Does the detector exist that does equally well on water and land?

[trueTreasure]

Hi all. I'm new totally new to the forum and mostly new to MDing, and I hope this doesn't annoy everyone as being a totally newb type question unworthy of response. It's just that, well...I am a newb.

I've been borrowing a relatives Spectrum XLT here and there over the past year or two and been out maybe a dozen times, mostly to parks, schools, etc. I've decided to make the jump and get my machine and, since I live near the Great Lakes, and also have some trips planned to the coast, I'd like to get a machine that can handle both shallow water/dry sand detecting, as well as MD inland. Does such a machine even exist?

I've been reading up on the Sand Shark which seems to get high marks, but wonder whether it could handle many inland sites given it's a PI machine. I'm sure there are probably a whole slew of things that aren't even on my radar screen. Any thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance your help.

 

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[doglover]

Take a look at Garretts new AT Pro. It is submersible up to 11 ft. under water and works well on land and water. You can hunt in a lake with it and when its raining since you don't have to worry about getting it wet. Has good target separation with a double d coil and 6 different operating modes. Has manuel and automatic ground balancing. Its hot on gold and also great for coin hunting. Since I've owned mine, I've found a gold bangle with it and a class ring. Brand new it runs about $600. I'm not a dealer or trying to sell you one but I would take a look at it if you want a unit that can operate on land and water equally well.

 

[Bart@Big Boys Hobbies]

I would look at Garrett AT Pro and Minelab Etrac and Safari. Holler If I can answer any questions or give ya better pricing!

 

[Smudge]

By "water" do you mean salt water or fresh water?

Vastly different environments.

 

[Lowbatts]

Being near the Great Lakes assumes you'll be looking at fresh water for the most part.

However "land" varies greatly on each side of Lake Michigan from the UP to the dunes in Holland and to the sand prairies of SW Chicagoland. But that's just one corner of the Great Lakes.

Never spent any time on PI machine, used a CZ20 myself for mixed environments and it has served me well to date.

I like the looks of the AT Pro but just have not seen one in action around here yet. Find some local detectorists and see what they are using to the best effect in your desired hunting areas.

 

[trueTreasure]

By "water" do you mean salt water or fresh water?

Vastly different environments.

Mostly fresh water (Lake Erie, Michigan or Huron) but I expect to take a couple of trips to the coast and my father is retired in Florida, so I'll be hitting the beach down there as well. Being utterly ignorant of the difference, can tell me how fresh water and salt differ? Thanks for your input.

 

[trueTreasure]

Thanks to everyone for the info so far. Doglover - thanks for the tip on the AT Pro, I'll look into it. Stoopstroop - I appreciate the 3 recommendations. The etrac is probably outside my budget right now, and possibly outside my skill set or understanding, but I'll take a look at the other two for sure. Lowbatts - Thanks for the mention of the differing environs just on Lake Mich. Without a doubt, it's something to consider. Talking to locals probably makes a lot of sense, except that I'm hoping to have a detector in hand by the time I hit that side of the state. Is the CZ 20 still offered by Fisher. It seems I've heard some good things about that detector before.

I'm wondering if ultimately, if and when you get serious about this "hobby," you don't end up having to either specialize (meaning you're pretty much either beach hunting, relic hunting, coin shooting, etc.), or you own machines that are intended for each different specialty. Just thinking that that may be the logical progression. Thanks again guys.

 

[Terry Soloman]

Thanks to everyone for the info so far. Doglover - thanks for the tip on the AT Pro, I'll look into it. Stoopstroop - I appreciate the 3 recommendations. The etrac is probably outside my budget right now, and possibly outside my skill set or understanding, but I'll take a look at the other two for sure. Lowbatts - Thanks for the mention of the differing environs just on Lake Mich. Without a doubt, it's something to consider. Talking to locals probably makes a lot of sense, except that I'm hoping to have a detector in hand by the time I hit that side of the state. Is the CZ 20 still offered by Fisher. It seems I've heard some good things about that detector before.

I'm wondering if ultimately, if and when you get serious about this "hobby," you don't end up having to either specialize (meaning you're pretty much either beach hunting, relic hunting, coin shooting, etc.), or you own machines that are intended for each different specialty. Just thinking that that may be the logical progression. Thanks again guys.

