TIRED of Folks Trying to RUN MY LIFE

[Tom_in_CA]

..... then h proceeds to go into a spill about how I should be ashamed of myself for making money of poor unsuspecting people that doesn't know what I find.......

civil_war, I laughed so hard I spilled my coffee when I read your above quote. I too heard that from a few folks in my 40 yrs. of this. At a school yard I was getting grief at, the person questioning my activity made the same sort of observation. That I was capitalizing off of other's misfortunes. And that the school goes to great lengths to teach honesty to the kids, thus the kids would turn in items found to their teachers. Rather than things being taken by total strangers for their own profiteering.

So how do we md'rs answer something like this ? This sort of mental image of md'rs sort of falls under the category of rules that forbid "take", "remove", "harvest", and "lost & found" statutes. That, yes, technically the things we find *do* belong to someone.

Hmmm, Ok, I'll admit it: I'm an opportunistic vulture, who profits off the misfortunes of others ! How can we even sleep at night ? It's akin to "theft" afterall, right ? I know you are as grief-stricken with guilt as I am now. Right ?

 

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[civil_war22]

civil_war, I laughed so hard I spilled my coffee when I read your above quote. I too heard that from a few folks in my 40 yrs. of this. At a school yard I was getting grief at, the person questioning my activity made the same sort of observation. That I was capitalizing off of other's misfortunes. And that the school goes to great lengths to teach honesty to the kids, thus the kids would turn in items found to their teachers. Rather than things being taken by total strangers for their own profiteering.

So how do we md'rs answer something like this ? This sort of mental image of md'rs sort of falls under the category of rules that forbid "take", "remove", "harvest", and "lost & found" statutes. That, yes, technically the things we find *do* belong to someone.

Hmmm, Ok, I'll admit it: I'm an opportunistic vulture, who profits off the misfortunes of others ! How can we even sleep at night ? It's akin to "theft" afterall, right ? I know you are as grief-stricken with guilt as I am now. Right ?

Yes I am so grief stricken I can't handle it. The only therapy that is going to work I guess is to go out and swing a detector.

 

[cudamark]

civil_war, I laughed so hard I spilled my coffee when I read your above quote. I too heard that from a few folks in my 40 yrs. of this. At a school yard I was getting grief at, the person questioning my activity made the same sort of observation. That I was capitalizing off of other's misfortunes. And that the school goes to great lengths to teach honesty to the kids, thus the kids would turn in items found to their teachers. Rather than things being taken by total strangers for their own profiteering.

So how do we md'rs answer something like this ? This sort of mental image of md'rs sort of falls under the category of rules that forbid "take", "remove", "harvest", and "lost & found" statutes. That, yes, technically the things we find *do* belong to someone.

Hmmm, Ok, I'll admit it: I'm an opportunistic vulture, who profits off the misfortunes of others ! How can we even sleep at night ? It's akin to "theft" afterall, right ? I know you are as grief-stricken with guilt as I am now. Right ?

I tell them that I do return items if they have any value and can be positively identified. No way to I.D. the ownership of coins and most relics, and the school/park department/lifeguard service lost and found isn't going to want these dirty/crusty items anyway. Leaving these items in the ground doesn't help the "misfortunate" either.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

... Leaving these items in the ground doesn't help the "misfortunate" either.

Oh yeah ? Well how do YOU know whether or not that poor misfortunate kid isn't planning to come back with his own metal detector, to find that quarter he lost ? You can't be *100%* certain that the item you found, isn't possibly still being sought by the person who lost it. Eh ?

Or how about if you find an 1890 $5 gold piece. You might *assume* that it was lost in antiquity , thus the person who lost it is long since passed away, right ? But how can you be 100% certain that a coin-collector didn't accidentally loose it a week ago, and is still furiously searching for it ?

Tsk Tsk. I know you too are grief-stricken now as well. So box up all your stuff and send it to me for proper repatriation procedure. I will absolve your conscience of all guilt !

 

[cudamark]

Since he can't identify the coin as his any more than I can, he'll just have the compete with the rest of us! As for the gold coin....if it was found out of place, like a modern park or fresh drop on the beach, I'd run it in a lost and found ad. The responder would have to know everything about it and where it was lost to claim it.

