks Unlimited, special interest groups and government are exempt from dumping, removing, stream alterations, and the true meaning of introduced polutant
but when a mineral exploration is in the best interest to the state, creating employment, revenue, this is a bad thing
The claim is inside the Frank Church Wilderness and in the headwaters of Big Creek, which flows into the Middle Fork of the Salmon River. The preliminary decision would allow the use of dumptrucks, bulldozers and drilling rigs to open roads, clear drill pads and excavate trenches within the wilderness. It would also allow 24-7 drilling operations and authorize up to 571 motorized vehicle trips into the Frank Church Wilderness each year for three years. - See more at: Conservationists Object to "Needlessly Destructive" Mining Activities in Frank Church Wilderness ? Idaho Conservation League
this is by Jim
Mining Districts: A Concept Reborn - ICMJ's Prospecting and Mining Journal
be nice if links were attached to comments
so the following, trout/ducks Unlimited, special interest groups and government are exempt from dumping, removing, stream alterations, and the true meaning of introduced polutant
but when a mineral exploration is in the best interest to the state, creating employment, revenue, this is a bad thing
The claim is inside the Frank Church Wilderness and in the headwaters of Big Creek, which flows into the Middle Fork of the Salmon River. The preliminary decision would allow the use of dumptrucks, bulldozers and drilling rigs to open roads, clear drill pads and excavate trenches within the wilderness. It would also allow 24-7 drilling operations and authorize up to 571 motorized vehicle trips into the Frank Church Wilderness each year for three years. - See more at: Conservationists Object to "Needlessly Destructive" Mining Activities in Frank Church Wilderness ? Idaho Conservation League
this is by Jim
Mining Districts: A Concept Reborn - ICMJ's Prospecting and Mining Journal
Bill_saf
Sr. Member
Fowledup,
I see you got what I said in my post. Now all we need to do is get rid of the flying monkey's
SLNugget
Sr. Member
This is a very interesting thread with some good thoughts and insights in this new organization. I for one think the idea of having a national organization with the goals of the small scale mining industry as a mandate would be good. (Not necessarily this organization) I can see not everyone likes the idea. Along with all the criticism do any of you have any suggestions on a better way to accomplish the goals of the small scale miners? How can or can small scale miners become a force in the federal agencies decision making process before it is too late?
fowledup
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Folks keep refering to this new entity as an 'organization'- They are not, they are a group who needs us and our votes to achieve their goal of becoming a Federal Government Agency. The difference between an orgainization and a Government agency is very simple.- When an organization stops representing your interests you have the option to stop funding and supporting them. With a Government agency your stuck with what ya got until the next election when you hope you can make a change, which as we can all atest seldom goes as we'd like. We already have organizations whose sole purpose and reason for existence is the betterment of small scale miners. The solution? There have been many very smart people shouting to the masses for years what the solution is; Learn the law, and know your rights. Organize into the mining districts those laws grant and recognize. Then through the legal authority granted to those districts force coordination and cooperation with the governing agencies. There are Mining Districts in operation now that are prime examples of the purpose and benefits of what a Mining District can do.
Two weeks ago none of us had ever heard of these folks, in fact what little we do know is from third party supporters, supporters who hadn't heard of them two weeks ago either. It's just plain odd- No Q&A, no roundtables, no fact finding meetings, no response from the individuals to any questions at all other then an attitude of we've got the solution and ya all gotta do this now before it's too late.
Criticism- no, Cautious and skeptical- absolutley! If this Federal mining agency in charge of all mining districts thing is indeed the direction the mining community wants to take- why are we not including the Districts allready established and in operation who have experience and a proven track record. Why are we not discussing and voting on which of those "organizations" is the most qualified and should be the ones to morph into this new agency? Again I have no affiliation or membership with any of the others either, I just want to know why this one is so qualified. More questions, no answers!
Two weeks ago none of us had ever heard of these folks, in fact what little we do know is from third party supporters, supporters who hadn't heard of them two weeks ago either. It's just plain odd- No Q&A, no roundtables, no fact finding meetings, no response from the individuals to any questions at all other then an attitude of we've got the solution and ya all gotta do this now before it's too late.
