Vallecito Station

[Vince in So.Cal]

Does anyone know where the original building (Vallecito Station) stood before it was recreated in the 30's to where it sits today off of S-2?

 

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[stefen]

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[stefen]

Vince,

Beleive that the Vallecito Stage Station (Butterfield Stage Route) was rebuilt in-place, using its original on-site salvaged materials.

Might try this source for any additional information Archaeology, History and Museums

 

[Vince in So.Cal]

Vince,

Beleive that the Vallecito Stage Station (Butterfield Stage Route) was rebuilt in-place, using its original on-site salvaged materials.

Might try this source for any additional information Archaeology, History and Museums

I've been there a few times .... nice place to overnight, nice camp spots. There is a plaque there that states the station was moved from its original home to where it sits now. I was just wondering where its original home was. They have a spooky little cemetary there too. Vince.

 

[Mackaydon]

Spooky, indeed.
The cemetery, also referred to "Campo Santo" (Holy Ground), lies about 100ft east of the station. Only three people were buried there.
Don..

 

[Vince in So.Cal]

Yea I've been to the cemetery, it is little. And quite spooky late at night. Last time I was there I was told the story of the preverbial "Lady in White" that haunts the cemetary. Something about a lady that was Ill while making the crossing with her husband, and he left her at the station while he went for help (in the form of a Doctor I would imagine), but when he got back she had ex-pired!. So she is suppose to haunt the cemetary and the station.
now .. I'm a treaure hunter not so much of a 'ghost hunter' and I dont believe in ghost and spirits and such... (Im originally from the 'show me' state), so I gots to see it before I believs it. But I did sit around at the cemetary totaly alone from around midnight till about 1:30am ... just heard coyotes, .. and saw lots of stars. heh. Its a nice place to camp though, in the off season.
HH
Vince

 

[Tom_in_CA]

If the cemetary hasn't moved (which it probably hasn't), then I'd assume if the re-creation (ie.: new spot) is 100 ft. away, then presumably the "old spot" is also closeby. Because you'd think the original station and cemetary would not have been too far apart from each other. And thus a person could maybe just walk the desert all around the cemetary, in all directions, looking for tell-tale indications: a high spot on the ground (adobe melt), or shards, glass, rust, etc... on the desert floor.

I had always assumed as stefen, that the '30s re-creation was done on the foot-print of the old. Even to the point of incorporating the still-existing walls (at that time) into the new walls. There are photographs of the old ruins, prior to the preservation attempt. And they are very discernable high walls of adobe, still visible in the '20s etc.... So I find it hard to believe they just dissapeared, or wouldn't have been the current building as you now see it (shored back up from what was still there). But if you say that a sign says that the whole thing was "moved", then that's news to me. I'd always thought this was NOT a modern replica re-creation, and that it was the original, albeit all gussied up , new roof, etc.... made out of the original ruins as their starting point.

 

[Vince in So.Cal]

Through the years, the Vallecito station was occupied by one tenant after another but it was not until James E. Mason (the younger) that the valley and had a legal owner. In 1884 Mason received patent to 160 acres. that included the old station. Little owner Christian F. Holland deeded six acres. in 1934 to San Diego County to begin the restoration process of the crumbling stage station. Today, one room and its roof are parts of the original structure.


Location: Vallecito Stage Station County Park, on County Rd S2 (P.M. 34.7), 3.7 mi NW of Agua Caliente Springs


Phone: San Diego County Parks and Recreation Department. (858) 565-3600

Hours:

Kind of confusing.... I will research more.
HH Vince



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[Vince in So.Cal]

San Diego County, California

Vallecito and Agua Caliente Regional Parks are among 30 facilities administered by California's San Diego County. They are located only 6 miles from each other in the Carrizo Valley Region of Anza-Borrego Desert State Park.

At Vallecito, the perfect oasis of "little valley," as its Spanish name is translated, has been preserved as a a 71-acre county park built around a reconstruction of the historic Vallecito Stage Station.



Ok so it is a reconstruction... but is it on the same place as the old station?

 

[Tom_in_CA]

....Ok so it is a reconstruction... but is it on the same place as the old station?

I always thought it was. Can you find the on-line text somewhere that says it was moved, to its current location, in the 1930s? Or that the original structure was "nearby", or something to that effect?

Try this: if you go to any number of websites that talk about the station, you'll find no shortage of old black & white pix that exist of people who took photos of it before the reconstruction. Right? And you'll see that at that time (up to the early '30s), it was still sets of still fairly high walls of adobe, that were nowhere near being melted down to indiscernable. D/t the dry climate (that was apparently kind to adobe d/t less moisture), the walls were still there.