 

[civil_war22]

I tell them that I do return items if they have any value and can be positively identified. No way to I.D. the ownership of coins and most relics, and the school/park department/lifeguard service lost and found isn't going to want these dirty/crusty items anyway. Leaving these items in the ground doesn't help the "misfortunate" either.

I'm the same way. If there is no way to id who lost it or the person seems to be long dead then what am I to do chase down the current living relative of the decedent? Luckily I don't deal with this much while relic hunting for civil war relics. I have found two rings while detecting and one had initials and the date during the Civil war period but as hard as I tried trying to figure out those initials over the years never panned out and the regiments that were in the area were many so it was a lost hope but at least it was saved from further destruction in the ground.

 

[ScubaDetector]

I'm the same way. If there is no way to id who lost it or the person seems to be long dead then what am I to do chase down the current living relative of the decedent? Luckily I don't deal with this much while relic hunting for civil war relics. I have found two rings while detecting and one had initials and the date during the Civil war period but as hard as I tried trying to figure out those initials over the years never panned out and the regiments that were in the area were many so it was a lost hope but at least it was saved from further destruction in the ground.

I have returned to relives with absolutely no appreciation. it took me 3 years to track down the owner and relatives of a 1947 USAF pilot ring and after I sent it down south, I didn't even get a thank you from them.



That and two men's class rings, one I sent to Pennsylvania and the other to northern Michigan. Funny thing is the person I sent the pilot ring to was also a retired USAF pilot with the same name. His father flew B-17 bombers.

Any rings that the person has died are mine now. I refuse to be out the gold, the time finding the owner and the shipping on top of it. Also if I find the owner to a ring and they are out of the area, I request shipping money up front now. I will give their gold back with no problems. I refuse to be out any more of my personal money though.

 

[franklin]

I returned a class ring to a high school in northern Virginia to the principal to return it to the girl student that lost it down here in southern Virginia. The ring could have been easily traced to the student. I have never heard any reply nor do I know whether the principal kept the ring or had given it to the student. From now on I will do as ScubaDetector said "money up front for the postage and identification before shipping." I like being honest but I like the recipient of a lost item to be honest also.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

I have returned to relives with absolutely no appreciation. it took me 3 years to track down the owner and relatives of a 1947 USAF pilot ring and after I sent it down south, I didn't even get a thank you from them......

..... I have never heard any reply nor do I know whether the principal kept the ring or had given it to the student. .....

Hey scuba and franklin: It's quite common to read good reunion stories on our hobbyist "honorable mention" posts, right ? Thus at first glance, it's a fun sherlock holmes mystery solved. And an honorable thing to return. And the typical story ends in a hug, a thankyou letter, or sometimes even a reward (though none required).

HOWEVER, there are ample stories of exactly what you guys describe too. I too have spent many hours tracking down the owner's of personal things , via initials, dates, serial #'s, etc... Like a Korean war/cold war era silver military ID bracelet. Tracked down to the surviving widow, living in an assisted elderly care type home. The front desk would not cooperate to allow me to phone into the specific room, or to let me know the children's contact info (to get it to whomever in the family I could). So I tell the convelescent home people the story which I would have ASSUMED would raise their sympathy level to understand why I'm trying to track down the man's wife or kid's. But nnneeooohh. Once they heard that "I'd found the man's such & such", they simply say "send it to us, and we'll pass it on to them". Because I think they simply assume this is some sort of prank call, or sales pitch, or ?

I eventually tracked down a daughter's name , and finally got her on the phone. She gave me her address, and said she'd make sure it got to the family's heirlooms. So I mailed it off, and never got so much as a thankyou, no thankyou, or kiss my %#@ in return. Never got reimbursed for my postage, etc...

Another time I heard of a guy who tracked down a ring owner, that was in a city several hour's drive away. After much research had actually pinned down a phone #. Calls the guy, but can only get a sentence or two into it, before the guy hung up on him ! (apparently thinking it was a sales call, or a cruel joke, etc...). Because so many years had passed, that perhaps the ring-owner simply forgot all about ever having lost a ring.