Criticism- no, Cautious and skeptical- absolutley! If this Federal mining agency in charge of all mining districts thing is indeed the direction the mining community wants to take- why are we not including the Districts allready established and in operation who have experience and a proven track record. Why are we not discussing and voting on which of those "organizations" is the most qualified and should be the ones to morph into this new agency? Again I have no affiliation or membership with any of the others either, I just want to know why this one is so qualified. More questions, no answers!
Underburden
Sr. Member
Who are the principles of MMAC?
I asked this question several weeks ago and nothing.
I asked this question several weeks ago and nothing.
SLNugget
Sr. Member
I am relatively new to mining and prospecting, but I am not aware of any NATIONAL organization
whose sole reason for existence is the betterment of small scale mining. Nor have I seen or heard any person calling for the formation of mining districts in the past three or four years. I do agree that there is very little response and information forthcoming from the principles of this group trying to become a Federal Agency. It does make one suspicious to say the least.
.
From what I’ve gathered so far we have Joe Martori & Clark Pearson as the principles
The California high desert has been hit hard, the conservationists, the DRECP the segregation of lands for energy development DRECP
then there’s WEMO wildlife corridor http://www.blm.gov/ca/pdfs/cdd_pdfs/wemo_pdfs/plan/wemo/Vol-1-Chapter1_Bookmarks.pdf
They formed the California Desert District Mining Coalition CDDMC.com
Even though they have sat in on every meeting they could for 5 plus years the miners were not included as stakeholders
in any of the decision-making and they just bulldozed these land use plans in place.
So I can understand where they are coming from, at some point Joe Martori saw the story,http://www.sleepybearmining.com/index.html
What Is A Mining Right? by Clark Pearson Director, Northern Office Public Lands for the People.
What Is A Mining Right?
And so Joe Martori & Clark Pearson got together and worked on the Mining district idea,
They met with their congressman, Paul Cook and he wrote a letter requesting they be recognized
as federal stakeholders for “DRECP and other land-use planning”(sic) .
http://www.mineralsandminingadvisorycouncil.org/pdf/02-19-2015-Congressional-Letter-Backing.pdf
Somehow Joe latched onto modifying HB 761 which passed the house but was not worked on since the senate
was controlled by democrats. Joe is now in DC pushing this.
So now comes my opinion, why was no one consulted except their little group,
lots of others in other states that will be affected by this? Why HB 761? just write a new bill.
HR 761 National Strategic and Critical Minerals Production Act has nothing to do with placer mining,
https://www.congress.gov/bill/113th-congress/house-bill/761
as written this could re-open gold mines that also have Tellurium and other rare earths
this means building up state mining & geology departments, mining jobs, new schools of mines,
anyone remember what a mineral survey is? It would build up the mining industry
with the time frame now of 10 plus years to get approval to mine, 2 ½ years seams like overnight.
key points;National Strategic and Critical Minerals Production Act of 2013 (H.R. 761)
something’s not right. Why have a petition to pass HB 761 it hasn’t been amended yet that’s not how it works!
https://www.change.org/p/pass-hr-761
It would be something else and never see the light of day, WHY?
I’m all for Mining Districts, the right way would to provide outreach to miners in each area
to form their local districts by miners for miners, that would earn their trust.
As it is, I would suggest to protect your voice, call together miners and prospectors in your area
and form your own mining districts. Here’s some bylaws, record your declaration with your county recorder,
that will make you an unincorporated local government entity and entitled to federal coordination,
if it’s requested!, for any federal action...
Laws- Galice Mining District bylaws;
http://galicemining.x10.mx/law.html
From what I’ve gathered so far we have Joe Martori & Clark Pearson as the principles
The California high desert has been hit hard, the conservationists, the DRECP the segregation of lands for energy development DRECP
then there’s WEMO wildlife corridor http://www.blm.gov/ca/pdfs/cdd_pdfs/wemo_pdfs/plan/wemo/Vol-1-Chapter1_Bookmarks.pdf
They formed the California Desert District Mining Coalition CDDMC.com
Even though they have sat in on every meeting they could for 5 plus years the miners were not included as stakeholders
in any of the decision-making and they just bulldozed these land use plans in place.
So I can understand where they are coming from, at some point Joe Martori saw the story,http://www.sleepybearmining.com/index.html
What Is A Mining Right? by Clark Pearson Director, Northern Office Public Lands for the People.
What Is A Mining Right?