And no, I highly doubt they would have moved adobe walls to a new location (in the fashion of house-moving, let's say). Because I would think that ... unlike a wooden house that can be lifted up, moved, etc... , that it would be next to impossible to move an adobe structure. And......... why would they? Why NOT just rebuild it, incorporating the walls that existed, shoring them up, repairing, and working with what was already there?

So I think the current is in the exact foot-print of the old. Unless you have some text that says something different, please link us.

 

[Vince in So.Cal]

yes I agree with you that they most likely could not move the adobe. I did see a picture from 2010 of 2 people standing next to what they said (in writing) was the remnants of the old station. The picture shows a small section of adobe wall with no ceiling... for some reason I could not get the picture to follow me here. I have a little time right now (on my lunch break) to see if I can find anything else out.
HH
Vince.

 

[Vince in So.Cal]

in 1934 to San Diego County to begin the restoration process of the crumbling stage station. Today, one room and its roof are parts of the original structure.

Okay so that sounds like it's the same place but not the same building.... except the one room and roof. Perhaps the pictures I saw and spoke about on the above post was the remnants of the butterfield station?
HH
Vince

 

[Vince in So.Cal]

http://mydesertmagazine.com/files/195709-DesertMagazine-1957-September.pdf


Found a drawing of the station before resteration/ recreation was done Although........ it was rebuilt in 37, the desert magazine was issued in 1957, so the magazine must of gotten the drawing from somewhere... or ... just drew it themselves, as the station would have been reconstructed in 1957.
I will see if I can find my digital photos of the place later this evening.
HH
Vince.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Vince, if you search google images, (or simply google search the web) using the right combinations of words, you will find pix of it that passer-bys took in the 1910s, 20s, and '30s before reconstruction. And certainly the historic preservation people, prior to their late 1930s reconstruction, would also have taken pix (to document their work, and so forth). Not sure if it was as nice and full as the drawing in that 1957 magazine depicts, but yes .... there were good high walls still there, prior to the re-construction (albeit beginning to melt and the tops, and perhaps missing the roof, and so forth).

But in any case, I believe your quote answers the matter. That if one room and such are from the original, then it seems to me that it's on the exact same foot-print, and merely incorporated original walls in the re-do, whenever possible.

Have you, or can anyone, find something to the contrary, which says that the current location, is not the original location? That is, that it was: "moved" ?

 

[63bkpkr]

Vince, this might be a real stretch however, here goes: The USGS has a lot of historical maps, some with latitude/longitude, some with other location markings and an 1800's to early 1900's map of the area may have the station as well as the cemetery showing. From the map you might be able to confirm the location of the station. I believe these maps are online and free to search and print.

Hope it helps,...............63bkpkr

 

[Vince in So.Cal]

In my research, I have found that Valliceto Station is not made of adobe ..but is made of sod. I had to search what each are...( I had the general idea, but)... so adobe is clay-sand-mud-fiber like sticks or twigs.... and sod is grass(es) with the root system still attached with the dirt it was grown in, scaled out of the ground in layers. Adobe is formed into bricks or building blocks and left to dry in the sun for about a month... by reading about the "sodbusters" of the great plains and praires they had to rebuild most of their structures every year (sod), but I believe there are adobe buildings that are standing like 100 years or more, so I would figure adobe to be the more resulent material. I guess its where you settled back then on which building materials you used. Interesting. now if I can figure out how to copy -paste google-earth pages in here I can show you why I asked about the relocation in the first place.. lol.. yea im still learning this computer magic.
HH
Vince.

 

[4x4x4]

 

[pegleglooker]

It's kinda of odd that the plaque states it was originally a sod structure, maybe it's me, but I don't think there is a lot of sod "material" in the desert. Adobe yes, sod no... here's a link on sod buildings History of Sod Houses - Shoddy Soddy Homes for Settlers

 

[Kauziamos]

I just visited the station a couple days ago and I second Tom. Before I read anything, I looked at some of the historic photos and assumed they just fixed what remained. I also noted some holes/cracks near the base, and was suprised to see it seemed somewhat hollow and grass filled. Sod indeed!!!....and on a side note, PLL, I've read many of your posts, (especially about the ship) and, well, if you're ever up for a hike, I'd consider it an honor to get boots on the ground with you, do some ear bending...one more aside-I also hiked up to eagle rock near warner springs-anyone have any stories about that place?!