camping on someone elses mining claim

[oldhdrider]

camping on someone else's mining claim

Morn'n folks.

This weekend my wife and I went camping to an area we had not been to before in Idaho. Beautiful country there. As we are looking for a nice camping spot on forest service land we see that about every spot to camp along the river is a posted mining claim. Now, I do pay attention to signage I do not want to trespass but when we got out and looked around the area of the 'claimed' spots (on forest service ground) I can not see any evidence of any work being done for a very, very long time. Some of the signage is relatively new and some signs are so old you can not read them. I believe that a filed mining claim is for the mineral rights only and but still public land. Please correct me if I am wrong about that. The camps I looked at on the claims are being used often but again, no work or any sign of work being done. I do not know if the people that are using the camp are the folks that have the claim or if they are Joe Citizen just using the camping spot.

Help me out here. Can I use a camping spot on a filed mining claim if no one is using the spot? If I was camping on a posted mining claim and a guy pulled up and said the spot was his mining claim and he was here to camp and mine I would pull up stakes and move because I think he would have first dibbs. Right? But lookie here.....I believe some of these posted claims are just being used as a personal/private camping/hunting spot to which I have an issue with. "No Trespassing" signs are a whole different animal and I respect those.

Appreciate any input, especially from owners of mining claims but don't want to get into a piss'n match. Much respect!

 

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[aa battery]

umm i would move on. Here in ca. a man was shot in mariposa for about the same thing.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Help me out here. Can I use a camping spot on a filed mining claim if no one is using the spot? If I was camping on a posted mining claim and a guy pulled up and said the spot was his mining claim and he was here to camp and mine I would pull up stakes and move because I think he would have first dibbs. Right? But lookie here.....I believe some of these posted claims are just being used as a personal/private camping/hunting spot to which I have an issue with. "No Trespassing" signs are a whole different animal and I respect those.

You're correct. But have you heard the term "dead right?" I don't know how claims work (we have no such animal in New York) so I can only give the human nature side of the consideration.

You're pissing off someone far from civilization and witnesses who has a gun and a shovel and likely is suspicious of you at first contact. Your call.

If all you have are fishing poles and butterfly nets likely all will be well. If you have detectors, shovels, pans, etc. Not so much.


Suggest you call one of the regional reps at the end of this document.

http://www.blm.gov/style/medialib/b...ile.dat/Web Final bluebook rev _Jan 2010_.pdf

 

[oldhdrider]

Serious?!! Shot for camping on a filed mining claim on forest service or BLM ground? wow! Do you think there might have been something else going on there? thanks for the reply aa.

 

[mpwuzhere]

Not sure what part of Idaho you're in....but there are some shady folks up here in North Idaho....went mtn biking up above Bayview and stopped a guy for directions....he had to put his handgun to the side and his beer to find a map.

I wouldn't take the chance.

 

[oldhdrider]

Thanks Charlie! I'll be using this link a lot.

You have some good points. I'd hate to be included in that 'dead right' area.

You're correct. But have you heard the term "dead right?" I don't know how claims work (we have no such animal in New York) so I can only give the human nature side of the consideration.

You're pissing off someone far from civilization and witnesses who has a gun and a shovel and likely is suspicious of you at first contact. Your call.

If all you have are fishing poles and butterfly nets likely all will be well. If you have detectors, shovels, pans, etc. Not so much.


Suggest you call one of the regional reps at the end of this document.

http://www.blm.gov/style/medialib/blm/id/energy/mining/download_documents.Par.83446.File.dat/Web%20Final%20bluebook%20rev%20_Jan%202010_.pdf

 

[aa battery]

Serious?!! Shot for camping on a filed mining claim on forest service or BLM ground? wow! Do you think there might have been something else going on there? thanks for the reply aa.

could have been claim jumping

 

[RGINN]

oldhdrider, I live in the mineral belt in Colorado, and many of the places I camp have active claims. They're claiming the mineral rights only. If it's Federal Land and open to camping, you can camp there. Here in Colorado, there will be a No Trespassing sign on privately owned property. Where you get into trouble on posted claims is if you start digging around or collecting rocks. That Prospectors show on the TV, up on Mount Antero, I walked around on some of those spots shown on the program without a problem. Not really a place I would want to camp though. Had I have started diggin around, I would have been in trouble and probably been on the next episode of 'Prospectors-Claim Jumpers'.