And so Joe Martori & Clark Pearson got together and worked on the Mining district idea,
They met with their congressman, Paul Cook and he wrote a letter requesting they be recognized
as federal stakeholders for “DRECP and other land-use planning”(sic) .
http://www.mineralsandminingadvisorycouncil.org/pdf/02-19-2015-Congressional-Letter-Backing.pdf
Somehow Joe latched onto modifying HB 761 which passed the house but was not worked on since the senate
was controlled by democrats. Joe is now in DC pushing this.
So now comes my opinion, why was no one consulted except their little group,
lots of others in other states that will be affected by this? Why HB 761? just write a new bill.
HR 761 National Strategic and Critical Minerals Production Act has nothing to do with placer mining,
https://www.congress.gov/bill/113th-congress/house-bill/761
as written this could re-open gold mines that also have Tellurium and other rare earths
this means building up state mining & geology departments, mining jobs, new schools of mines,
anyone remember what a mineral survey is? It would build up the mining industry
with the time frame now of 10 plus years to get approval to mine, 2 ½ years seams like overnight.
key points;National Strategic and Critical Minerals Production Act of 2013 (H.R. 761)
something’s not right. Why have a petition to pass HB 761 it hasn’t been amended yet that’s not how it works!
https://www.change.org/p/pass-hr-761
It would be something else and never see the light of day, WHY?
I’m all for Mining Districts, the right way would to provide outreach to miners in each area
to form their local districts by miners for miners, that would earn their trust.
As it is, I would suggest to protect your voice, call together miners and prospectors in your area
and form your own mining districts. Here’s some bylaws, record your declaration with your county recorder,
that will make you an unincorporated local government entity and entitled to federal coordination,
if it’s requested!, for any federal action...
Laws- Galice Mining District bylaws;
http://galicemining.x10.mx/law.html
Last edited:
fowledup
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SLNugget; "I am relatively new to mining and prospecting, but I am not aware of any NATIONAL organization
whose sole reason for existence is the betterment of small scale mining. Nor have I seen or heard any person calling for the formation of mining districts in the past three or four years."
I do agree that a NATIONAL organization in the sense you imply does not exist. But that is not what this thread is about, it's about a new FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AGENCY. However, I would argue that PLP certainly qualifies as a national organization committed to the betterment of small scale mining, and even though they represent all user groups of public lands they have always had our best interests at heart. WMA and AMRA may have the majority of their efforts focused here in CA at this point in time but they have not limited themselves to just CA's problems by any means. I would wager that If the funding and suppport were in place either of them may be inclined to assume more of a NATIONAL leadership role. GPAA is a national organization, the fact is an organization is what the membership makes it, but again that is not what this thread is about.
As far as folks advocating for Mining Districts - The article about the importance of Mining Districts from the ICMJ linked in this thread was written 2011 (4years ago). If you would like more info on those who have been advocating for mining districts for at least 3-4 years do a search on any of the following- SWOMA, Jefferson Mining District, Waldo Mining District, Galice Mining District, Kirby Jackson, Hal Anthony. You should also be able to do a search here on TNET and find more threads by MEG, Clay Diggins, and others, not sure you'd have to look.
*I removed my comments, all is well my apologies for getting ruffled
whose sole reason for existence is the betterment of small scale mining. Nor have I seen or heard any person calling for the formation of mining districts in the past three or four years."
I do agree that a NATIONAL organization in the sense you imply does not exist. But that is not what this thread is about, it's about a new FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AGENCY. However, I would argue that PLP certainly qualifies as a national organization committed to the betterment of small scale mining, and even though they represent all user groups of public lands they have always had our best interests at heart. WMA and AMRA may have the majority of their efforts focused here in CA at this point in time but they have not limited themselves to just CA's problems by any means. I would wager that If the funding and suppport were in place either of them may be inclined to assume more of a NATIONAL leadership role. GPAA is a national organization, the fact is an organization is what the membership makes it, but again that is not what this thread is about.
As far as folks advocating for Mining Districts - The article about the importance of Mining Districts from the ICMJ linked in this thread was written 2011 (4years ago). If you would like more info on those who have been advocating for mining districts for at least 3-4 years do a search on any of the following- SWOMA, Jefferson Mining District, Waldo Mining District, Galice Mining District, Kirby Jackson, Hal Anthony. You should also be able to do a search here on TNET and find more threads by MEG, Clay Diggins, and others, not sure you'd have to look.
