cleaning out folks house

[outlaws15]

Hello everyone:
Found these in my parents house while cleaning it out. Up in the garage storage area. I have no clue what I have here just really think it is a cool find. I live in St. Louis MO and only guessing they might have came from around here or St. James, MO.
Thought maybe someone could tell me something about the arrowheads or other objects in picture.
Thanks

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[Garscale]

Thanks twitch, I did start a new thread. Can I copy your post and add it to new thread?

Please copy mine as well since I replied to uim

 

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[Twitch]

Thanks twitch, I did start a new thread. Can I copy your post and add it to new thread?

I already added them. Thanks.

 

[outlaws15]

I understand this is another nice piece that was in the collection.
Lost lake-beviled

 

[Garscale]

That one looks authentic in every way. Big nice example too

 

[sandchip]

QUOTE=Garscale;6542176]Number 6 looks like a red river knife to me. Any Cody is a good find![/QUOTE]

It definitely is not an Edgefield. Offset and bevel on one side do not alone make one.

Should "river staining" or "creek staining" of an artifact be treated as patina: something to be preserved and not cleaned off. Or is it acceptable to clean off that staining to reveal the beauty of the underlying chert?

The black creek/river scum is not patina and should come off. To leave it on really robs you of the beauty of the stone that lies beneath. My technique is to grab a wad of clean, wet sand and sandwich the point between my palms and scrub away. These would've been some butt fugly points if I'd left them "as was". The long one was so encrusted with a heavy, black scum that I really couldn't tell if it was a point or just a piece of wood or rubber until I tapped it with my fingernail. The sandbar scrubbing was the only cleaning it ever got. Wish I had had a phone or camera way back then to have taken some before pictures.

 

[Tdog]

It definitely is not an Edgefield. Offset and bevel on one side do not alone make one.

(1.) What disqualifies it as being an Edgefield? (2.) What traits define an Edgefield?

 

[Tdog]

The black creek/river scum is not patina and should come off. To leave it on really robs you of the beauty of the stone that lies beneath. My technique is to grab a wad of clean, wet sand and sandwich the point between my palms and scrub away.

I agree with sandchip here. If they were mine, I'd make up a batch of hot water (not scalding) and dish soap and clean them with a toothbrush. If you do it in a metal or porcelain sink, put a hand towel in the bottom to prevent chipping and breaking in case you drop one. Don't put them all in there at once. Clean them one at at time and lay them on a dry towel to dry. You can obviously dry them one at a time as well.

 

[outlaws15]

I reread twitch`s post and I should have started a new thread for the lost lake, you guys/gals think it is to late?
Are you referring to the lost lake that I could clean?
Earlier in this thread I have #9 two questions on this one
1) should I clean
2) is this a paleo blade, ovid blade ( maybe 12,000 yrs old)

 

[Tdog]

I reread twitch`s post and I should have started a new thread for the lost lake, you guys/gals think it is to late?
Are you referring to the lost lake that I could clean?
Earlier in this thread I have #9 two questions on this one
1) should I clean
2) is this a paleo blade, ovid blade ( maybe 12,000 yrs old)

Not too late IMO. I'd clean 'em all but the "Folsom".

 

[Garscale]

I reread twitch`s post and I should have started a new thread for the lost lake, you guys/gals think it is to late?
Are you referring to the lost lake that I could clean?
Earlier in this thread I have #9 two questions on this one
1) should I clean
2) is this a paleo blade, ovid blade ( maybe 12,000 yrs old)

I told you earlier that I think it is paleo and it looked like twitch agreed in hand. Hard to be sure. Several cultures made oval blades.

I would clean the creek stained artifacts. Like Tdog said the Folsom looking item doesn't need cleaning and I certainly wouldn't do so before having it examined. I don't know where it came from but Definately not the same place as the others.

 

[sandchip]

(1.) What disqualifies it as being an Edgefield? (2.) What traits define an Edgefield?

The base and the size. An Edgefield is a very large side notched, uniface blade, early Archaic. They look like a huge uniface Bolen that was resharpened only on one side. Many end up small in length, but the base remains large with the beveled side almost approaching horizontal (but not quite). I've seen some late stage examples found by folks that nearly discarded them, thinking they were just a broke point. I had a couple of broken ones from the same site as this rare first stage example, but don't know what become of them. All with the same characteristic base. This one is a big'un, but Larry Meadows, for those who know the gentleman, has one even larger, the biggest one I've seen. I still contend that they were heavy duty butchering tools, the unbeveled side for separating large joints, the beveled for scraping meat from the large bones, but that's just my opinion, and y'all know what that's worth.

 

[Tdog]

Thanks sandchip. That cleared it up nicely. I'll try to remember and apply everything I learned from your response.

 

[sandchip]

Here's how the resharpening sequence would progress. You'll see them in every stage shown.

 

[sandchip]

I agree with sandchip here. If they were mine, I'd make up a batch of hot water (not scalding) and dish soap and clean them with a toothbrush. If you do it in a metal or porcelain sink, put a hand towel in the bottom to prevent chipping and breaking in case you drop one. Don't put them all in there at once. Clean them one at at time and lay them on a dry towel to dry. You can obviously dry them one at a time as well.

The creek scum in your area may come off with that approach, but the stuff around here will wear you out. I've tried all kinds of soaking and scrubbing on bottles with the same scum, but found that soaking them in muriatic acid for a day or two is all that works. Since we can't soak points in acid, the wet sand method is all that I have found to work. Of course, the wet sand method doesn't need to be used on glass, either. By no means dissing your suggestion, Tdog; just passing along all that seems to work for me around here.

 

[Garscale]

I'm pretty sure that scraper is a worked down Scotty to end up red river knife

 

[outlaws15]

Yes, Garscale u did. I just forgot and went back and found it.
Seeing twitch look over the collection my wife said that really got my attention and she hadn't seen that since I belonged to the Ozark Cave Diving Alliance (OCDA) for hobbies outside the house
I tried so hard to get the pics in a better order.

8 is probably a nondescript wood working tool. Basically a flint adz.

9 is a super interesting blade. I really can't see the flaking well enough but it hints at being a paleo item. Might not be able to id it from pics. Do the edges around the base and maybe one Inch up each side feel intentionally dulled?

 

[Garscale]

Very nice blade. No way to be definitive on it but my gut feel is paleo.

 

[joshuaream]

I'm pretty sure that scraper is a worked down Scotty to end up red river knife

Looking back at the post, I think you are right. It looks like a Red River to me.

Edgefield knives always reminded me of Albany scrapers and knives from your neck of the woods. (Bigger, But similar angle and bevel.)

 

[Garscale]

Looking back at the post, I think you are right. It looks like a Red River to me.

Edgefield knives always reminded me of Albany scrapers and knives from your neck of the woods. (Bigger, But similar angle and bevel.)

Yep. Albany knives are generally associated with The San Patrice cultures but Wilson made them as well. Identical to the Edgefield and larger than San Patrice. Gault has them really early and staying around all the way to the end of paleo .