But the md'r persisted and called back, etc.... FINALLY it dawned on the ring owner that "this guy has my ring". So without even-so-much as a thankyou, tells the md'r to "mail it to me". To which the md'r says "send me a SASE and I'll do that". To which the ring owner says "If you don't send it to me, I'm going to call the police". So at that, the md'r now hung up the phone in disgust. But then got the willies thinking "Oh cr*p, are the cops going to show up at my door now ??"

And I know of multiple other stories where it went totally south.

And in the eyes of the law, any of us that FAIL to turn in items worth over $100 (or whatever your state's value-cutoff is for L&F laws) is breaking the law. So despite someone lack of gratitude, we are technically still under an obligation to turn in all jewelry to police station L&F dept's. EVEN jewelry with no markings or initials. These laws were born out of wandering cattle laws in the 1800's, and technically apply to jewelry we find today.

So let me ask you : Whenever you tune in to the beach forum, and see the various show & tell posts of rings found by md'rs in our ranks: How many of them do you think are promptly trotting off to the police station lost & found dept. to carry out this law ?? AT BEST some of us might try our repatration attempts if we find OUR OWN inscribed info (like on class rings). But even then a bunch of us don't even bother with that anymore.

 

[ScubaDetector]

Tom, and that is exactly what I am saying on this whole thread. YOU have EVERY RIGHT to do what you want with your finds and you will still have my respect.

I should have every right to govern myself the way I see fit when it comes to bullies with badges and I should still have others respect.

NOBODY HAS THE RIGHT TO CRAM THEIR POINT OF VIEW DOWN ANYONE ELSE'S THROAT! No matter what the topic.

I have a lot more horror stories. But the successful ones outweigh the bad ones by far. There was another thread on a forum where a guy found a super expensive diamond ring in the dirt. A member of that forum tracked down where he lived and put an ad on Craigslist to try to find the owner for the person that found it! WOW was that way out of line. He even took copies of the pictures. That was a fiasco and a half.

Yes I know the law. I also know what happened when my old boss was trading guns for weed. I was totally investigated also and they didn't get me for a thing, however the detective knew all about me finding gold and told me the law in Michigan. Even had it printed out before the raid to give me!

I flat out told him that I do more to return rings than any police department would ever do and since I am not finding rings in this city, he could do nothing. He was a good guy, we talked and he agreed I did more than the police would.

One thing about posting rings and finds is EVERYTHING is hearsay. I could post a picture of a 100 thousand dollar ring and say I found it. Somebody could call the police and say that their ring is on T-Net. The police could come investigate and ask where I found it. I don't have to answer. It is up to the owner to say where he lost it and prove it was theirs. I could even say, I really didn't find it, I just wanted people to admire some find of mine. (Like that hasn't happened!)

The police shouldn't be able to get a warrant on hearsay. (I say shouldn't but our rights are being trampled on daily)

This is opening a whole new bag of worms!!

The bottom line is you do what you want with your finds and I will do the same. You respect me for giving back thousands of dollars in gold and I respect you for being a pirate. (If that is the case)

RESPECT IS WHAT EVERY FORUM NEEDS, PERIOD.

 

[civil_war22]

I know the law as well at least on my state and more so my area and local counties and have to agree with Scuba. I have metal detected now for over 23 years and in my span of 7 years in law enforcement never offered my services because there is always a catch. There is always someone that will question something or ask you how you came across that. Most of my LE buddies don't even know I do metal detect and the select few that do are the ones that really matter cause they are the ones I trust when SHTF. Just because you have a badge these days doesnt make you above the law or superior to everyone else. I trust no one except a select few.

 

[ScubaDetector]

Just an update for anyone interested. I got two tickets in the mail. One for diving and one for disorderly conduct. HOWEVER, when I got my notice of the court date I got THREE citations. One for diving, one for disorderly conduct and one for diving without a dive flag.

I guess the disorderly conduct is not getting out of the water when told. I believe that was an unlawful demand.

