Dig it all, Find it deep.....

[Got Metal?]

What MD+coil would you use if you were searching deep in soil and dug up every single signal?

Thanks!

 

[Jason in Enid]

Depends on the size and type of objects you are looking to dig up.

 

[pennyfarmer]

What do you mean every signal? That is a huge task even in your average front yard. Do you mean every signal in all metal mode? Every variance in threshold? I don't think I have every signal dug in my yard though I ought to.

 

[Swartzie]

You would want a machine that will run in all metal. When I say that I mean a "true" all metal mode and not just zero discrimination. An all metal mode will go deep and will hit on very small targets. I use a Tesoro Tejon in all metal mode for hunting Native American artifacts near local waterways. The targets are far and few between. All metal is perfect for this type of hunting. Here's a little discussion on all metal vs. zero discrimination: All Metal mode VS Disc Mode; A valid question (I hope)

-Swartzie

 

[luvsdux]

There definitely is a difference between all metal and no discrimination on many detectors. Often they're designed to disc out small iron etc. even at 0 discrimination whereas true all metal responds to any metal within reach of the coil.
luvdux

 

[Got Metal?]

Thanks for the replies. What my question was based on is if I wanted to dig up every signal I get, what metal detector would get the most hits. I suppose it's an exercise in futility in some locations, but in areas without a lot of junk I would prefer a machine that would find the smallest and deepest objects possible. I also have this feeling that many people have the itch to dig up every hit. I might be one of them. So, does that type of person really need a machine with high end discrimination features?

 

[Jason in Enid]

But you didn't say WHAT you were hunting. There are completely different machines depending on whether you want to hunt jewelry at the beach, coins at the park, relics in the field, or caches.

 

[Digger2]

Got Metal? You have a very good question. I am also seeking the answer to this question, because in some areas, it is worthwhile to dig up every single hit. I don't think air tests on coils is a true indication of how deep a detector will go in a given soil.
Some detectors will go deeper in sand others in highly mineralized soil. Maybe this is why a lot of detectorists have several MDs, who knows?.
In old yards discrimination is not a desirous thing, so to 'dig it all', all metal mode is probably the way to go. I think I have passed up many a good targets with discrimination masking the signal or me mis-interpreting it.

I am looking at the White V3i right now, but I have a lot more researching to do.

Roy

 

[Frankn]

Well you really didn't say what target you were after so I will base this answer your statement, small target, down deep. Here it is. Get a PI detector. It will go the deepest for small objects. Frank...

 

[Got Metal?]

Sorry, you are right. I neglected a specific target type because I was just thinking about a MD that worked reasonably well on everything, including deep objects. If I were to be a little more specific, something that would detect relics, coins and jewellery reasonably well in soil. Not something specific for gold flakes or nuggets.

 

[Rogerv]

What do you mean every signal? That is a huge task even in your average front yard. Do you mean every signal in all metal mode? Every variance in threshold? I don't think I have every signal dug in my yard though I ought to.

I have been told by many if you Discriminate pull-tabs you also miss most rings When in doubt dig it out

 

[doc-d]

Informative, thank ya'll

 

[Jason in Enid]

I have been told by many if you Discriminate pull-tabs you also miss most rings When in doubt dig it out

There is a WORLD of difference between "digging it all" (EVERYTHING including iron) and digging aluminum and better signals.

 

[Got Metal?]

Sounds like a PI detector would fit the bill. Now, what I am curious about is a PI versus a Minelab FBS machine. How do they compare? Obviously the PI machines can be far more expensive, but do they really offer that much more? In mineralized soil or saltwater/wet ocean sand, perhaps. What about other soil types?

Also, the price difference in the various PI machines is quite dramatic. Probably not suitable for discussion in this thread, but I am left wondering why.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Sounds like a PI detector would fit the bill. Now, what I am curious about is a PI versus a Minelab FBS machine. How do they compare? Obviously the PI machines can be far more expensive, but do they really offer that much more? In mineralized soil or saltwater/wet ocean sand, perhaps. What about other soil types?

Also, the price difference in the various PI machines is quite dramatic. Probably not suitable for discussion in this thread, but I am left wondering why.

got-metal, you say:

"Sounds like a PI detector would fit the bill"

I suppose you are basing this conclusion on what Frankn and others have said (about "all-metal" and "deepest", etc...)? If so, sure! go have a ball. Get a pulse (like ones used for the beach) and "dig all". And yes, you "will not miss anything" as others here have said. And yes you will "dig all". You will go deep and be able to tackle the nastiest of minerals. Woohoo! what more could you ask for .... RIGHT!?? In fact, why stop there?? You want to go REALLY DEEP ? Go get yourself a Minelab nugget hunter machine. And I guarantee you you will not miss anything. And can get a nickel or button to 2 ft. deep! Woohoo!