*I removed my comments, all is well my apologies for getting ruffled
Last edited:
SLNugget
Sr. Member
My reply was not intended to mock you or infer you are full of BS. I apologize for wording it so that you could take it that way.
OP
OP
chupacabra
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Here you guys in the know go, get in on the conference call
http://www.mineralsandminingadvisorycouncil.org/pdf/MMAC-Conference-Call.pdf
http://www.mineralsandminingadvisorycouncil.org/pdf/MMAC-Conference-Call.pdf
russau
Gold Member
this must have been in by the 18th of March deadline!
OP
OP
chupacabra
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The conference call was this morning I listened in for a bit, did any of you listen ?
B H Prospector
Hero Member
I sat in on the whole conference. Those of you that expressed concern over the administrative mining districts, or the law enforcement issue can be at ease. First the administrative mining districts is not the formation of new mining districts. That by law can't be done unless a district requests it according to what they said. What they are doing is reinstating the original 19 districts that were formed with their laws to form the 1872 mining laws. They also named off several law codes and sections that I couldn't write fast enough to get down on paper. The law enforcement is not to watch over miners like the BLM, USFS. EPA and others are doing. It is to help settle miner to miner issues through the administrative mining districts and MMAC without going to county, state, or federal courts. Also the law enforcement officers are to be well versed in the mining laws to protect the miners from other interfering agencies such as the BLM, USFS etc. The MMAC will not be a subordinate to any other agency. The MMAC is being helped and guided by the American Miners Rights group whom as I understand is a group of legal eagles who know the mining laws inside and out. There will be several more conferences coming up. the next one will be April 18th at 9:00 pacific time. There will be different issues discussed at each one. They said the web site is changing all the time with mire info added each time. This is going to be a very good thing for miners. Like a lot of you I was skeptical at first also. They were even a little guarded with some legal plans for now for fear there was some greenies listening in. There was so much info over the course of the conference to list it all and I don't remember everything as my note taking is lacking. Continue checking their web site to get the latest. I believe us miners should get behind this and support the MMAC. I keep reading all this negative stuff about the MMAC. Complaining about no round table discussions etc. Well that Is kind of what this conference was about to inform. But I'll bet most of you didn't even bother to listen to the conference to learn the details. Too busy with your own lives to get informed but plenty of time to sit on this forum to B***H. Seems to be a lot of gum flappin. You all talk the talk but are you willing to walk the walk? Everyone here keeps saying that being informed is getting knowledge and knowledge is power. Well how about getting educated and informed. Get the facts then make your conclusions.
BH Prospector
BH Prospector
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B H Prospector
Hero Member
SL Nugget,
As you say you are relatively new to mining. This is happening very fast and for a good reason. Dictator Obama, the BLM, and USFS is going to ramrod anti mining agenda through before the dictator leaves office. So yes it did catch us off guard. If you had listened to the conference on Saturday you would have learned that they are not necessarily trying to become another government agency. They are possibly seeking to get funding as an agency and they are also investigating ways through the law to get funding without being an agency. There is a lot of legal things going on we don't know yet that will becoming out in future conferences. Read my post on page 7 of this thread on the conference. While people have a right to be skeptical don't jump to conclusions.
delnorter
Hero Member
I appreciate the write up B H P.
I'm guilty of not listening to the conference call. I was working most of the day and then after work sawed, split, loaded and unloaded a half chord of firewood. I am taking today off besides stacking the wood.
Any way, again, thank you for keeping us posted. I would like further information about of one of your statements. You said "The law enforcement is not to watch over miners like the BLM, USFS. EPA and others are doing. It is to help settle miner to miner issues through the administrative mining districts and MMAC without going to county, state, or federal courts." Are there a lot of issues between miners that need law enforcement or court action?
Mike
I'm guilty of not listening to the conference call. I was working most of the day and then after work sawed, split, loaded and unloaded a half chord of firewood. I am taking today off besides stacking the wood.
Any way, again, thank you for keeping us posted. I would like further information about of one of your statements. You said "The law enforcement is not to watch over miners like the BLM, USFS. EPA and others are doing. It is to help settle miner to miner issues through the administrative mining districts and MMAC without going to county, state, or federal courts." Are there a lot of issues between miners that need law enforcement or court action?
