This State law effects the entire state of TN for MDing !!!

[soar697877]

Apparently this effects the ENTIRE STATE of TN FOLKS !!!

According to the email's finally received today from the Deputy Director of Parks here in Clarksville, TN he says all Metal Detectorists operating on anyones property but their own, are automatically criminals= Vandals, and will be charged.

Ok, here is latest response from my city deputy park director:


From: Steve
Date: 2007/08/01 Wed PM 12:39:35 EST
To: "Cowling, Kevin" <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: RE: Question about a hobby



OK, first, my name is Mr. CODERRE, not Corderre.

Second, now you are deliberately being prejudiced against Metal Detectorists.

You are saying that it is ok for other Hobby users to dig and cause "vandalism"
in city parks because you "KNOW and expect" it, and agree to it for them, just not for metal detectorists, even in the TOT Lots, -sand/pebble/wood/Bark areas?

You quoted an apparent state of TN law, but you are now choosing when to
enforce it...for the benefit of your wishes alone. The idea of that apparent state of TN law you quoted was never intended for the hobbyists in mind, as the football, baseball, football, Hobby Metal Detectorists, soccer players.

By the way, for your info...the properties in question are indeed PUBLIC
properties, not your personal land, and you cannot legally bend for some and not others if you are going to bend the laws you are quoting period. Have you ever actually read the Clarksville Muni-code?

Here is an excerpt:

Sec. 10-236. Tampering with public property. - does not apply to MD'ing

or this one:

Sec. 12-503. Same--Function.

The recreation committee shall provide, conduct, and supervise public
playgrounds, athletic fields, recreation centers, and any other recreational
facilities and activities on properties that the city may own or private
property owners may provide or make available for such uses. The committee may conduct any form of recreation or cultural activity that it deems advisable to
employ the leisure time of the people in a constructive and wholesome manner.
(Code 1963, § 20-3)



I believe my new Hobby is constructive and wholesome in manner, just as anyone else's.




Maybe I should not have chosen Clarksville, TN to retire in, I thought
Clarksville had some common sense, guess I was mistaken.



Steven CODERRE

Clarksville, TN


>
> From: "Cowling, Kevin" <[email protected]>
> Date: 2007/08/01 Wed AM 11:53:59 EST
> To: "Steve" <[email protected]>
> CC: "Elliott, Charles" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: RE: Question about a hobby
>
> Mr. Corderre,
>
> The children are not guilty of vandalism, as stated in the law it is
> says "without the owner's consent" it is known the playground will have
> this type of activity in the ground cover.>

> The athletics are under the same premise, the city knows these teams
> will be using the facilities and any damage is the result of play, not a
> specific activity.>
> Thank you,
>
> Kevin Cowling, CPRP
> Deputy Director
> Clarksville Parks and Recreation
> 102 Public Square
> Clarksville, TN 37040
> Office - 931-645-7476
> Fax - 931-553-2432
> Cell - 931-320-1599

From: Steve
Date: 2007/08/01 Wed AM 11:14:26 EST
To: "Cowling, Kevin" <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: RE: Question about a hobby



Sir,

OK, so I assume that the playground areas/TOT lots are ok then, as they are either sand, or wooden bark, NOT sod, correct? Or are the children guilty of the law as well when they dig/play in them?

Also, does the park dept enforce this same rule against the various sports , i.
e. soccer, football, baseball ? Those and other activities also would pertain to that wording of the state law you are quoting. Thanks.