I would also consider Tesoro's fresh water VLF machine, the "Tiger Shark." I would say it is in the same range as the AT Pro, price wise, but it is also fully submersible to 200' and has a lifetime warranty. It is also probably heavier than the AT Pro, and is "hardwired," which means you buy either the 8" coil or the 10.5" coil. The Coil, Headphones, and control box are hardwired together, and do not come apart. The Tiger Shark is meant for freshwater use - not saltwater, where the "Sand Shark," a Pulse Induction unit, rules.

I started as a nuggetshooter, looking for gold in the Arizona mountains and deserts back in the late 1970s. Now I hunt farm fields, playgrounds, schools, and my new favorite - the beach! I am a FIRM believer in a VLF and a PI for the beach. Guys that buy a hybrid VLF at $1,400.00, in my opinion, don't have the best equipment for the job, and miss deeper treasure I find with the PI in the wet sand and surf. More importantly, my VLF gets the same or better depth in the dry sand, and I have TWO machines for LESS than they paid for one. Hmm...

 

[lookindown]

The AT pro is a killer freshwater machine, works fine in saltwater(Florida beaches), and is a great light weight land detector. You can get a new one for $500.

 

[Smudge]

By "water" do you mean salt water or fresh water?

Vastly different environments.

Mostly fresh water (Lake Erie, Michigan or Huron) but I expect to take a couple of trips to the coast and my father is retired in Florida, so I'll be hitting the beach down there as well. Being utterly --deleted-- of the difference, can tell me how fresh water and salt differ? Thanks for your input.

Salt water, due to its salt content, is highly mineralized and tends to deeply affect single frequency VLF detectors. Some VLF detectors, like the AT Pro and the Tiger Shark, do their best to compensate for this, but the best they can do is clear up some of the false signalling, but depth is less than good.

To get a truly effective salt beach machine, you need to look at dual frequency or multi-frequency detectors. Those cost considerably more money. You can also look at pulse induction detectors which are not fazed by ground mineralization, but they do not offer any discrimination, so you cannot knock out little chunks or iron and wire. It will hit on everything.

 

[trueTreasure]

Thanks, Terry. I'll be sure to check out the Tiger Shark. You've confirmed my suspicion that the differing environments require 2 different machines. In fact, based on what Smudge has added, it sounds like it's best to use one kind for fresh water and another for salt. Maybe the question should have read 'Do you have to use a special kind of MD in salt water,' but then if you're going to go shallow water in fresh, does that require a water machine as well?

Anyway, I can already see where this is going - having to explain to my wife why I have buy more than one MD. Maybe if I come back with a nice piece of jewelry for her she'd return my house key. Thanks again to everyone that gave input.

 

[Frankn]

The salt in salt water drives some detectors crazy. The black sand has the same effect. If you dig every target I would say get a PI detector. They are not affected by the above elements. There are no bells and whistles on PI detectors. They are raw power. I have pulled out gold rings on the beach deeper than 10" with a good signal. My 10 year old Whites Surfmaster PI has only 2 knobs, sensitivy and pulse delay and they both are usually set to the presets. If you like to spend your time fooling with the knobs or buttons and watching the screen look for something else. Frank

 

[trueTreasure]

The salt in salt water drives some detectors crazy. The black sand has the same effect. If you dig every target I would say get a PI detector. They are not affected by the above elements. There are no bells and whistles on PI detectors. They are raw power. I have pulled out gold rings on the beach deeper than 10" with a good signal. My 10 year old Whites Surfmaster PI has only 2 knobs, sensitivy and pulse delay and they both are usually set to the presets. If you like to spend your time fooling with the knobs or buttons and watching the screen look for something else. Frank

What about fresh water, Frank? Because of my proximity to the Great Lakes I'll spend more of my time at fresh water beaches. Is a PI detector as necessary, or even as usable in that case? As I said, I anticipate making some trips to the coast but wonder if investing in a PI for intermittent trips makes sense. I'll seriously consider though if my odds of success would really be that much better.

And no, I'm not such a gadget guy that I'd like having more knobs and buttons to play with and a screen watch. Thanks for the info.

 

[trueTreasure]

Not to short a --deleted--strorm, but a used White's MXT will suit you well for around 500.00.
Remember the MXT was built around a gold machine and has a gold/prosprecting setting.
You will want to used the smaller coil ( I used the 5.3"and a scoop.
Also (my trick) fill a small bag of sand ond rubber band it to the to of the coil, removing just enough sand to give it neutral buoyancy,as the coil will want to float a bit. (check the sand first, some sand wil have a magnetic signature)
Also, son't get the box wet, keep it dry, but the rest is waterproff.