Mike
The purpose of a forum is to have a discussion, I’m nether for or against this group.
The green’s have sheeple and we hope that that isn’t happening here with miners, but I don’t know...
Right now people are signing a petition on HR761 that right now is dead with the hope that this group will amend it
and send it back through congress and each of their committee’s then get voted on with these amendments that’s a long shot.
Petition from AMRA; https://www.change.org/p/pass-hr-761
The green’s have sheeple and we hope that that isn’t happening here with miners, but I don’t know...
Right now people are signing a petition on HR761 that right now is dead with the hope that this group will amend it
and send it back through congress and each of their committee’s then get voted on with these amendments that’s a long shot.
Petition from AMRA; https://www.change.org/p/pass-hr-761
Bluestar9
Jr. Member
Shannon Poe, "MMAC is staffed by miners for miners and not special interest groups, environmental groups which are influencing public policy, laws, " He is outright lying.
MMAC's main partner on their own web site is Emerald Planet, a U.N. environmental group. Their partnership with Emerald Planet will trump any partnership they have with miners. The light of day is shining on these cockroaches.
fowledup
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Wow, just got back from an unexpected trip to Texas to help bring my son back home who's getting out of the service, it seems in my brief absence as tho Tnet has turned into my granddaughters facebook page. Why is it Bitc---g and negative because someone questions what they don't know or understand. I received a call about the "conference call" yesterday somewhere between Phoenix and Wickenburg (cool place by the way, I see why you all winter down there) and was not able to get in on it. Does anyone know if it was recorded, or if any of the questions or concerns from here were addressed?
BH - The American Mining Rights Group? Do you mean AMRA, American Mining RIghts Association? If so, excellent folks that they are, they are not "Legal Eagles". They are simply dredgers who formed an organiztion to fight for their and subsequently our rights, and are doing a damn fine job of it. They also rely heavily on the legal expertise of the same folks the rest of us do, the ones who have done the most and whose legal opinion we respect the most. The very folks I keep waiting to hear an opinion from about MMAC but haven't. There are a handful of individuals involved in the big scheme of things who truly know and understand the mining laws and the current politics involved. So far the majority haven't had much good to say, or have been curiously silent.
Your being pretty harsh on those who dare to question. Are you a claim holder in Ca, paying property tax and fees on claims your losing your butt on and can't mine in a profitable manner? What will you lose if we here in California act without question on something that for all we know is an ill thought out rushed idea with consequences that will be hard to reverse? As a substantial stakeholder in this I will stick to what I've said and continue to question until I know and understand how this effects us all, now and in the future.
BH - The American Mining Rights Group? Do you mean AMRA, American Mining RIghts Association? If so, excellent folks that they are, they are not "Legal Eagles". They are simply dredgers who formed an organiztion to fight for their and subsequently our rights, and are doing a damn fine job of it. They also rely heavily on the legal expertise of the same folks the rest of us do, the ones who have done the most and whose legal opinion we respect the most. The very folks I keep waiting to hear an opinion from about MMAC but haven't. There are a handful of individuals involved in the big scheme of things who truly know and understand the mining laws and the current politics involved. So far the majority haven't had much good to say, or have been curiously silent.
Your being pretty harsh on those who dare to question. Are you a claim holder in Ca, paying property tax and fees on claims your losing your butt on and can't mine in a profitable manner? What will you lose if we here in California act without question on something that for all we know is an ill thought out rushed idea with consequences that will be hard to reverse? As a substantial stakeholder in this I will stick to what I've said and continue to question until I know and understand how this effects us all, now and in the future.
B H Prospector
Hero Member
Poe is not lying. The MMAC is staffed by miners only. A partner does not mean they are part of the staff. The PLP, Congressman Cook. the BLM, are all partners, but not necessarily part of the staff. If you have concerns call them or email them. I have done that about those connections. I told them the only conservation groups they should have any affiliation with is groups like Ducks Unlimited, and the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation. The whole point of my posts today is to tell everyone here to stop B****ing and making statements on something you know nothing about how it works and get involved by contacting them with your concerns and questions. That is one of the things they asked for everyone to do. They want to know what you think, what you want and expect. So do it and stop sitting here questioning and thinking the world is ending. Get your answers!
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