Mr. CODERRE

>
> From: "Cowling, Kevin" <[email protected]>
> Date: 2007/08/01 Wed AM 10:57:12 EST
> To: "Steve" <[email protected]>
> CC: "Elliott, Charles" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: Question about a hobby
>
> Mr. Corderre,
>
>
>
> I do appreciate you taking the time to email us in regards to your
> question about metal detecting in our parks. In regards to metal
> detecting rules that aren't posted on our website and the City Municode,
> the law actually comes from the State of Tennessee Annotated, it reads;
>
>
>
> Vandalism 39-14-408:
>
> "Any person who knowingly causes damage to or the destruction of
> personal property of another or of the State, the United States, any
> county, city or town knowing that the person does not have the owner's
> effective consent is guilty of an offense under this section."
>
>
>
> I do not doubt that you hold the highest standards in regard to your
> hobby, but we have had problems in the past of people digging and not
> repairing their holes throughout our parks. The result being the
> department not allowing this to continue. I again would like to thank
> you for taking the time to contact us and apologize for the delay in
> returning your email.
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
>
>
> Kevin Cowling, CPRP
>
> Deputy Director
>
> Clarksville Parks and Recreation
>
> 102 Public Square
>
> Clarksville, TN 37040
>
> Office - 931-645-7476
>
> Fax - 931-553-2432
>
> Cell - 931-320-1599
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Steve [mailto:[email protected]]
> Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 5:37 PM
> To: Cowling, Kevin
> Subject: Question about a hobby
>
>
>
> Good Afternoon Sir,
>
>
>
> I understand from your secretary that I would have to ask you whether or
> not a hobby I am interested in pursuing is
>
> currently against any city of Clarksville Muni-code, or similar written
> law/regulation, being you are the Deputy Director.
>
>
>
> I am a hobby detectorist, and homeowner here in Clarksville, TN. I
> recently retired from the US Army and have decided to make this my home.
I have reviewed your parks website, and also the muni-code of Clarksville.

I have found only one park that specifically prohibits using a metal
detector in the public park, that is the FT Defiance park.
I definitely understand the reasoning behind that particular park,
due to the vast historic value of it, and of course the fallen soldiers.

> No other park rules listed for any other park prohibit metal detector
> use, per your posted web site's for each park.
>
> Also, I find nothing in the city muni-code that would prohibit use on
> public city park land.
>
>
>
> Understand that we are not talking about shovels & backhoes here..just
> simple hobby detecting with a screwdriver size probe, etc.
The hobby is actually very misunderstood by most, and I hope that by
> being a positive ambassador for the hobby detectorist in general , I
> could show what a great hobby this is. Have you ever lost anything
of sentimental value in a park? People like me have found those
sentimental things people have lost, and returned them when possible
going to extremes to find the owners initials in rings, etc.
>
>
>
> It is all about a code of ethics. I myself, have a strong code of ethics
> & morals. I currently possess a Gov't Secret clearance, my fingerprints
are on file with the local CPD (Just renewed my clearance
-FBI fingerprint card), I have no record at all.
>
> So I can assure you that I would respect any park at all times if I were
> to detect in one.
>
>
>
> If the Park Dept or the local CPD ever need a reliable, experienced
> metal detectorist for any criminal issue, i.e. find robbery loot,
dropped weapons, etc. I would help if asked.

> Currently there is no North TN Metal Detectorist
> Clubs that I am aware of, only the Middle TN club out of Nashville, TN.
> I might even one day wish to start a local north TN Club, and of course,
I would demand the same code of ethics of its members.
>
>
>
> Thank you for your time.
>
>
>
>
> Steven G. Coderre
> Clarksville, TN
> (931) 378-2875

 

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[kevino1960]

Good luck with this soar! I have a short story pertaining to this subject, except that it happened in FL. One night while walking the dog I saw our local Sheriff Deputy with a flashlight searching the ground around the City Hall/ Park. I live in a small community in Pinellas County (St Pete ) and the Sheriffs Dept does our policing. I asked what he was looking for, he replied a set of keys a lady had lost. I offered to go home and return with detector in tow and help. He said not to worry about it then but, if I did find them later (ie during daylight) to drop them in the lost and found at the City Hall. I said OK and continued on my way. The next day I went to said City Hall relayed previous nights events and asked the City Manager (like I said it is a small place) if the keys had been found. He pulled a 'lost and found' cardboard box from under the counter, dug through it and said nope, no keys. Then he tells me that a woman had lost a wedding ring 'out there' somewhere and that might be a further incentive to look for afore mentioned keys! ( I think she had been a pain in his neck over the ring) I have never found the keys or the ring but, I often hunt the park/ tot lot, wave at the city folks and the Sheriff and NEVER get hassled. Sometimes it is a matter of being in the right place at the right time... and I was this time. Good Luck and Happy Hunting! oh, and don't forget you can catch a whole lot more flies with honey than vinegar

Kevin

 

[soar697877]

Thanks for the reply kevin,

And while I truly understand your experience was a good one, and it worked for you,
I am not one to feel like I have to use honey (kiss butt,etc.) instead of vinegar just
to be "allowed" to enjoy my chosen hobby. I would not want to feel that way about
any other hobby I pursued on public park property either.