Diving without a flag The Sheriff TOOK MY FLAG. Now that is a hoot right there! Should be interesting to say the least

Diving in a prohibited area. Well since the harbormaster gave me permission, the sheriff has no jurisdiction to take it away.

It should be interesting. I am prepared win or loose I will always think I was right. I have a trial next month. Will let everyone know the outcome so I can be told "I told you so" or whatever else happens. Everyone is welcome to attack or give positive comments.

 

[kingskid1611]

Just an update for anyone interested. I got two tickets in the mail. One for diving and one for disorderly conduct. HOWEVER, when I got my notice of the court date I got THREE citations. One for diving, one for disorderly conduct and one for diving without a dive flag.

I guess the disorderly conduct is not getting out of the water when told. I believe that was an unlawful demand.

Diving without a flag The Sheriff TOOK MY FLAG. Now that is a hoot right there! Should be interesting to say the least

Diving in a prohibited area. Well since the harbormaster gave me permission, the sheriff has no jurisdiction to take it away.

It should be interesting. I am prepared win or loose I will always think I was right. I have a trial next month. Will let everyone know the outcome so I can be told "I told you so" or whatever else happens. Everyone is welcome to attack or give positive comments.

No need to attack. I think its great that you are prepared to stand for your rights. It seems everyone now days just rolls over when confronted. I look forward to your outcome.

 

[Xraywolf]

Hey George , I mean Bob ! Hope all is well with you.

I think I already weighed in here or elsewhere, in case not:

* Cop had every right to order you out of the water IMO. He probably didn't know the status of your alleged permission, or the harbor master might have had a different recollection than you and said you didn't.
Proper procedure would have been to obey, then clarify the situation on land. To simply ignore him was not the thing to do under any circumstances.

* Diving without a flag - If he took it and told you not to go back in and you went back in, that would be another charge.

I can see where you thought you were clear with HM permission, but again, you really should have got out and explained the situation. Sheriff apparently had/has the lawful authority to order you out, hard to see you have a leg to stand on, so to speak.

Your best chance might be if cop doesn't show for the hearing, which happens from time to time. I got out of a 90mph speeding ticket with a no show cop, and that was in a 55 mph zone. Needless to say I was elated, as were the other dozen or so people in the court for tickets from that cop. People started high fiving and judge had to say "Order in the court !".

 

[ScubaDetector]

NOTHING was going to happen on land. He was all mouth. IF I would have got out he would have went away without talking. He never told me not to go back under. He had NO RIGHT to take my flag in the first place. Cops CAN'T just come and take your belongings for NO reason. A gun or a knife yes. A harmless dive flag NO. I had two knifes on me and I told them I did. They didn't bother with them. Cops can't legally take your belongings period.

 

[bc5391]

Having worked for a school system for 8 years, I learned to get everything in writing, it always seemed no one remembered saying what I remembered hearing. It was always nice to throw back an email, or document to prove what was said.

 

[ScubaDetector]

Having worked for a school system for 8 years, I learned to get everything in writing, it always seemed no one remembered saying what I remembered hearing. It was always nice to throw back an email, or document to prove what was said.

Not that easy when you just came out of the water and talked to him while holding the side of his boat! But you have a point. HOWEVER, I learned some more info that I refuse to let the lurkers know about the situation. I will let everyone know the outcome but I won't let them know what I have learned. None of them deserve respect from me.

 

[civil_war22]

Not that easy when you just came out of the water and talked to him while holding the side of his boat! But you have a point. HOWEVER, I learned some more info that I refuse to let the lurkers know about the situation. I will let everyone know the outcome but I won't let them know what I have learned. None of them deserve respect from me.

ScubaDetector I know where you are coming from. I've been in the same boat per say. Keep your head up and don't let them trip you up. You got this. Remember you used to use the same techniques as them but with age comes experience and you can work your way around it. They don't always win

 

[Honest Samuel]

Good luck to ScubaDetector, keep diving.

 

[ScubaDetector]

Good luck to ScubaDetector, keep diving.

Thank you sir and I will. I am even going back to Belle Isle next year. I REFUSE to be intimidated by a jerk of a sheriff officer. They will have to take me to jail in full scuba gear if they push me too hard!