Who came first? Copper Culture or Burial Mounds.

[Rocsteddie]

IDK. I have both here in Northern Minnesota. Carved Ornament Stone I found about 100 yards east of Esqugama Mound(Fur Trade maybe) and the Copper Culture Socketed Blade about 150 yards northeast of mound.
Thanks for any information.

Here are pics of mound. May or may not help.
I been fishing with this stone for a few years now and still no bites just a little nibble now and then.
At this point guessing would be interesting.
Carved Ornament Soapstone Mold.
View attachment 1299230 View attachment 1299229

 

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[arrow86]

Both incredible finds that ornament stone is really cool I can't imagine finding something like that. Have you found any other stone artifacts around there? Would love to see them

 

[joshuaream]

The copper piece is older, but certainly could have been used by mound builders.

The other piece looks like some type of mold, I'd guess it's more recent that fur trade.

 

[Rocsteddie]

Dang I wish. Not yet but still looking with high hopes. The stone I found while cleaning up after a wind storm with a pitchfork on my property. Note two white marks on human figure where I hit with pitchfork. Excavated a 20ft radius around area and found nothing but rusty cans, glass and rocks. Nothing related to stone. I believe that someone may have dropped it traveling through the area. Thanks for your interest arrow86.

 

[scruggs]

Interesting finds....very nice!!!

 

[unclemac]

is the figure stone of copper? I am not understanding the fur trade connection...does anyone have examples of this as a trade item?

 

[Rocsteddie]

is the figure stone of copper? I am not understanding the fur trade connection...does anyone have examples of this as a trade item?

I've try to send reply.

The figure is carved into the soapstone. Here are two examples of castings made for trading. Small lead brooches(these were gifted to me and found in the Manitoba area)and human figure(I personally made this one) may have been traded for weapons, food, and clothing.

 

[RGINN]

Pretty cool. They don't appear to be related to indigenous people though. Some other culture maybe.

 

[tamrock]

Way cool. That stone is definitely a mysterious item. It looks like a casting mold.

 

[releventchair]

is the figure stone of copper? I am not understanding the fur trade connection...does anyone have examples of this as a trade item?

The mold is of stone.
The ornaments produced from it are similar /match some that were in use during the fur trade.

 

[releventchair]

Who came first ,copper culture or mound builders?

A great question ,but I don't have a solid answer.
Both have been traced back to around 5000 years ago.
My guess would be copper was worked first before the luxury of mound building.

Copper does not really trump certain stone...and stone may have been returned to as a source when copper became used more for decorative purposes during the copper cultures hey-days..
In the Mi. copper range stone hammers were used to remove copper. A result of the qualities of materials vs. the use of the tool(s).
Isolation ,away from quality lithic material, may have factored in the use of copper for edged tools despite travel and trade networks , both a source of material.

That socketed knife is incredible.(I drooled previously over the stone mold) I've seen examples of smaller knives of similar design N.E. of you , yet thought they were of iron with the socket edges nearly /or touching, now wish I'd asked what they were made of..
Those trade routes on both ends along the N.W. edge of Superior used during the fur trade may well relate.
Of course those routes likely followed older trade routes....
Your knife is pretty advanced in working copper, one of multiple earlier simpler designs had a fold each side rather than a worked socket.
Your mound area is definitely in the range of the copper culture and trade, and moundbuilders ,though those building mounds cultures varied over time.
Seasonal moves, at least of certain groups of groups still occurred, but mounds must have begun when less nomadic culture and stable food sources allowed the luxury of time and labor.