 

[Jason in TN]

I detect in all the parks around here with no problem sounds like you just have some one who does not like detectors. Or has a friend that he wants to keep the parks for them to detect.

 

[roddy96]

Hi Steve about MDing in TN. I have done in the knoxville area never had any problems here. Roddy96

 

[JMon]

Steve,

I live in Clarksville as well and have never seen or dealt with guys like that in town. I have MD'd at Fairgrounds Park and never had anyone stop me or say anything. Maybe this guy hadn't had his coffee yet.

BTW, DO NOT MD on Fort Campbell. The US Fish and Wildlife Service cited me for an ARPA violation. ARPA is the Archeological Resources Protection Act. This pertains to PUBLIC lands, but when you read the definition, public lands is anything that the Government holds deed and/or title to.

 

[teverly]

So basically as long as you have permission on private property you dont have to worry about it.On the other hand if you were tresspassing on private property they could charge you with vanalism....

And one question i would ask.:
Since when is playing a sport in a park NOT a known activity.He said damage from a sport was not from a known activity....

 

[wormnblack]

I live in Dyersburg and have hunted our parks (and the fair grounds) with cops driving right by me and no one has NEVER said anything to me. I have also hunted a recreational park in Jackson and a cop drove past us a couple different times. They never said anything then, either. This also goes for the humboldt area, too.

As a matter of fact, we've had people come by to ask us if we've found anything good and even suggested places to go! So, until I get clapped in irons...then I guess I'll keep on doing what I do.

 

[DaChief]

I picked up a recurring theme in the Managers responses tha I experienced in Georgia. Some A-hole in the past went into the parks and dug trenches and did not cover them up. Not a good justification for excluding all other detectorists for me but that is what happens. I am sure that there have been some sports teams that tore up the grounds just as bad but of course all sports teams weren't banned.

I hate it for you. I would take it higher. Meet with a city councilman and keep it civil and explain your side. Maybe there can be a change.

Also, the manager needs to mind his business about other people's property. All states have that law he quoted. Of course you can't go on any other person's property without their permission and vandalize it. DUHH!!!! That is why we all make sure we get permission and that the owner knows exactly what we are doing.

Good luck my friend. I am hoping to move from Florida to Tennessee in the coming months. Keeping my fingers crossed for a job in Johnson City.

DaChief

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

I think you inadvertently covered the answer to the quandary. (though your official might not agree).

You said:

Any person who knowingly causes damage to or the destruction of
> personal property of another or of the State, the United States, any
> county, city or town knowing that the person does not have the owner's
> effective consent is guilty of an offense under this section."

If it is public, who is the owner

B

 

[Salvor6]

Steve you just ran into one bad egg. He can't change the laws by himself. I would pursue this higher. Go to your city councilman with a complaint.

 

[lou423]

There is a county park close to Chattanooga. Half of the time that I go there, the ranger says: MD not allowed, the other half, they say: it is OK, just do not make big holes.

There is nothing to find there anyway.

 

[Masonlid]

I have the same problem here in Mcminn Co.The city said I could hunt on city property but what I find belongs to them.Sooooo I thought I would hunt their land and give them all the garbage I found and charge them for cleaning up!Not done it yet but still pondering it

 

[DirtDiggler]

If the park is open for sporting activities, then you should be good as gold.
I looked up definition of sport for the heck of it.

1.
a. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
b. A particular form of this activity.
2. An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken competitively.
3. An active pastime; recreation.

Metal detecting an active pastime for anyone? It is for me.

Main Entry: pas·time
Pronunciation: \ˈpas-ˌtīm\
Function: noun
Date: 15th century
: something that amuses and serves to make time pass agreeably : diversion

Well I think metal detecting fits the definition of sport. Good luck with this! And don't give up. That's what they want you to do.