And what do you mean that the PI machines will be "far more expensive" than the minelab FBS machines? There are various FBS machines (explorers, sov, excals, etc...) that cost more than some used PI (pulse) or nugget machines ...... ALL THE TIME. So how do you make such a general statement of the costs? It assumes that PI's are more expensive than FBS (coin/jewelry/relic) machines. Or assumes that the "deeper" = "more expensive".

You need to re-read what people here are telling you.

There is no shortage of people (like yourself) who have a spot in mind, and want to go "deepest" and have the "most sensitive" and say to themselves "I'm patient and am willing to dig all" (afterall, you never know what's deeper or hiding under that nail or whatever). So they post a question like yours.

So the technical answer to your question is: go get yourself a minelab nugget machines, and you'll dig BB's and birdshot TILL YOUR ARMS FALL OFF. And you'll do it at incredible depths (what more could you ask for?) And then in short order, you'll discover that .... perhaps ...... you ARE willing to sacrifice a little of that fabled PI depth, in order to reject some of the commonly recurring iron items that exist everywhere man has ever lived. Doh!

 

[Frankn]

I think Toms point is do you really need the extreme dept and sensitivity. I kind of agree with him. When you walk along the beach, you get a signal and just scoop. Usually one or two scoops and on to the next. Your not going to China on the beach. Also the recovery is so quick that you can scoop all targets. That is just why I use the Surfmaster PI. You can pick up a used one for a very reasonable price and it works in all types of sand. Now as for turf, the picture changes. Here you want some idea of what it is and how deep it is to make a decision of if you want to dig. That is why I use my old XLT. It tells me everything I need to know to make the dig decision. But you have to remember the target ID is just the detectors best guess and is fallible. Frank...

 

[bigscoop]

And we've not even addressed, "soil". Not all soil is the same, just another reason why the answer seek isn't all that simple.

 

[doc-d]

Great discussion, thank ya'll

 

[Keppy]

Well you really didn't say what target you were after so I will base this answer your statement, small target, down deep. Here it is. Get a PI detector. It will go the deepest for small objects. Frank...

View attachment 807262

........Frankn..Is right on for that you want a PI detector..........

 

[Got Metal?]

got-metal, you say:

"Sounds like a PI detector would fit the bill"

I suppose you are basing this conclusion on what Frankn and others have said (about "all-metal" and "deepest", etc...)? If so, sure! go have a ball. Get a pulse (like ones used for the beach) and "dig all". And yes, you "will not miss anything" as others here have said. And yes you will "dig all". You will go deep and be able to tackle the nastiest of minerals. Woohoo! what more could you ask for .... RIGHT!?? In fact, why stop there?? You want to go REALLY DEEP ? Go get yourself a Minelab nugget hunter machine. And I guarantee you you will not miss anything. And can get a nickel or button to 2 ft. deep! Woohoo!

What's wrong with that? If that's what I am wiling to do, so what? My conclusion is based on some basic internet research and various forums. I am no expert, as a matter of fact, I know very little and am in the process of educating myself. Based on what I have read, PI machines tend to detect deeper signals.

And what do you mean that the PI machines will be "far more expensive" than the minelab FBS machines? There are various FBS machines (explorers, sov, excals, etc...) that cost more than some used PI (pulse) or nugget machines ...... ALL THE TIME. So how do you make such a general statement of the costs? It assumes that PI's are more expensive than FBS (coin/jewelry/relic) machines. Or assumes that the "deeper" = "more expensive".

I said CAN be more expensive. I was thinking about the Minelab GPX series when I was writing that. Also, comparing a new item to a used item is a moot point. I know there are other less expensive PI machines out there as well, some much cheaper than the higher end Minelab FBS machines. Anyway, my statement was pretty clear. Your stated assumption that deeper is more expensive is simply your own.

You need to re-read what people here are telling you.

There is no shortage of people (like yourself) who have a spot in mind, and want to go "deepest" and have the "most sensitive" and say to themselves "I'm patient and am willing to dig all" (afterall, you never know what's deeper or hiding under that nail or whatever). So they post a question like yours.

So the technical answer to your question is: go get yourself a minelab nugget machines, and you'll dig BB's and birdshot TILL YOUR ARMS FALL OFF. And you'll do it at incredible depths (what more could you ask for?) And then in short order, you'll discover that .... perhaps ...... you ARE willing to sacrifice a little of that fabled PI depth, in order to reject some of the commonly recurring iron items that exist everywhere man has ever lived. Doh!

I have no spot in mind at all actually. Maybe a general idea, like a field that hasn't seen much recent activity. Somewhere that I would hope didn't have a lot modern trash. Maybe it doesn't even exist, I have no idea. Maybe I just like digging holes? What does it really matter? You seem a little too sensitive about the possibility of the PI having a slight edge over the VLF technology with respect to target depth.

Honestly, it wasn't that complicated of a question. If someone wanted the most sensitive detector in SOIL with no concern for discrimination what would one use?