You're not going to strike it rich, but i have pulled gold that way.

You're not going to strike it rich!?! Forget it then. Actually, I look at this as an expense to do something I enjoy - being outdoors - and adding the chance to find something of either historic or monetary value. The mystery of what might be found I guess entices me. If it ends up paying for itself that's just icing on the cake.

I'll take a look at the MXT. But not having the box waterproof (and knowing what a clutz I can be at times) scares me. Plus the idea of having to counter weight the coil sounds like a hassle. But I will check it out since the price is right. Thanks.

 

[lookindown]

Have you ruled out the ATpro?

 

[trueTreasure]

Have you ruled out the ATpro?

No, I haven't really had the time to rule anything in or out at this point. I will say that among those detectors I've been looking into, it has more equivocal reviews than any of the others. Meaning, amongst other things, that this is probably a subject for another thread. That is, "How do you know if reviews are legitimate, or the product of someone with a vested interest in either affirming or denying a particular brand's or machine's capability?"

I'll let you know what I end up going with. Thanks again for trying to direct the directionless.

 

[luvsdux]

Just to help clarify a couple of points. The VLF machines - tiger Shark, Garrett AT Pro etc. are fine in fresh water, but often have difficulties in salt water. On the other hand the PI machines that do very well in salt water do not have any discrimination capabilities so they respond to every bobby pin, nail etc. and are generally pretty deep which can be a pain with the junk targets. I have a Tiger Shark and it works quite well on dry land as well as in the fresh water, has a manual ground balance to balance it to whatever soil you're hunting, and discrimination. It is rather heavy unless belt mounted which is easy and is plenty sensitive to coins etc. I have several different detectors, but If water detecting was very important to me and I could only have one detector, I'd keep the Tiger Shark and use it both for water hunting and coin shooting. My two bits.
luvsdux

 

[George (MN)]

The Garrett AT Pro should do fine on land or in fresh water to 10 feet depth. It can ground balance to salt, but some say falsing required turning down the sensitivity to 5. So it won't be the deepest on a salt beach or in salt water. So many people living in FL including many retirees & many tourists detecting. Of course everybody hopes the ocean will wash up a gold dubloon LOL. Probably grassy areas of FL parks would produce more. Best wishes, George (MN)

 

[Iron Patch]

The salt in salt water drives some detectors crazy. The black sand has the same effect. If you dig every target I would say get a PI detector. They are not affected by the above elements. There are no bells and whistles on PI detectors. They are raw power. I have pulled out gold rings on the beach deeper than 10" with a good signal. My 10 year old Whites Surfmaster PI has only 2 knobs, sensitivy and pulse delay and they both are usually set to the presets. If you like to spend your time fooling with the knobs or buttons and watching the screen look for something else. Frank

What about fresh water, Frank? Because of my proximity to the Great Lakes I'll spend more of my time at fresh water beaches. Is a PI detector as necessary, or even as usable in that case? As I said, I anticipate making some trips to the coast but wonder if investing in a PI for intermittent trips makes sense. I'll seriously consider though if my odds of success would really be that much better.

And no, I'm not such a gadget guy that I'd like having more knobs and buttons to play with and a screen watch. Thanks for the info.

I've seen this before.... someone who plans to hunt fresh water and automatically people ignore the best water detectors and suggest those that are able to work in fresh, but not in salt. The point being all water detectors will work good in fresh water but you are limited for salt water. Having that out of the way it then comes down to budget and taste. It reminds me of the people who call a detector with a screen a coin machine, and one without for relics. (clueless)

I would not buy a PI for fresh water unless your area is hunted very hard and targets are sparse and you need every edge possible. If you plan to make trips and hunt salt water a multi freq. is the way to go, but you can still use a "fresh water detector" but will probably need to be adjusted to the conditions and will not perform as well as a unit that can handle that type of environment. You don't need two detectors if you buy the right one.

 

[Dano Sverige]

Can't understand why the dealer mentioned the Etrac? It's not waterproof and very expensive to drop into water! I think he meant to say "Excal"?
That's my choice anyhow...the Excalibur II.
Wading,submerged,salt water, fresh water,wet sand,dry sand,fields, woods and parks....the Excal can do it all.