 

[hvacker]

I mined a bit last year at Crystal Peak near Divide Co. Both claim owners were carrying side arms. I think because of the shows RGINN mentioned the traffic is getting heavy.
A claim is not a no trespassing sign. Just leave the minerals there but some claim owners can be very possessive. The guy on the neighboring claim was like that.

 

[bigfoot1]

you have every right to camp on a mining claim.I have owned several.If a claim owner impedes your right to tresspass he may lose his claim.Only a patented claim can be fenced and no tresspassing be posted and inforced.You know its one of those because its fenced and prolly has a homestead on it.

If a simple placer or lode claim owner would try to intimidate me I would call the forestry at once.he will be escorted way.There would be no public land at all in many western states if this was not true.And this comes from a claim owner many times over.I always welcomed campers and have given many a permission to pan...lessons too.Only a wannabe poser cowboy jerk would act differantly,its the largest print on their claim responsibility paperwork.

nobody gets a deed for a simple mineral rights claim...just dont mine it.everything else goes

cheers

 

[JackalopeZL1]

First Off someone having a gun while out in the outdoors does not make them a shady person.

Second As stated a having a mining claim means just that. You have a right to the minerals only.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

reply

Serious?!! Shot for camping on a filed mining claim on forest service or BLM ground? ...

Yup, it must be serious. And someone can probably come up with a "scary link" to such a thing, I suppose. Even those claims with the faded signage, and having no evidence of anyone being there for a long time, are merely decoy settings. What you don't realize, is men are hiding/lurking behind trees, waiting to jump out and shoot you!! The claims/areas only LOOK neglected. That's part of the decoy to make you think you can probably camp or walk there.

.... Do you think there might have been something else going on there?....

Nope. Only camping. And for that matter, how, pray-tell, did you get close enough to read the signs you allude to ? Don't tell us you were (gasp) walking there ?? You risked getting shot on the spot!. Also: Arrested, equipment confiscated, jailed, fined, etc.... So please, no more stepping off the sidewalk. Tsk tsk.

 

[oldhdrider]

Morn'n Tom.

Yup, it must be serious. And someone can probably come up with a "scary link" to such a thing, I suppose. Even those claims with the faded signage, and having no evidence of anyone being there for a long time, are merely decoy settings. What you don't realize, is men are hiding/lurking behind trees, waiting to jump out and shoot you!! The claims/areas only LOOK neglected. That's part of the decoy to make you think you can probably camp or walk there.



Nope. Only camping. And for that matter, how, pray-tell, did you get close enough to read the signs you allude to ? Don't tell us you were (gasp) walking there ?? You risked getting shot on the spot!. Also: Arrested, equipment confiscated, jailed, fined, etc.... So please, no more stepping off the sidewalk. Tsk tsk.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

oldhrider, I hope you can tell I was speaking-in-jest.

 

[TheHunterGT]

I don't have any scary links.....but I got a doozy of a story.

12-13 years ago here in Colorado...one of my friends father shot a claim owner after he was drawn and fired upon by said claim owner. Luckily the claim owner missed....and my friends father did not. He hit the claim owner in the leg and abdomen. The man survived so no dreadful ending here.

They were both backpacking and fishing (no prospecting tools whatsoever) and stumbled across this guys claim in the deep mountains. Next thing they know the ground it ripping up around them and bullets are whizzing by. Guy had a 6-shot revolver and unloaded all 6 and went for his re-load....friends father drew and fired during his reload. Claim owner didn't even go for cover.....just stood there firing like a madman they said. Tons of alcohol bottles found on-site....empty and full.

Both men were cuffed and taken into custody as is normal procedure when you fire upon somebody....self-defense or not. Friends father was released and cleared of all charges X amount of time later (unsure of time spent in custody).....the other man was arrested on attempted murder which eventually got reduced to some lesser charge. Dude spent like 18 months in jail and was released. Doubtful if he will ever own a claim again.

That being said...I carry 100% of the time in the hills. I also still camp in claimed areas here in Colorado as 99% of the claim owners are great people and not mental. There are so many claims it would be impossible to navigate around all of them in some areas. Like stated above...it is for the mineral rights only.....camp away. Just be careful.

 

[oldhdrider]

Ya, I was pretty sure. I like to start the day with a good chuckle.

Are you a miner or more of a detectorist?

Btw, I am not a new guy and I have been playing 'off' the sidewalk for a while now.
Grew up in Trinity Co. in the 50's and 60's. Well, actually, if you ask my wife, I haven't grown up yet.

oldhrider, I hope you can tell I was speaking-in-jest.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

I don't have any scary links.....but I got a doozy of a story.....

Huntergt: No doubt, doozy stories exist to add merit to just about any caution level someone can dream up. There's no doubt stories of persons getting "roughed up" by "over-zealous" LEO or claim-owners, etc.... I even have a link to a guy getting a traffic ticket for eating a hamburger while driving!

So there comes a point, where ....... if you even want to leave your front door in the morning, you have to "take a risk". Ie.: a bear might attack you. Or a plane might crash on you. Or you might get sued for someone who takes offense at the color of your shirt, etc....

 

[oldhdrider]

Great story! My wife and I carry also. We didn't always but in 2000, for 6 years, we lived remote in Idaho. 6 months of the year it was snowmobile only to the cabin. Just kinda got into the habit. I don't think we would ever be the first to pull a weapon though. Well, guess I can't really say that cuz you just never know. I see in your avatar info you have a Scorpion and pro-pointer. Me too. Yes, I had it last weekend but it never left the camper. It took some time before I 'learned' it. Never have found any gold but I've used it for coin/relic hunting with good results. Have a Prizm V also. Like it. Good coin shooter.

I don't have any scary links.....but I got a doozy of a story.

12-13 years ago here in Colorado...one of my friends father shot a claim owner after he was drawn and fired upon by said claim owner. Luckily the claim owner missed....and my friends father did not. He hit the claim owner in the leg and abdomen. The man survived so no dreadful ending here.

They were both backpacking and fishing (no prospecting tools whatsoever) and stumbled across this guys claim in the deep mountains. Next thing they know the ground it ripping up around them and bullets are whizzing by. Guy had a 6-shot revolver and unloaded all 6 and went for his re-load....friends father drew and fired during his reload. Claim owner didn't even go for cover.....just stood there firing like a madman they said. Tons of alcohol bottles found on-site....empty and full.

Both men were cuffed and taken into custody as is normal procedure when you fire upon somebody....self-defense or not. Friends father was released and cleared of all charges X amount of time later (unsure of time spent in custody).....the other man was arrested on attempted murder which eventually got reduced to some lesser charge. Dude spent like 18 months in jail and was released. Doubtful if he will ever own a claim again.

That being said...I carry 100% of the time in the hills. I also still camp in claimed areas here in Colorado as 99% of the claim owners are great people and not mental. There are so many claims it would be impossible to navigate around all of them in some areas. Like stated above...it is for the mineral rights only.....camp away. Just be careful.

 

[DizzyDigger]

You have every legal right to camp on that BLM land so long as
you are not prospecting or even collecting rocks.

A "Claim" is solely a legal claim to the minerals on that particular
piece of dirt.

If you have found a spot that you want to regularly camp, and it
is also someones mining claim, then I would suggest you look up
the claim owner, contact them and advise them that you are strictly
camping there for the beautiful surroundings, and aren't the least
bit interested in the minerals there.

It's really not the claim owners choice...they don't own the property.

 

[TheHunterGT]

Great story! My wife and I carry also. We didn't always but in 2000, for 6 years, we lived remote in Idaho. 6 months of the year it was snowmobile only to the cabin. Just kinda got into the habit. I don't think we would ever be the first to pull a weapon though. Well, guess I can't really say that cuz you just never know. I see in your avatar info you have a Scorpion and pro-pointer. Me too. Yes, I had it last weekend but it never left the camper. It took some time before I 'learned' it. Never have found any gold but I've used it for coin/relic hunting with good results. Have a Prizm V also. Like it. Good coin shooter.

I would die a happy man if I never have to use it other than a target shoot. I just want to be left alone when I go in the deep woods....so I understand what the claim owners are feeling. But ending a vibrant life over mineral rights is just bonkers to me. I'll never understand it.

Scored my Scorpion on a Craigslist trade. Still learning it too as I am brand new to this hobby. So far so good...not overly complicated as many make it out to be. Mine ground balances quite well from what I see. Even had a vet take a look and he said it GB's better than other Scorps he has seen. Perhaps I have a later model? IDK. Still learning the disc for coin shooting....so for now I dig it all. No gold to speak of with it....just in my pan and sluice box. But I'll keep trying!

Its all for hobby for me. Had 9 surgeries and 14 stents from my heart to left knee in 2014....this hobby is keeping me on my feet and active and hopefully alive!!! Used to be a IT guy who sat behind a PC for 10 hours a day at work and then another 8 hours at home for fun. No more of that! Chose detecting and prospecting as my new hobby and hope to have a Fisher F-19 for me and the wife by end of year. Pink for her and green for me.